Hyperdeny needs better counters late game

[rustyj]

I have a bit of an issue late game where I run many small AI fleets on Attack 50% fuel right across the map. This is necessary to counter the spamming of fleets by opposing factions (not a criticism, since it is a manageable situation). However, it is frustrating to see so many of those fleets end up hamstrung in systems with hyperdeny. I do not use them myself, because they seem to cause more problems than solutions.

Late game this cause snowballing effects on my already struggling computer system, because there can be up to 10 fleets at a time caught up in hyperdeny. On my system this means crashing, or nothing appears to move at all.

I have also many instances of my manual fleets pathing into systems with hyperdeny of friendly systems while on their way to another system. It can be game crippling. I usually end up using the editor to delete the installation.

My fleets late game are usually maxed out in bonuses, even the engines, and still end up being trapped.

I think there should be a rework of this mechanic, either provide an option to turn it off universally, or offer a genuine hyperdeny counter as part of existing components or a new component altogether. Other solutions could be to decrease the range of this base and reduce strength, or to be able to instruct fleets to avoid targets with range of hyperdeny.

PS. Yeh, I do mean hyperdeny. Sorry about the confusion. I have changed the topic header which I hope doesn't cause more confusion.

[fruitgnome]

If you mean hyperdeny, like I think. Cause I ony play with XL mod for a so long time, I can't say something to basic game. But puase the game and attack the base first, maybe also set attack point to that base. And go to galaxy view it gives better performance and wait till your fleet has destroyed that base. Thanks to infinite tech and different hyperdrives there are drives that counter more or less (especially in XL mod, try it it's great) hyperdeny. I love the hyperdeny mechanic. In XL mod there are infinite techs to strengthen hyperdeny and the counter part.

[boolybooly]

Maybe hyperdeny should not affect friendly fleets. Justification being it would be possible to communicate with space traffic control to get it shut off for the few seconds required, or alternatively project a bubble of hyper-allow onto the friendly ships trying to use hyper and have that track them out of or into the hyperdeny area, because scifi. I mean its nuts for commerce if freighters, liners and miners cant use hyper in system.

[rustyj]

If you mean hyperdeny, like I think. Cause I ony play with XL mod for a so long time, I can't say something to basic game. But puase the game and attack the base first, maybe also set attack point to that base. And go to galaxy view it gives better performance and wait till your fleet has destroyed that base. Thanks to infinite tech and different hyperdrives there are drives that counter more or less (especially in XL mod, try it it's great) hyperdeny. I love the hyperdeny mechanic. In XL mod there are infinite techs to strengthen hyperdeny and the counter part.

I take your point about the XL mod, but mods excluded, in vanilla game super engines and infinite tech doesn't seem to have an impact.

Naturally, I send in fleets to conquer, but a strategy of attacking systems where fleets are trapped is only useful up to a point. Against a faction of 120+ colonies it becomes a full time job, which can be counter productive if you are closely matched. Having to send multiple bombardment fleets and troop carriers to the furtherest corners of the map is not the best strategy for holding ground. I try for maintaining a contiguous battle front to keep control of conquered territory and denial of resources, except when I go specifically for research installations on important planets.

Late game, you might have five or six planets in a system with hyperdeny which means tying up many additional fleets for bombardment and invasion (because the hyperdeny fields are overlapping and fleets that you send in to conquer are essentially trapped until the whole system is conquered) before you can free the half dozen fleets already trapped. Now multiple this 10-20 times all happening concurrently.

[iancmtaylor]

You know you raise a good point. Even in DW1, hyperdeny felt too gamey, and so it is in DW2 as well.

Maybe what is needed is a cooldown. Or maybe it can only hold so much 'hyperdrive strength' at a time, and past that it only adds to the time to charge the hyperdrive. Or maybe it doesnt stop hypedrives at all, but doubles or triples, or quadruples the time to charge and jump.

Or maybe it is used as a function of the hyperdive stop and hyper drive insulation that are already in game, where if strength is 3x deny insulation, then it triples the time to jump.