Communique from AGEOD on World War One Status

[Erik Rutins]

********* Official Communique 11/13 ******************

Dear Purchasers of AGEOD's WWI,

For those who do not already know me, my name is Philippe Thibaut, General Manager of AGEOD. I wish to make a brief announcement on behalf AGEOD regarding our just released title, WWI.

WW1: La Grande Guerre is an extremely ambitious game, based on a very rich and sophisticated set of rules. It was developed by a third-party team based in Italy. The engine is not same one which drives BOA, AACW, NCP, WIA, and ultimately VGN. WWI was produced with a vastly improved version of the same engine which was first used to develop the game, Great Invasions.

Some of you are experiencing various problems (freezes, CTDs, bugs, unclear rules, and/or a lack of adequate documentation). I am deeply sorry for these problems. However, I am absolutely certain that these problems will all be completely resolved to your ultimate satisfaction. Please accept my personal apologies for any inconvenience and disappointment. Luca Cammisa, head of the Italian team, is working around the clock to correct any and all issues. I have many years of experience working with Luca. He and his team are very talented, and I have full confidence in them.

The plan is to get out the first patch as quickly as possible to address stability and hardware compatibility issues. A second patch should follow in a few weeks which will address the most serious game play bugs. Beyond that, as there have always been for our games, there will be further patches until the game realizes its full and ultimate potential. Finally, we are aware that the initial game manual is inadequate and that providing a copy of the board game rules for download is no substitute. Concurrent with coding and testing, we are working on a complete and comprehensive manual.

AGEOD has always strived to be an ambitious industry leader when it comes to history oriented strategy/wargaming. Quite a few of our games have received awards and wide spread acclaim. Ambition has driven us to raise the bar with each new game. However, no company can continuously push the edge of the envelope without occasionally stumbling as has happened here. Modeling the "War to End All Wars" and one of the greatest conflicts of the last century was an epic undertaking. Despite some humbling initial problems, we assure you that AGEOD is up to the task. Ultimately, WWI will be no less of a masterpiece than any of our other titles.

We appreciate everyones' understanding, patience, and loyal patronage. We have been as open and transparent as possible about this situation. However, we would never seek to impose on or exploit our customers' good will. Therefore, we fully understand and accept that some of you might prefer not to wait until all remaining issues with WWI are addressed. So for those who are not satisfied with WWI as it now stands and prefer not to wait for patches, we are ready to reimburse your purchase price.

Please know that ultimately what AGEOD values most as a business is our reputation for quality and customer service along with happy customers who feel that they have received full value for their hard earned dollars or euros. Even if you should choose to return the game, we hope you will still consider yourself part of the AGEOD family. You will always be welcome here to discuss our products with us and guide us to realize games that are only bounded by your and our imaginations. Thank you.

Philippe Thibaut

General Manager, AGEOD




***********************************************************

[ETF]

Appreciate the update...........pity though the product was know to have some many problems but yet was released anyways. I'm sure it will no doubt be a great game so for the time being I will look at the pretty map [;)] 

[JudgeDredd]

WOW...good to go.
 
'tis a shame the game has been marred in it's release, but you have to give them their dues...a refund is a pretty good offer from a company nowadays.
 
Kudos...and I WILL be getting it...just after the problems have been ironed out. [&o]

[GBS]

I too was/am planing on purchasing later. I have become highly skeptical of new issue war games. Anyway, this should be a jamup game by end of January.

[TheGreatRadish]

Well, that's very fair.

I really want the game actually and if I had the cash I would buy it today, regardless of the problems discussed. Unfortunately, the costs of roof repairs, car servicing and some other things I've had to pay for in the last month means I can't get it just at the moment. But I'm even more keen now.

[Lascar]

AGEOD has always held to a high standard of integrity and this gesture confirms it. I haven't bought WWI yet but intend to do so once the majors bugs are ironed out.

Meanwhile I continue to enjoy Frank Hunter's Guns of August which Frank continues to polish and improve.

[SlickWilhelm]

Wow, this kind of apology and transparency is almost unheard of in the gaming industry. I think I'll buy the game after all, just because I want to support a company that is not above admitting when they make a mistake. So many companies could learn a lot about customer service by this single act of doing right by your customers.

[therockyfroggy]

It's funny when people post that they will buy a game which has issues and no indepth manual just because the company posts that they will refund people who want one.

Personally, I will probably buy the game because I love boardgame and most boardgame conversions and any super duper in depth game is a thumbs up from me. I'll wait a bit though. [;)]

[z1812]

Hi All,

How refreshing to read an honest and sincere statement from a gaming company..................actually from any company. I do not have this game although I am interested in it. Certainly this explanation and offer of a refund to those dissatisfied is a breath of fresh air. I think it fair to say they will generate a lot of goodwill through this.

Regards John

[mariandavid]

I also will puchase - promises and statements like these indicate a dedication to a product that is sadly lacking elsewhere. Apart from that I have long been searching for a game with the depth and detail of 'War in the Pacific'

[tevans6220]

I think some people are losing sight of the big picture here. Had the game not been released in such a sorry state there would have been no need for PhilThib (Ageod) to make such a statement. This game was definately released too soon and in an incomplete state. Praising them for admitting it seems a little odd to me.

[Hanal]

ORIGINAL: tevans6220

I think some people are losing sight of the big picture here. Had the game not been released in such a sorry state there would have been no need for PhilThib (Ageod) to make such a statement. This game was definately released too soon and in an incomplete state. Praising them for admitting it seems a little odd to me.

I think alot of people would have appreciated a similiar statement from companies like PARADOX who released games like Diplomacy, and lest we forget, Hearts of Iron I was alot worse than this game when it was first released. Obviously, individuals such as yourself can never be satisfied by whatever anyone does, but that is your problem...[8|]

[tevans6220]

ORIGINAL: J P Falcon

ORIGINAL: tevans6220

I think some people are losing sight of the big picture here. Had the game not been released in such a sorry state there would have been no need for PhilThib (Ageod) to make such a statement. This game was definately released too soon and in an incomplete state. Praising them for admitting it seems a little odd to me.

I think alot of people would have appreciated a similiar statement from companies like PARADOX who released games like Diplomacy, and lest we forget, Hearts of Iron I was alot worse than this game when it was first released. Obviously, individuals such as yourself can never be satisfied by whatever anyone does, but that is your problem...[8|]

It has nothing to do with being satisfied. It's called accountability. There are consequences to actions. Sorry to disappoint you but I'm not going to heap praise on a company that knowingly and willingly releases a bad product and then makes a statement apologizing for it and assuring that they will rectify the problem. I would expect nothing less. Minor bugs and design flaws are on thing. This game crashes, locks up and doesn't even come with proper documentation. PhilThib fully admits it but that doesn't make it right or okay. Is it okay for me to rob you and keep your money just because I say I'm sorry. Offering refunds seems like a classy move but if they didn't, it would be perpetuating a fraud. They knowingly and willingly sold and released a game that basically doesn't work. They even sold preorders. I like PhilThib, Pocus and Ageod. I own and play a lot their games (BOA, WIA, ACW, NCP) but that doesn't mean I think they walk on water. I call 'em as I see 'em.

On a personal note, I'm glad that you have the infinite wisdom to make personal judgements on people you don't know. You don't even know me and yet you were to see that I have a problem with never being satisfied. I'm humbled and I bow to you. Here's a bit of advice. Keep your wiseass observations to yourself because you come off as a condescending asshole. It might get you into trouble someday. Like I said, I call 'em as I see 'em. Don't like it? Tough!!

[Adam Parker]

ORIGINAL: tevans6220

I think some people are losing sight of the big picture here. Had the game not been released in such a sorry state there would have been no need for PhilThib (Ageod) to make such a statement. This game was definately released too soon and in an incomplete state. Praising them for admitting it seems a little odd to me.

FINALLY someone with a brain, commonsense and the capacity to think for themselves! [&o]

This "communique" from AGEOD is not a message of benevolence but one protecting their legal backside.

It does not appear that AGEOD's games carry the standard clause against their software warranteeing correct performance. Instead their warranty states that in the event of any defect they will swap their product within 3 months. As a swap for broken code is impossible, their warranty then assures a refund.

AGEOD had might as well have written "we refer dissatisfied customer to their warranty protection guaranteed not by us but by law".

I count roughly 30 pledges of support for AGEOD on their WW1 Communique thread.

Marketing Rule of Thumb:

"Unhappy customers will share their dissatisfaction with between 8 to 16 people".

Let's hope AGEOD only made 30 sales for their sake...

[DBeves]

ORIGINAL: Adam Parker

ORIGINAL: tevans6220

I think some people are losing sight of the big picture here. Had the game not been released in such a sorry state there would have been no need for PhilThib (Ageod) to make such a statement. This game was definately released too soon and in an incomplete state. Praising them for admitting it seems a little odd to me.

FINALLY someone with a brain, commonsense and the capacity to think for themselves! [&o]

This "communique" from AGEOD is not a message of benevolence but one protecting their legal backside.

It does not appear that AGEOD's games carry the standard clause against their software warranteeing correct performance. Instead their warranty states that in the event of any defect they will swap their product within 3 months. As a swap for broken code is impossible, their warranty then assures a refund.

AGEOD had might as well have written "we refer dissatisfied customer to their warranty protection guaranteed not by us but by law".

I count roughly 30 pledges of support for AGEOD on their WW1 Communique thread.

Marketing Rule of Thumb:

"Unhappy customers will share their dissatisfaction with between 8 to 16 people".

Let's hope AGEOD only made 30 sales for their sake...

Here Here mate...

That is exactly the point ...

A refund for an obviously broken product should be the rule and not the exception..

Power to AGEOD for making the promise but they should have eaten humble pie and admitted the game was not ready for release rather than trying to make some silly deadline.

I must also say that what is conspicuous by its absence however in the statement from AGEOD is exactly how I would go about getting a refund ... perhaps they can make it clear ?

Also - does this apply to people who bought from matrix ?

What I also fail to understand is that why ... following such an earth shattering statement from the producers of the product as to its quality - matrix are still offering it for sale ?

[Terminus]

ORIGINAL: tevans6220

I think some people are losing sight of the big picture here. Had the game not been released in such a sorry state there would have been no need for PhilThib (Ageod) to make such a statement. This game was definately released too soon and in an incomplete state. Praising them for admitting it seems a little odd to me.

Agreed. AGEOD have really screwed the pooch on this one, and they should hang their heads in abject shame.

[sterckxe]

ORIGINAL: DBeves
What I also fail to understand is that why ... following such an earth shattering statement from the producers of the product as to its quality - matrix are still offering it for sale ?

Because at this point in time you're basically given the option of getting your money back or trusting AGEod to put things right through patches. Given their good reputation as to patches thus far, I don't think a lot of people will actually take them up on the refund proposition, but will put the game on the backburner for now awaiting patches to fix things.

What I can't understand is why AGEod is taking flak over their refund offer. Zeus knows I can name at least two other titles from two other publishers this year which were released in a state *more* deplorable than this game and no refund was ever offered there.

AGEod did the honourable thing here : admitting they screwed up by pushing this title out the door too soon to make the artificial deadline of 11/11 and making an offer *everyone* should be pleased about.

Greetz,

Eddy Sterckx

[DBeves]

ORIGINAL: sterckxe

ORIGINAL: DBeves
What I also fail to understand is that why ... following such an earth shattering statement from the producers of the product as to its quality - matrix are still offering it for sale ?

Because at this point in time you're basically given the option of getting your money back or trusting AGEod to put things right through patches. Given their good reputation as to patches thus far, I don't think a lot of people will actually take them up on the refund proposition, but will put the game on the backburner for now awaiting patches to fix things.

What I can't understand is why AGEod is taking flak over their refund offer. Zeus knows I can name at least two other titles from two other publishers this year which were released in a state *more* deplorable than this game and no refund was ever offered there.

AGEod did the honourable thing here : admitting they screwed up by pushing this title out the door too soon to make the artificial deadline of 11/11 and making an offer *everyone* should be pleased about.

Greetz,

Eddy Sterckx

No - I think you miss my point ... If I bought a car and four days later all the wheels fell off then I would have a right in law to get my money back... The product fails to do what it states it does.

Now games will be a matter of taste - and likes or dislikes should never be cause for a refund - but when the thing plain fails to simply work ... I should have just as much right for my money back... I dont think AGEOD are getting beaten up for making their offer - they are getting beaten up for releasing an unfit product - the point being made above is that given the obviously known state of their product and the fact they took peoples money for it a refund is what they should have done - I dont think they should be getting plaudits - as they are on their forum - for implementing what should be a basic consumer right. the fact other companies dont do the same doesnt alter that fact....

[balenami1291]

Im Angelo from italy I NEVER played an AGEOD's Game.

I have no direct interest or business with ageod.

I follow this game and its forums since this summer.

Excuse my bad english..
I hope I can hurt no one with my words.
If some words sound wrong is only my bad english.
I deeply respect this comunity.

Please, you should consider

1) AGEOD is french. European & U.S.A laws are pretty diffferent.
European Customers are less protected than amercicans.
In Europe, "Refund option" really sounds different than in U.S.A.

2) The game suffers 2 different kinds of problems.
a) the game was released 11/11/08 at 11.00 o'clock.
Exatly 90 years after the end of war.
It's clear, and AGEOD dosn't hide this, Was made a great effort to resperct this date. A patch was planned to release just after the gamers begin to play it. the manual will follow the same strange path . ATM you can play with a very small manual and you help yourself with the boargame rules dowladable from AGEOD forum. So fast als possible you'll receive the (fully) manual of the Videogame.

b) A nasty problem regards HW compatibiltywith AI. AGEOD admits no Beta testers intercepts this issue. They are work night and day to understand and fix it.

So they planned 2 diferent patch:

1 They realese the firsrt one so fast as possible to fix incopatibility.
2 Around at the end of ther month, they'll release a patch to fix and enhanced the vanilla verision.


I think since we (customers) spend regular money we should receive a regular game.

But in Europe we need to remember wath was WWI. I really think a realese at 11/11 was no only a marketing issue.

About AI incompatibilty I think everyone can make a mistake.
before we fire this game, we should think this is a very ambitious and difficoult project with a small market's niche of fans.

Again, Excuse my bad english.

Angelo

[Terminus]

Oh please, of course it was marketing. AGEOD made a conscious decision, for the sake of their sales, to release this game on 11/11. Don't think it was anything else. It wouldn't have been a problem if they'd released a finished product, but they didn't.

And I'm pretty sure that consumer protection in Europe is a lot better than in the US.