Razing the Reich

[Michael T]

This will be a periodical AAR in a similar format to my previous reports. I am Soviet and Pelton Axis. We have agreed to a return game after this game completes.

Alt 41CG scenario
Server game
Locked HQ Support
Non Random Weather
Full FOW

House Rules

No Para drops to break pockets or cut rail lines past 8 hexes from front( before moves).
No bombing of air bases more than 3 times a turn (after turn 1).
No bombing of HQ's when not stacked with combat units.
No landing west of S-Pol before 43.

I have received Pelton's turn 1. His turn one is pretty stock standard for him. He took out Riga and crossed the Daugava. In the Center a little conservative I thought in that he has no contact with Minsk so several units that I usually trap can escape. The usual Lvov pocket in the south but not to the extent I do. But overall a good, safe and solid opening move by Pelton.

He only took out 1700 a/c but I noted he has run several re-fuelling missions with level bombers and I am encountering a higher proportion of interdiction attacks, but on the main they do little damage and little if any reduction in MP.

My aims are the same as I stated in the game against glvaca. I won't be burning 100 AP moving AA units this time
Lake Janis stop line will be attempted again.
Maps coming when turn 2 is done.

[schascha]

Good luck

[76mm]

This should be interesting.

Are you going to repeat your "run-for-the=hills" strategy from your game vs glvaca? It is a shame that that game seems to have ended prematurely.

[Michael T]

Yes running will be the norm for the first half of the summer, bar Leningrad. Yes I am very dissapointed in the glvaca game. Perhaps he will return some day and we can resume it.

[Manstein63]

Michael,
You will need to plan your moves very carefully methinks. Pelton will probably only need one mistake on your part to unhinge you especially if you are going to be doing a full Sir Robinavitch.
Good Luck I will be watching this one very closely
Manstein63

[Flaviusx]

Pelton has fallen in love with a right hook maneuver to deal with Leningrad, and is making it work. Watch out for that. The defensive scheme you're using (and it is pretty much the same one I use) is designed to deal with a direct advance to the city itself to force the Neva ASAP. It may not work as well against an end run south of Lake Ilmen. Worse yet, the Axis has enough maneuverability to threaten you both north and south of Lake Ilmen and it's very hard to cover both approaches at once. Covering the direct approach is difficult enough.

[bwheatley]

ORIGINAL: Flaviusx

Pelton has fallen in love with a right hook maneuver to deal with Leningrad, and is making it work. Watch out for that. The defensive scheme you're using (and it is pretty much the same one I use) is designed to deal with a direct advance to the city itself to force the Neva ASAP. It may not work as well against an end run south of Lake Ilmen. Worse yet, the Axis has enough maneuverability to threaten you both north and south of Lake Ilmen and it's very hard to cover both approaches at once. Covering the direct approach is difficult enough.

Yea that's how abulbulian always liked to captured leningrad by right hook past ilmen. Isolating Leningrad into a slow death.

[hfarrish]

ORIGINAL: Flaviusx

Pelton has fallen in love with a right hook maneuver to deal with Leningrad, and is making it work. Watch out for that. The defensive scheme you're using (and it is pretty much the same one I use) is designed to deal with a direct advance to the city itself to force the Neva ASAP. It may not work as well against an end run south of Lake Ilmen. Worse yet, the Axis has enough maneuverability to threaten you both north and south of Lake Ilmen and it's very hard to cover both approaches at once. Covering the direct approach is difficult enough.

Based on my current Pelton game (where he did exactly that to me) my conclusion was that there wasn't much I could have done to stop it - you are better off guarding against a move to the South and not making a serious effort to hold the right hook. You have to guard against the direct advance in any case, and extra units thrown to try to stop an HQBU right hook are probably just extra pocket fodder. Not saying do nothing, but I wouldn't but a major effort into holding it.

[bigbaba]

normaly right hook is easier to defend then the direct attack on leningrad. the terrain provides great defensive CV to the russian units, the german flanks and supply route gets longer and longer and as soon he notices that pelton is going right he can thin the defense of leningrad and throw more stuff to the russian left flank east of novogrod.

but pelton isn't a normal player.[:)]

[hfarrish]

I guess it depends on play style...if you are fighting forward (i.e. not trying to build defensive belts to the rear) then it could work since you'd have the requisite units to play with - but these days that is a pretty high risk strategem.

[Flaviusx]

ORIGINAL: bigbaba

normaly right hook is easier to defend then the direct attack on leningrad. the terrain provides great defensive CV to the russian units, the german flanks and supply route gets longer and longer and as soon he notices that pelton is going right he can thin the defense of leningrad and throw more stuff to the russian left flank east of novogrod.

but pelton isn't a normal player.[:)]

Yeah, against anybody else I don't take this right hook seriously. But he somehow is making it work. Mostly due to the game's silly logistics. Pelton knows how to abuse it. (So does Michael, for that matter.)

[Speedysteve]

Yes. Chain HQ buildups make the right hook possible in a quicker than normal timeframe = less issue for
Supply and less time for the SU player to get set.....

[Michael T]

After a narrow escape in the game against glvaca I will be adjusting my alignments around Leningrad. The game is with Pelton again.

[mmarquo]

Michael --> remember to use the reserve function...

[Farfarer61]

ORIGINAL: bigbaba

normaly right hook is easier to defend then the direct attack on leningrad. the terrain provides great defensive CV to the russian units, the german flanks and supply route gets longer and longer and as soon he notices that pelton is going right he can thin the defense of leningrad and throw more stuff to the russian left flank east of novogrod.

but pelton isn't a normal player.[:)]

[Putting on my Axis player hat] None of us are normal players anymore

[Michael T]

End Soviet T2.

It would appear that Pelton is going all out for Leningrad. He has sent at least 7 Pz and 5 Mot Div's to Pskov and surrounds. Things look grim for Leningrad. But I will try to hold on for as long as I can. The flip side is that there is much less pressure on the central front. So no great retreat is required there yet. In the south we run.

Pelton seems more interested in gaining ground than in destroying Red Army units at this stage. I sense his strategy is based on taking out Leningrad very quickly and then redeploying for a huge charge on Moscow. In the south he was content to push as far forward as possible and ignored a bunch of Russians West of Kiev he could have cut off. I rail them out.

I have not had the rail cap in this game to evac as much ARM Ind as I did in the glvaca game (Kiev, Mogilev and Kremenchug on T2). I only got Kiev ARM out as I have had to use lots more rail cap on moving troops to the far north to defend the approaches to Leningrad.

When we get there it will be very interesting for me to compare where this game is at T10 and the game against glvaca at T10.

[HITMAN202]

Looks like your Sec units are going to cause him grief in AGN by slowing down his direct approach to Pskov. Could you show your division loses each turn ??

[hfarrish]

I would recommend putting a stronger garrison in Odessa - the extra counters won't make a difference elsewhere and you stand good chance of (a) getting cheap wins against Axis Allies; (b) tying up decent German infantry formations once he realizes he needs them and (c) if you are lucky and keep motorized forces there, getting a chance to cut a rail line.

[Flaviusx]

Don't bother to evacuate until turn 3. It's perfectly fine to spend all your cap on troop transfers on turn 2, and get your reserve armies in place. (With whatever is left over from that, I get out some stuff from Leningrad.)

Furthermore, none of those places you evacuated are essential. I actually write all of them off, although I'm tempted to rail out the 4 HI from Kiev on turn 3 now just to give myself a bit of a cushion, and while rail cap is still very high. You really don't need all those dinky ARM factories west of the Dnepr at all. Especially against Pelton, who still looks for opportunities to lock down factories, it's better to work further in the rear and deny him juicy targets. He's not as much of a factory raider now as he used to be, but if you're to slow to get out stuff, he'll chain his way right there in no time at all.

I'm interested to see how he approaches Leningrad. Direct or right hook? I think he'll go for the right hook. He's got more mech up there than necessary for the direct approach.

[hfarrish]

ORIGINAL: Flaviusx

Furthermore, none of those places you evacuated are essential. I actually write all of them off, although I'm tempted to rail out the 4 HI from Kiev on turn 3 now just to give myself a bit of a cushion, and while rail cap is still very high. You really don't need all those dinky ARM factories west of the Dnepr at all. Especially against Pelton, who still looks for opportunities to lock down factories, it's better to work further in the rear and deny him juicy targets. He's not as much of a factory raider now as he used to be, but if you're to slow to get out stuff, he'll chain his way right there in no time at all.

I think Pelton has pretty much backed off factories altogether - he has stated in our games (and you can see from his AARs) that he is almost ignoring them now; in my latest game he could have easily given me fits with Tula and simply didn't try very hard. His focus is on manpower and pockets, more the former than the latter.