Wilde Sau, how to make it work ?

[BlindBat]

Hi all, small question.

I currently play the germans in the 700 turn BtR campaign. Doing allright so far, except that my nighfighters are absolutely horrid at intercepting stuff.
I understand that with window and jamming in effect, my radar intercepts will be really really limited, this appears to work, I very very rarely get a FuG intercept, but more recently get intercepts through the Flensburg radar detector (So I'm starting to convert my units to the Ju88C to benefit)

Of more interest to me is the Wilde Sau tactics. I've been trying a number of different tactics:

1) Intercepting bombers in the stream.
The normal intercept routine, assigning a gruppe to each bomber group I detect. This generally works very poorly, except as mentioned for the Ju88s.
There is also something strange with this. When I assign a group to intercept and they get close to their target, they split up into 2 plane sections, this is okay. However, from time to time, the group will split up, and then immediatly go on patrol right back to their home base, forcing me to reassign intercepts for some 15-16 sections pr group I put to intercept! Is this working as intended ? Its a bit of an interface hassle when it happens.

2) Search-light coorperation
I've noticed that any time a bomber group flies over a heavily defended site (be it their target or not), they'll of course get coned by searchlights and fired at by the flak. If I have interceptors in the area, there's a reasonable chance that they'll see the illuminated bomber and make an attack. This works somewhat, but is highly dependent on the route the bombers take. If I see that they fly over a defended area, I try to station patrols in that area to do search-light coorperation.

3) Wilde Sau
The tactic I've had the least success with. When the bombers hit their target, and fires start, I try to have patrols orbiting the fires in order to find the bombers by the light of the burning city.
However, this seems to meet with an almost total lack of success. I get a few intercepts, but these are all directly linked to the search-lights from the city coning the bombers (intercepts always come directly after a bomber has been coned).
It seems to me to fail regardless of if I set the patrols above or below the altitude of the bombers, and regardless of what kinds of aircraft I use, single-engined or twin-engined.

So my question is: Is there any particular trick to making Wilde Sau work ? Should you not be able to find the bombers illuminated against the fires of the city ?

[Nicholas Bell]

I am in agreement with your tactics, results and analysis.  I've given up and converted them to JU-88 units and they are doing better than the other "normal" NJG - just using Tame Sau tactics.

In 30 or so major BC raids the normal losses are from zero to maybe 10 - and most are caused by crashes.  However, once BC lost almost 50 bombers - which is what one would expect - but more than 1 time in 30 raids.  I didn't do anything different, and it wasn't a full moon or anything.

In running some AI vs AI tests the LW often does much better than I ever see - as either player.

One of the old-timers - a beta tester - supposedly has the know-how on using the Wilde Sau.  Would be nice for him to chime in and give us all some tips.[:)]

[wernerpruckner]

Wilde Sau works, but it works best above bigger cities ( I use them around the Ruhr valley and around Bremerhafen/Hamburg).
You need well rested pilots for Wilde Sau, and if you are lucky you even get a few aces very fast.
Wilde Sau is easily preyed on by NIs because of their very short range, but you always can call them back before the NIs arrive.
 
During the first 60 or so turns, you need some luck to get Zahme Sau kills, most kills will happen above a burning city or spotlights......or moonlight nights.
 
Nick:

I am in agreement with your tactics, results and analysis.  I've given up and converted them to JU-88 units and they are doing better than the other "normal" NJG - just using Tame Sau tactics

stay with Wilde Sau and they will change to day fighters in 44.....if you change them to NFs you just have more NFs....and you will have more than enough of them.
 

[Hard Sarge]

1) Intercepting bombers in the stream.
The normal intercept routine, assigning a gruppe to each bomber group I detect. This generally works very poorly, except as mentioned for the Ju88s.
There is also something strange with this. When I assign a group to intercept and they get close to their target, they split up into 2 plane sections, this is okay. However, from time to time, the group will split up, and then immediatly go on patrol right back to their home base, forcing me to reassign intercepts for some 15-16 sections pr group I put to intercept! Is this working as intended ? Its a bit of an interface hassle when it happens.

this is part of the Jamming, losing radar lock, effect

when the planes lose lock, they return to patrol mode