Air to Air Combat trivia

Greyshaft · Post by **Greyshaft** » Mon Sep 05, 2005 10:02 pm

I was doing some research for Matrix MWif and came across this useless fact:

"The last propeller-driven fighter that will ever be able to claim aerial victories against propeller-driven aircraft of another nation is the Vought F4U-5 "Corsair." This event, of course, took place during the 1969 war between Honduras and neighboring El Salvador, at the hands of Honduran Major Soto. "

http://www.hrw.com/science/si-science/p ... twwii.html

Ross Moorhouse · Post by **Ross Moorhouse** » Tue Sep 06, 2005 12:43 am

Why is this useless? [:-] This was a very small and very quick war all started over a soccer match. Also very intresting that piston engine fighters where still doing combat this late after WWII.

Ross Moorhouse · Post by **Ross Moorhouse** » Tue Sep 06, 2005 1:24 am

Some links...

They had some very nice camo schemes for the F4U-5 too.

from http://math.fce.vutbr.cz/safarik/ACES/a ... -1969.html

http://www.acig.org/artman/publish/article_166.shtml list of Central & South American Air-to-Air Victories

bluemonday · Post by **bluemonday** » Tue Sep 06, 2005 3:26 am

ORIGINAL: Ross Moorhouse

Why is this useless?

Because knowing that the last propeller-driven aircraft to score an aerial combat victory not only gains you nothing, but doesn't even contribute to any further understanding of the Soccer War. (Great book by the same name by Kapuœciñski, btw.) It's just a useless fact. Moderately interesting, though.

Ross Moorhouse · Post by **Ross Moorhouse** » Tue Sep 06, 2005 4:26 am

ORIGINAL: bluemonday

ORIGINAL: Ross Moorhouse

Why is this useless?
Because knowing that the last propeller-driven aircraft to score an aerial combat victory not only gains you nothing, but doesn't even contribute to any further understanding of the Soccer War. (Great book by the same name by Kapuœciñski, btw.) It's just a useless fact. Moderately interesting, though.

Sorry but I can't understand the logic here. This is what historical research is all about. Following a trail of facts. In this case what was posted here can lead someone to dig deeper for more facts.

Greyshaft · Post by **Greyshaft** » Tue Sep 06, 2005 10:34 am

Hmmm... interesting path for this thread to take.

OK, its a fascinating, mind-blowing absolutely essential, World-Cup-Winning fact which I bet you didn't know!!!

Apart from that, can anyone prove that the Argentine Air Force ever flew Stukas either during or after WWII?

That's the fact I was looking for.

Ross Moorhouse · Post by **Ross Moorhouse** » Tue Sep 06, 2005 10:55 pm

ORIGINAL: Greyshaft

Hmmm... interesting path for this thread to take.

OK, its a fascinating, mind-blowing absolutely essential, World-Cup-Winning fact which I bet you didn't know!!!

I have known this for some years. [:)]

Sarge · Post by **Sarge** » Wed Sep 07, 2005 12:19 am

F4u-5 is not the only aircraft that seen action in the "Soccer" war. I think a couple of P51D's where in the mix [X(]

Ross Moorhouse · Post by **Ross Moorhouse** » Wed Sep 07, 2005 12:29 am

Bearcats where also used.

bluemonday · Post by **bluemonday** » Wed Sep 07, 2005 5:39 pm

ORIGINAL: Ross Moorhouse
Sorry but I can't understand the logic here. This is what historical research is all about. Following a trail of facts. In this case what was posted here can lead someone to dig deeper for more facts.

If you think that digging up irrelevant facts to encourage others to dig up facts is the point of historical scholarship, you are severely misinformed.

Ross Moorhouse · Post by **Ross Moorhouse** » Wed Sep 07, 2005 9:43 pm

ORIGINAL: bluemonday

ORIGINAL: Ross Moorhouse
Sorry but I can't understand the logic here. This is what historical research is all about. Following a trail of facts. In this case what was posted here can lead someone to dig deeper for more facts.
If you think that digging up irrelevant facts to encourage others to dig up facts is the point of historical scholarship, you are severely misinformed.

scholarship

So please do INFORM me, seeing as I am so severely misinformed.

See how Greyshaft posted what he thought was an irrelvant fact then promoted myself and Sarge to post some facts that others may not have known. Then Greyshaft posts what he is really after.

Apart from that, can anyone prove that the Argentine Air Force ever flew Stukas either during or after WWII?

That's the fact I was looking for.

Seems to me that this disproves your point of view. A point of view that you have not suppoted at all.

Also i didn't use the word "scholarship". You did. [:-]

watchtower · Post by **watchtower** » Wed Sep 07, 2005 9:59 pm

Great piece of Triv - I love It - more please - was the game abandoned? - was the ref straffed because he gave a dodgy offside decision? I have heard about a goalie being under a ton of ariel bombardment but....

watchtower · Post by **watchtower** » Wed Sep 07, 2005 10:03 pm

Also ... so thats why soccer pitches have dugouts for the managers!![:D]

Ross Moorhouse · Post by **Ross Moorhouse** » Wed Sep 07, 2005 10:11 pm

Seems that the "irrelevant facts" have encouraged someone else to be interested. [:D] I rest my case m'lord.

Greyshaft · Post by **Greyshaft** » Wed Sep 07, 2005 10:12 pm

Guys... this is a storm in a teacup.

If that original fact is relevent to you then you may define it as such with my blessing. I just found it while doing other research and thought it worth a post. Just because one person finds it relevant doesn't mean that it has to be relevent for everyone.

And that's a fact [:D]

RBWhite · Post by **RBWhite** » Wed Sep 07, 2005 10:17 pm

Greyshaft

I've been reseaching the Argentine Air force on and off since I read your post here.

The Argentine Air Force has flown a very wide array of aircraft from Europe & North America. But sofar I can't make any link to the Stuka.

I'll keep doing a little more research and see what comes up.

watchtower · Post by **watchtower** » Wed Sep 07, 2005 10:34 pm

This just the sort of stuff I for one feed off. There is always space for this kind of stuff here as far as I am concerned. Game related ( for some) and it's not OT or out as flamebait. Keep it comming. There is only 10 odd post a day at the mo in ther general forum anyway. And if members wanna spit at each other a mod is gonna point to vinnie & doggie anyways...........

Sarge · Post by **Sarge** » Thu Sep 08, 2005 12:00 am

ORIGINAL: Greyshaft

Guys... this is a storm in a teacup.

If that original fact is relevent to you then you may define it as such with my blessing. I just found it while doing other research and thought it worth a post. Just because one person finds it relevant doesn't mean that it has to be relevent for everyone.

And that's a fact [:D]

What [&:]

You put up a thread on military trivia on a wargaming forum,then start flamming members that replied with some images and other facts.

hmmm........... Bad day at work [:'(]

watchtower · Post by **watchtower** » Thu Sep 08, 2005 12:28 am

ORIGINAL: bluemonday

If you think that digging up irrelevant facts to encourage others to dig up facts is the point of historical scholarship, you are severely misinformed.

Sarge.. not sure where all got a bit *SNAFU* but I think this was the post that got my feathers ruffled - almost spilt me pot of Earl Grey... any post that starts with ' If you think...' and then a 'you' does not belong here... but then thats me ...anyone is free to shoot me down at Vinnie & doggies anytime[:D][:D]

RBWhite · Post by **RBWhite** » Thu Sep 08, 2005 1:13 am

Greyshaft

The only countries I found to have flown the Junkers Ju 87 Stuka are:

Bulgaria
Croatia
Germany
Hungary
Italy
Romainia

They were also flown during the 1936 - 1939 Spanish Civil War

The first Stukas were flown in 1935

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