Matrix Games Forums

Offering a refund is certainly the right thing to do.  I'll be willing to take another look at the game after a couple of patches and the detailed manual are out.  Getting past the idea of North being to the left will be my problem at that point.  It boggles the mind that any real world map would be made that way.

I tend to look at the world in terms of what it should be and not what it is ...

Yes, I think this is the crux of the issue between the two opposing camps in this thread. I understand your position, I just don't agree with it.

Those of us who are giving AGEOD the benefit of the doubt are doing so because they came clean and admitted that they "screwed the pooch". From my understanding of the explanation from the Italian development team who actually coded the game, the major problem with the game, the "big freeze", was a compatibility issue with certain CPU's....something that the beta testers missed because nobody was using those particular CPU's.

If you take that "show stopper" problem out of the release, it probably would've been your typical first release with assorted bugs that would be resolved with the usual patches.

I test software for a living, so I'm familiar with this type of situation. It takes a lot of time and capital to be able to do all the testing you want to do. Consequently, nobody ever seems to get enough testing in before the decision is made to release the product. Much of the time, the decision to release the game is made because of other "business" reasons.

I'm not condoning releasing software to meet a deadline when it has known "show stopper" defects. But it seems to me in this case that the show stopper was missed due to incomplete hardware testing coverage. I can certainly understand how that happens. It's very expensive to test every conceivable hardware combination.

ORIGINAL: Slick Wilhelm

Those of us who are giving AGEOD the benefit of the doubt are doing so because they came clean and admitted that they "screwed the pooch". From my understanding of the explanation from the Italian development team who actually coded the game, the major problem with the game, the "big freeze", was a compatibility issue with certain CPU's....something that the beta testers missed because nobody was using those particular CPU's.

I'm glad AGEOD is doing the right thing and I'm keeping my eye on this game.

One thing that sometimes amazes me is when beta testers aren't chosen well at all. Definitely the case, here, since there's only two possible processor manufacturers out there. Did all the testers have similar computers? That's not good. There needs to be a wide range of specs for testing. [:-]

Had I known it is developed by an Italian team, I'd have never bought it......No, I'm not joking AND I'm Italian.

I'm amazed at the number of folks expressing surprise and dismay that a new game is buggy.  Aren't they all?  I can't recall a single game by ANY company that hasn't had problems with the first release.  I made it my policy 10 YEARS AGO not to buy any computer game (wargames, sims, sports, whatever) until at least a year after it is first released.  (For Silent Hunter III, I actually waited almost three years).   The only exception is where the game is based on a previous design (e.g. a new Squad Battles title from HPS Simulations). 
 
It's never a question of whether a new game is buggy.  Rather, it's a question of HOW buggy the game is.  AGEOD's "World War One" apparently falls into the very buggy category.  But people should not be shocked that the initial version has problems.  It's that way with all games and has been for a long time. 

ORIGINAL: HanBarca

Had I known it is developed by an Italian team, I'd have never bought it......No, I'm not joking AND I'm Italian.

Well, they can't make helicopter transmissions, trains or ammunition, why should they be able to make computer games?[8|]

Well lets how this puppy gets a patch next week or I'm afraid that I will have to take them up on their honrouable mention of a refund. I take Matrix games is honouring this refund also correct?

Had I known it is developed by an Italian team, I'd have never bought it......No, I'm not joking AND I'm Italian.

I had similar thoughts.

I did not post them because it would have made me sound like a bit of a bigot.

ORIGINAL: ETF
I take Matrix games is honouring this refund also correct?

Yes, we'll honor it as well.

ORIGINAL: sterckxe

ORIGINAL: Stwa

ORIGINAL: sterckxe



Actually that standard clause is totally bogus and is totally trumped by European Union consumer laws anyway. The thing is that nobody takes a games developer to court, with all the costs/time involved in doing so, if the most you can get in damages is the price of the game itself.

That's right, it would be like trying to sue Pizza hut for a couple of lousy pizzas. But, if you could prove substantial psychological damages (shouldn't be too tough), then maybe you could drain a little cash out of em. [:D]

I don't know about other countries but "moral damages" awarded by courts over here are usually for the substantial amount of 1 euro - no kidding - as to other kinds of damage : you'll have to prove a) actual damage and b) a causal link between that damage and the product. In the case of Pizza hut their lawyer would probably claim you were insane *before* you went and got a pizza there ... and win the case [;)]

Greetz,

Eddy Sterckx

No doubt. Here's you ONE Euro. Dont' blow it all at the same place.

Actually though, the last time Pizza Hut was sued here in the states, their attorneys were able to introduce 30 large combination pizzas into evidence during the trial. It would be an understatement to say that when this occurred, the trial ground to a halt. [:D]

ORIGINAL: HanBarca

Had I known it is developed by an Italian team, I'd have never bought it......No, I'm not joking AND I'm Italian.

Ah ,another Italian shameful of its kin ... I can understand that, they actually voted for Berlusconi [8|]! I'm from an Italian father, btw.

But here the reality is the Italian guy in the team is the lead programmer (that made GI before), and blaming its genes for the problems is gross (berlusconian ? [:'(])

I know Italians better than you [8|]

ORIGINAL: PDiFolco


Ah ,another Italian shameful of its kin ... I can understand that, they actually voted for Berlusconi [8|]! I'm from an Italian father, btw.

You will hardly find an italian who's proud to be italian in Italy...and this has nothing to do with Berlusconi who is no better or worse than those who preceded him since the birth of the "republic".

Ask your father to go here: http://www.report.rai.it/R2_HPprogramma/0,,243,00.html
Have him watch the video report called "Mare Nostrum".

Sorry for the digression, this is no place for politics, i know, but i thought it good to have Di Falco's father bless the day he left Italy (which is coming for me too). [:)]

Yeah sure, maybe descendency from Italian emigrants have a more romantic view of Italy, the ancient pride of the great Roman Empire, and so on...
Indeed my father's family left Italy in the late 50s out of poverty and no good future coming in the Abruzzi region.
But even if the country is in shambles, there still may be some talented programmers, artists, fashionists, and cooks in Italy ! [:'(]

Guys.

Anyone with experience with AGEOD knows that they are a top-tier gaming design outfit. The Devs are responsive to problems, and fixes come in an unbelievably short time frame. All you have to do is visit their boards, and you'll see this.

As for WWI, the vast majority of the known issues have been corrected with the 1.04 patch. Another patch will be coming in December to add some enhancements.

Wow -- what an active thread! My 2-cents ---

-- I don't like games that are released too early, however....

-- I can't count the times this has happened before where I spent my money, and the company basically left me to select the largest hammer and pile of sand I could find and invited me to pound sand to my heart's content. So, I am pleased the company has assumed responsibility.

-- And..., I actually do want the game rather than my money back. So, if the company is willing to fix and improve the product, I am willing to hang in there.

Finally, let us remember how small a fishbowl we are swimming in. How many companies are out there spending green money on developing historical computer-based wargames, caring enough to polish them beyond 1995 video standards, developing passable (at times even challenging AI's), and standing behind what they sell until they get it right? Not many. No, we do not "owe" our support to bad companies with bad products, but AGEOD's track record to date clearly separates them from that crowd.

Again, my 2-cents....

- P