Mines

[krb3]

When a port lists it has Defensive Mines, what does that mean exactly? What are they good for if you can't load onto a minelayer? Also, is it possible to know in advance how many mines are available at a port for mine laying?

[Ostwindflak]

It is telling you how many mines are placed around the harbor already. Mine layers just have to resupply from the port to get more mines to lay.

[btd64]

Those are mines that are laid at the base for defense. Not what is in the pool. I have never tried looking for a pool of available mines. I just load them and deploy....GP

[Anachro]

Mines in a city are ones already laid down for its defense. You can definitely check the pool of available mines (as well as their production rate). You can also even set a specific mine to stockpile, which will prevent them being loaded by ships until you want them to be (by removing stockpile designation).

1. Go to your intelligence screen and click "Industry/Troops/Resource Pool" in the bottom-right corner.



2. In the next screen, click "All Device Types" to exclude everything and then click "Mine." There is also a Stockpile option on the right. Y for Yes and N for No.

[krb3]

Tanks for the help. I've uploaded pic of my industry/troops/resource pool "Mines". Says I had some in pool. How do I get them to any port I want, say Pearl or Sydney for example.

[Oberst_Klink]

ORIGINAL: krb3

Tanks for the help. I've uploaded pic of my industry/troops/resource pool "Mines". Says I had some in pool. How do I get them to any port I want, say Pearl or Sydney for example.

You can deploy mines with CM type ships and submarines (if they have the capacity to load them). You simply create a Mine Laying TF/mission at a port that supports just that. I forgot what the requirements are, e.g. port size and the amount of supplies available there. Mines will be loaded from the pool directly to the assigned ships/subs.



Klink, Oberst

[crsutton]

Yes, it is a lot easier than it looks. As long as your capable ship or sub is in a large enough port with sufficient supply you can load mines. Create a mine laying TF or mine laying sub TF and then just click replenish from port and the ship will load mines as well as needed ammo and fuel. You do not have to ship mines to a port. The supply is global as long as you meet the requirements and have mines in your pools.

But note that mines are a limited resource and you should watch your pools carefully. Some early war mines (Dutch for example) have only what is in the pools at start and you get no more. Some other types (American Mk 10) go out of production. You can burn through them pretty fast. Also ML types ships will reload mines while disbanded if in a large enough port. You have to set the stockpile key to yes if you don't want all your mines to disappear. This way you can control what ships will get them. Or just make sure the CM and DM types of ships are disbanded in small ports if you do not want them to reload.

In 1943 you will get mines that can be dropped by air. Most any Allied bomber of two engines or more can be assigned to drop them via the city attack menu.

[BBfanboy]

ORIGINAL: crsutton

Yes, it is a lot easier than it looks. As long as your capable ship or sub is in a large enough port with sufficient supply you can load mines. Create a mine laying TF or mine laying sub TF and then just click replenish from port and the ship will load mines as well as needed ammo and fuel. You do not have to ship mines to a port. The supply is global as long as you meet the requirements and have mines in your pools.

But note that mines are a limited resource and you should watch your pools carefully. Some early war mines (Dutch for example) have only what is in the pools at start and you get no more. Some other types (American Mk 10) go out of production. You can burn through them pretty fast. Also ML types ships will reload mines while disbanded if in a large enough port. You have to set the stockpile key to yes if you don't want all your mines to disappear. This way you can control what ships will get them. Or just make sure the CM and DM types of ships are disbanded in small ports if you do not want them to reload.

In 1943 you will get mines that can be dropped by air. Most any Allied bomber of two engines or more can be assigned to drop them via the city attack menu.

A few more pointers on the ML TF. When you create it and load mines the TF is usually set to "do not lay mines" to prevent them being deployed immediately where you loaded them. You can set a target hex and then click on the text to change it to "Lay Mines". The ML TF will then head to that area and try to lay the mines at night. If the trip is more than one day it will adjust its movement to ensure it arrives at the target at night. It will retire at maximum speed as soon as it has laid its mines.

Note 1- set your TF "Routing" to Direct/Absolute so the TF does not balk at approaching an enemy base that has a few bombers.
Note 2 - if the ML TF bumps into an enemy TF (even a cargo one with no warships) or is actually attacked by aircraft it will abort the mission and RTB. If it arrives at home base with "Lay Mines" still set it will drop them at the home port harbour!


For this reason I usually leave the unloading instructions at "Do Not Lay Mines" until it is within range of the target hex and will be able to lay the mines there next turn. Only then do I select "Lay Mines". If the target hex for the mines is one of my own bases, I change the ML TF home port to that base and leave the unload instruction as "Lay Mines".

[Anthropoid]

The key point: mines do not have to BE in a port for them to be loaded into a TF, they simply have to BE in the "pool," and then they are available to any port that has the capacity to load mines.

"Supply" in this instance abstracts "mines," but it also abstracts a lot of other things, including: "torpedoes, bombs, av gas, bullets, artillery shells, beans, hot sauce, medicine, spare radio batteries, toilet paper, tents, etc., etc."

Think of "1" unit of supply as one ton including: a proportional quantities of anything that might be needed by a WWII era military force (either naval, air or land) and which is not otherwise represented as a resource that must be moved around the map.

ADDIT: also, not sure about Allies but for Japanese there are quite a few different ships that can load mines and deploy them there is a table in the manual that seems fairly accurate. Best thing I've found is to just fiddle around and see which ones I can get to load up mines in the larger ports with plenty of supply.

[BBfanboy]

ORIGINAL: Anthropoid

The key point: mines do not have to BE in a port for them to be loaded into a TF, they simply have to BE in the "pool," and then they are available to any port that has the capacity to load mines.

"Supply" in this instance abstracts "mines," but it also abstracts a lot of other things, including: "torpedoes, bombs, av gas, bullets, artillery shells, beans, hot sauce, medicine, spare radio batteries, toilet paper, tents, etc., etc."

Think of "1" unit of supply as one ton including: a proportional quantities of anything that might be needed by a WWII era military force (either naval, air or land) and which is not otherwise represented as a resource that must be moved around the map.

ADDIT: also, not sure about Allies but for Japanese there are quite a few different ships that can load mines and deploy them there is a table in the manual that seems fairly accurate. Best thing I've found is to just fiddle around and see which ones I can get to load up mines in the larger ports with plenty of supply.

Or you can just look at the individual ship screen and if it has a weapon slot for mines it can carry at least one type.

The Rearm table for mines (amongst other things):

[Anthropoid]

One other pointer (possibly inaccurate, not sure): having skimmed various threads over the years, I have the sense that there is a functional difference between:

(a) a port with 100 mines deployed, which were all deployed at once, i.e., in one packet of 100; and
(b) a port with 100 mines deployed, which are deployed in ten packets of 10, even assuming that all ten packets were deployed on the same date.

Supposedly, many small packets are "more resistant" to mitigation/nullification by the enemy (meaning the mines are "swept" away, else the minefield is mapped and subsequently avoided). Assuming this is true, deploying mines in smaller packets is a more effective gambit. I'll leave it at that as some of these other guys probably know better than me and may be able to clarify/correct.

[BBfanboy]

ORIGINAL: Anthropoid

One other pointer (possibly inaccurate, not sure): having skimmed various threads over the years, I have the sense that there is a functional difference between:

(a) a port with 100 mines deployed, which were all deployed at once, i.e., in one packet of 100; and
(b) a port with 100 mines deployed, which are deployed in ten packets of 10, even assuming that all ten packets were deployed on the same date.

Supposedly, many small packets are "more resistant" to mitigation/nullification by the enemy (meaning the mines are "swept" away, else the minefield is mapped and subsequently avoided). Assuming this is true, deploying mines in smaller packets is a more effective gambit. I'll leave it at that as some of these other guys probably know better than me and may be able to clarify/correct.

Not sure how the AI would treat several minefields of the same type laid at the same place and date, it might lump them together.

Otherwise, what you say about splitting the minefield into several is true- if the enemy finds one it does not find the others.

However the AI calculations for probability of a hit may use the number of mines in the minefield (not the total in the hex) and if it is a non-linear probability with a doubling of the mine count equating to more than doubling of the probability of a hit, there is an advantage to having a larger field.

I have had good luck with two fields of around 150 mines but have not experimented with the numbers enough to say what is optimum. I think that the optimum layout should remain an unknown to the players anyway, just to keep the tension up.

[rustysi]

If it arrives at home base with "Lay Mines" still set it will drop them at the home port harbour!
For this reason I usually leave the unloading instructions at "Do Not Lay Mines" until it is within range of the target hex and will be able to lay the mines there next turn.

Interesting. Thanks.

[crsutton]

ORIGINAL: rustysi

If it arrives at home base with "Lay Mines" still set it will drop them at the home port harbour!
For this reason I usually leave the unloading instructions at "Do Not Lay Mines" until it is within range of the target hex and will be able to lay the mines there next turn.

Interesting. Thanks.

Likewise if you "set" a destination in mid ocean and have "lay mines" set your ship will lay mines in mid ocean. Done a bit of cursing over that one.