Artillery support cap

[guctony]

Do we have a Cap on Artillery support. I mean considering all positive incentives like CPP, Commander levels, readiness, Assault HQ etc in Maximum level. How much of a number of guns or SU artillery units can be be brought together for a planned German assault. Is there different caps for defense and attack or for Germans and Soviets. Will attacking from 3 or more hexes with different corps attached units under same HQ can increase the numbers.

Since there is no longer on map artillery's brigades how players can imitate preparatory Artillery barrages of 1000 gun or more like the historical soviet Kiev Attack.

[loki100]

most of the commitment rules are very similar to the earlier games. No point repeating it here but see 23.6.1 for the basic rules (there are a number of situational elements to this and its, as ever, dependent on leadership rolls), 23.6.2 for the variation of the rules for the defender.

The Soviets still have on map artillery divisions (& rocket brigades) so you can mass those and quite easily get 5,000+ guns in an attack come 1944.

its only the artillery brigades that appear from early 1942 that are treated as off map SU. In my experience that makes them rather more useful than their equivalents in #1 who just tended to take up stacking slots with no real payback in terms of volume of artillery.

edit - there is no modelling of artillery only 'attacks' as in #1 this doesn't really work with the game scale/design. But artillery tends to hit at longer ranges so any disruptions etc caused have an effect all down the combat chain to the final result

[guctony]

ORIGINAL: loki100

most of the commitment rules are very similar to the earlier games. No point repeating it here but see 23.6.1 for the basic rules (there are a number of situational elements to this and its, as ever, dependent on leadership rolls), 23.6.2 for the variation of the rules for the defender.

The Soviets still have on map artillery divisions (& rocket brigades) so you can mass those and quite easily get 5,000+ guns in an attack come 1944.

its only the artillery brigades that appear from early 1942 that are treated as off map SU. In my experience that makes them rather more useful than their equivalents in #1 who just tended to take up stacking slots with no real payback in terms of volume of artillery.

edit - there is no modelling of artillery only 'attacks' as in #1 this doesn't really work with the game scale/design. But artillery tends to hit at longer ranges so any disruptions etc caused have an effect all down the combat chain to the final result

Thanks for the reply but I am more interested in fictional best case scenario. What could be the maximum best case scenario artillery barrage by SU. And Also Yes there is no Artillery barrage but In WITE you can attack by one division using Artillery divisions combined. This kinda simulate an artillery barrage in WITE. At least that's what I do most of the time.

[Sardaukar]

Well...9 infantry/mech/tank corps backed with 9 artillery/rocket divisions plus integral artillery is usually maximum one can realistically get together against one hex.

So that'd be pretty brutal.

[guctony]

ORIGINAL: guctony

ORIGINAL: loki100

most of the commitment rules are very similar to the earlier games. No point repeating it here but see 23.6.1 for the basic rules (there are a number of situational elements to this and its, as ever, dependent on leadership rolls), 23.6.2 for the variation of the rules for the defender.

The Soviets still have on map artillery divisions (& rocket brigades) so you can mass those and quite easily get 5,000+ guns in an attack come 1944.

its only the artillery brigades that appear from early 1942 that are treated as off map SU. In my experience that makes them rather more useful than their equivalents in #1 who just tended to take up stacking slots with no real payback in terms of volume of artillery.

edit - there is no modelling of artillery only 'attacks' as in #1 this doesn't really work with the game scale/design. But artillery tends to hit at longer ranges so any disruptions etc caused have an effect all down the combat chain to the final result

Thanks for the reply but I am more interested in fictional best case scenario. What could be the maximum best case scenario artillery barrage by SU. And Also Yes there is no Artillery barrage but In WITE you can attack by one division using Artillery divisions combined. This kinda simulate an artillery barrage in WITE. At least that's what I do most of the time.

That's what I do most of the time as it creates an echelon attack to German Strong points to reduce readiness an Fort levels before major attack. many Artillery divisions considerably helps single Soviet divisions in terms of reducing losses.

[guctony]

ORIGINAL: Sardaukar

Well...9 infantry corps backed with 9 artillery/rocket divisions plus integral artillery is usually maximum one can realistically get together against one hex.

So that'd be pretty brutal.

I guess if it used against Leningrad, Stalingrad or in Sevastopol it would not be considered gamey.

[Sardaukar]

ORIGINAL: guctony

ORIGINAL: Sardaukar

Well...9 infantry corps backed with 9 artillery/rocket divisions plus integral artillery is usually maximum one can realistically get together against one hex.

So that'd be pretty brutal.

I guess if it used against Leningrad, Stalingrad or in Sevastopol it would not be considered gamey.

It's not gamey, since maxing the stacking would cause problems for second echelon to exploit breakthroughs, since they'd be blocked. You could totally smash defender in that hex and be unable to advance more than into that hex...so it's trade off, sort of.

[guctony]

ORIGINAL: Sardaukar

ORIGINAL: guctony

ORIGINAL: Sardaukar

Well...9 infantry corps backed with 9 artillery/rocket divisions plus integral artillery is usually maximum one can realistically get together against one hex.

So that'd be pretty brutal.

I guess if it used against Leningrad, Stalingrad or in Sevastopol it would not be considered gamey.

It's not gamey, since maxing the stacking would cause problems for second echelon to exploit breakthroughs, since they'd be blocked. You could totally smash defender in that hex and be unable to advance more than into that hex...so it's trade off, sort of.

Its mostly for breaking in to city hexes where there in no mobile warfare and proper advanced planning is possible as city hexes cant run a way. One or two mobile division on the reserve could be enough to occupy afterwards . But with city fortress and movement point loss in fighting hex it has to be tested I guess.

Maybe there should be additional rules to increase cost of moving true a fighting hex when it is also full of units.

It also works with Soviets in late war scenarios where Germans don't really have the guts to abandons well developed Fortress hexes due to Hitler syndrome or benefit of fort hexes is too hard to leave.

[loki100]

the rules for support unit allocation are different for city hexes

[guctony]

ORIGINAL: loki100

the rules for support unit allocation are different for city hexes

Thanks good to know. I am waiting for 25th I will print the Manuel and keep it on my bedside.