Recon Tanks!

[Q-Ball]

Comrades!

The T-60 in game terms is a pretty crappy tank, with it's thin armor and puny gun; the main purpose seems to be to run-up AFV kill counts.

The problem is that it's in the TOE of many units from 8/41, including all Sep. Tank Regts and Tank Brigades. You can't build those units to full strength without them, which can have an impact on UNREADY status

It's been a few years, but I do recall that the engine will substitute LIGHT/AMPHIB/CAV tanks if not enough RECON are available; do I remember that correctly, or am I wrong there?

In general, what happens to the LIGHT and CAV tanks once all the Mech and Tank Divs disband (which are the last units that really call for those types)?

T-26 and BTs aren't anything special either and also die in droves, but at least the 45mm gun has a chance to take something out before the crew goes to the Socialist Paradise in the sky

Comments?

[Wiedrock]

The problem is that it's in the TOE of many units from 8/41, including all Sep. Tank Regts and Tank Brigades. You can't build those units to full strength without them, which can have an impact on UNREADY status

There is an Tank Brigade TOE in game which gets 64 of those T-60 into the TOE (09/41), but the TOE was rather quickly amended to only contain 32, in game it is 38 (TOE 10/41), not sure why (Soviet accounting leaves 6 tanks open [67-22(T-34)-32(T-60)-7(KV)=6 left]...). Due to how the 09/41 - 10/41TOEs change you end up with several turns of missing tanks/lower TOEs, that's true.

On August 23, 1941, a resolution of GKO instead of tank divisions began the formation of individual tank brigades. In the state No. 010/75-010/83, it consisted of a tank regiment of a three-captain, a motorized rifle battalion and four separate companies. Of the state of 93 tanks, 22 were thirty -four. However, on September 13, 1941, by order of the NPO of the USSR No. 0354, a new state No. 010/87 of the tank brigade was introduced, according to which the tank regiment consisted of two battalions, and the number of tanks was reduced to 67 due to light tanks, while the T-34 number remained the same.

Not sure about the "separate regiments" if that's alright, the page I quoted says regiments (separate) were set up only from 09/1942, so there must be something more about it, I do nto have the knowledge to speak on that.

It's been a few years, but I do recall that the engine will substitute LIGHT/AMPHIB/CAV tanks if not enough RECON are available; do I remember that correctly, or am I wrong there?

The Recon Tanks like the T-60 get substituted by
#1: Amphibious Tank
#2: Light Tank

In general, what happens to the LIGHT and CAV tanks once all the Mech and Tank Divs disband (which are the last units that really call for those types)?

Generally Soviets just switched from Divisions to Brigades for their mot/mech/arm units. Those Brigades then were combined into Corps (often). So you will still have a need for them.

TOEs and the amount of tanks in those TOEs that include (I hope my spreadsheet-automation for searching such info works correct ):

Soviet Cavalry Tanks (BT-2,7,5):

Code: Select all

2096	41a	Tank Division							26		
2097	41b	Tank Division							9		62
2205	41	Mechanized Division							244		
2229	41a	Cavalry Division					32				
2235	41	Mountain Cavalry Division									16
2378	41a	NKVD Motorized Rifle Division									33

Soviet Light Tanks (T-26, T-50):

Code: Select all

2096	41a	Tank Division					22		
2097	41b	Tank Division					62		
2166	41	Mixed Light Tank Battalion							27
2200	41	Motorized Rifle Division					54		
2344	41b Far East	Rifle Division					54		
2345	41c Far East	Rifle Division					18		
2365	41 8th Hanko	Rifle Brigade					16		
2379	41b	NKVD Motorized Rifle Division					40		

Soviet Recon Tanks (T-60, T-70, Stuart) are:

Code: Select all

2081	42	Guards Tank Corps
2081	42	Guards Tank Corps							63		
2082	43a	Guards Tank Corps							63		
2086	42a	Tank Corps					60				
2087	42b	Tank Corps					63				
2088	43a	Tank Corps							63		
2093	42b LL	Tank Corps					48				
2099	41a	Tank Brigade					64				
2100	41b	Tank Brigade					38				
2101	42a	Tank Brigade					16				
2102	42b	Tank Brigade					21				
2103	43a	Tank Brigade							21		
2106	42a British LL	Tank Brigade					16				
2109	42a American LL	Tank Brigade									16
2110	42b American LL	Tank Brigade									21
2111	43a American LL	Tank Brigade									21
2121	44	Light SU Brigade							3		
2135	41	Separate Tank Regiment					31				
2136	42	Separate Tank Regiment							16		
2137	43	Separate Tank Regiment							7		
2161	41	Separate Tank Battalion					20				
2162	42	Separate Tank Battalion					20				
2163	43	Separate Tank Battalion							10		
2181	42	Guards Mechanized Corps							69		
2182	43	Guards Mechanized Corps							42		
2183	44	Guards Mechanized Corps							21		
2189	42	Mechanized Corps							69		
2190	43	Mechanized Corps							42		
2191	44	Mechanized Corps							21		
2202	42	Mechanized Brigade							16		
2203	43	Mechanized Brigade							7		
2216	42	Guards Cavalry Corps							30		
2217	43	Guards Cavalry Corps							21		
2221	42	Cavalry Corps							30		
2222	43	Cavalry Corps							21		
2226	42	Guards Cavalry Division							10		
2227	43	Guards Cavalry Division							7		
2232	42	Cavalry Division							10		
2233	43	Cavalry Division							7		
2242	42	Motorcycle Regiment					3				

T-26 and BTs aren't anything special either and also die in droves, but at least the 45mm gun has a chance to take something out before the crew goes to the Socialist Paradise in the sky

All Soviet Tanks die in droves, somehow you have to lose ~20k each year or your garages will be full.

[DrHiramTemple]

Comrades!

In general, what happens to the LIGHT and CAV tanks once all the Mech and Tank Divs disband (which are the last units that really call for those types)?

On the cav tanks in particular, they can serve as substitutes for medium tanks, so they should get sent out again once you start to run short on t-34s/lend lease tanks.

There are also a handful of the motorized rifle/nkvd divisions that don't convert or disband, so those will continue to use a few obsolete tanks as well.

I once sketched out a chart of all the possible substitutions in game, but it was pretty messy and i think there's been some changes since i made it anyways. It's visible in the editor if you select edit unit types under the elements section, fwiw.

[Q-Ball]

Thank you Comrades for your reply! As Uncle Joe says, "Every forum comment in service of Soviet Victory is a blow against the Fascists!".....or something like that?

It did confirm that the engine finds a use for old tanks to fill out TOEs...