Allied morale under Morale mod.

[tyronec]

We are on T98 of my game with Quantas.
Are playing with Morale +10 for Allied units.

I notice that the morale of many of the Allied units seems to be dropping for no reason that I can think of. Here is a cav unit, it has 10 wins and no losses. It has never been cut off and always been in good or moderate supply, and yet the morale is 6 points below the base value.
I just show the one unit as an example, there are many others that seem to have lower morale than I would expect.
Could it be something to do with the morale mod ?

T98Rom.jpg (53.97 KiB) Viewed 587 times

[AlbertN]

For all I know morale naturally drops for Axis forces (presumibly both but Soviets are lavished in supplies) during bad weather.
There is something about 'bad weather causes fatigue, and fatigue cause morale loss'.
Prolly just Fatigue suffices to cause morale loss to be honest. Be it by moving and attacking, or via inclement weather.

I signaled that long ago already as some Italian positioned in Odessa when the front was at Rostov dropped morale under 40 just by sitting in Odessa.
It will happen anyhow for any Axis unit across the board, some checks that sooner or later are bound to fail and the morale will drift down without suffering defeats.

[Joel Billings]

I got the last Soviet save and ran it into the German turn, and I saw two German units that were below the normal National Morale (NM without the 5 added in your game to Germans) lose a morale point. When I reran it, those two units didn't lose a point. Nothing unusual about those units, so I think it is always possible to lose morale due to die rolls and not get it back immediately. If there is an issue, there's no way to know for sure here without the programmer's running it through the debugger.

[tyronec]

This is the clause that seems to apply:

Each logistics phase there is chance that a unit can lose a morale point due
to fatigue. The higher the fatigue and the lower the morale of the unit, the
greater the chance that the unit must make a leader morale check to avoid
a morale loss.

However it should be countered by this one:

If the unit’s morale is below its national morale then it can recover as much as 10% of
the national morale but not more than the country’s national morale.

In my current game there does seem to be a lot of low morale for the Allied units, more than I can remember in games before the Morale mod.
Could it be that the the check for increasing morale is not taking into account the adjusted national morale ?


The median morale of my Rom Cav is 73 (base 75) and infantry 52 (base 55).
In an AI game for a similar stage of the game, with no morale mod; the median morale of Rom Cav is 66 (base 65) and infantry 51 (base 45).

So either I am doing something that is making their morale drop - and it is not fighting battles because the units in my game have better records than in the AI game OR something else is going on.

[tyronec]

I do think there is something not right here that has been caused by the morale mod.
Here is one of my Tiger units on T124.
All victories, it has always been under command of a good leader (when deployed), never low on supply.
There is another Tiger unit much the same.

I have never seen so many units going below national morale without defeats/isolation/supply shortage.

T124.jpg (41.36 KiB) Viewed 369 times

[Joel Billings]

I'll ask Pavel to look into this when he returns from vacation in 2-3 weeks, as there may be a place somewhere in the multiple places where morale is adjusted. However, it may prove very difficult for Pavel to find all the places where NM is checked to make sure that it is being calculated correctly (if that's even the problem here). I have your saves, but since we're looking to see why NM is not going up faster, it's always harder to find a reason why something is not happening.

[Joel Billings]

I ran some further tests, by sending a lot of the units below their NM to the rear and putting them in refit mode. I saw them move up to their NM (the adjusted NM, I saw the Romanian armored division gain from 71 to it's NM of 75 in one turn, but most units gained 1 morale point). So I don't necessarily see a problem here. Units that are in or near the front (especially on the front where they are taking attrition losses) aren't expected to rise to their NM unless they are winning battles. If you see someone in a good supply state in the rear, or in the reserve not coming up to their NM, then I'll look again if I have a save for that case I can run out. Speaking with Pavel, there's no easy way to look into this, so without a specific example I'm going to assume things are working as designed.

[Wiedrock]

However it should be countered by this one:

If the unit’s morale is below its national morale then it can recover as much as 10% of
the national morale but not more than the country’s national morale.

You forgot about the range I guess?

If the unit’s morale is below its national morale then it can recover as much as 10% of the national morale but not more than the country’s national morale. If the unit’s morale is below its national morale, or 50 (whichever is lowest), and it is more than 10 hexes away from the nearest enemy unit then it may gain between 0-2 morale points.

....or those two are meant additive....

[tyronec]

Thanks for looking into this Joel.