Pak40 - Production and Exports

[Wiedrock]

TLDR SUMMARY
The current production is way too large.
20001 Guns were produced in the towed variant.
About 1410 were exported. Without figuring out where the Exported guns were exported to, the production should be decreased from current 146 to 126! Or we figure out where the exports went and add those appropriately (120 to Bulgaria seem for sure).

OR (assuming the Pak40 also contains Pak41 numbers of 150pieces)

133 (with figuring exports)
127 (without figuring exports)

---

According to Wikipedia overall "23,303 Pak 40s were produced, and about 3,500 more were used to arm tank destroyers". Which I assume was used to generate the ingame numbers. But looking at the sources page (which is an awesome Source) shows that it has been edited long since then. The Source Wikipedia quotes nowadays (with proper calculations) gives a Quantity of 20001! I assume back then the page contained the totals (towed+SPG).

The game has a weekly production of 146 which means a total Production until T216 of 24323.
Until capitulation this means until week of 07.05.1944 151turns x 146=22046 - so there is a definitive surplus of more than 2000.

As I understand it everything fresh produced needed to first be "accepted" by the Waffenamt "WaA".
Using the Main Sources I have whole 1942 + 02-12/1943 + 02-12/1944, which match the numbers you can also see on this site we get 19625.
Now, 1945 seems mirky. So if we assume he got the numbers right, we get additional 102+270+123(assumed all towed)+100(guessed)+20(guessed May)=615.
So in total assumed Production of 19626+615=20241.
As said it's assumed/guessed and the 20001 of the other Source should definitely be more accurate then my guesses. So let's stick with this 20,001 figure.

Deliveries to foreign countries:
I think here there are many "missing", meaning they stay in German Pools instead of being sold to others.

Deliveries to Foreigners in main my source's notes:
Note: Reports are made with numbers from 01.Month1 and published on 15.Month2, so a February Report contains numbers from January (and so on). This may lead to "confusion" at times. I list Reports from March about Februar as March here!!!
Note: For some reason the 01/19XX reports are not contained in the NARAs I have.
01/43:...
02/43: It notes 36 delivered to entities "outside of the Army" and 37 to the Luftwaffe. Here and before it gets muddy/unclear. Stuff was not separately listed and there are a tons of notes about SP plannings and such.
03/43: 8
04/43: 61
05/43: 64
06/43: 68 (A note states that "July-Dec 1943 20 each month to Bulgaria". [1678/43; 17.06.1943])
07/43: 25 (A note states that "July-Dec 1943 20 each month to Bulgaria". [1678/43; 17.06.1943])
08/43: 25
09/43: 42 (A note states that "July-Dec 1943 20 each month to Bulgaria".)
10/43: 131
11/43: 95 (A note states that "July-Dec 1943 20 each month to Bulgaria".)
12/43: 62 (A note states that "July-Dec 1943 20 each month to Bulgaria".)
Total 1943: 581 (without January/February)
_________
01/44: UNKNOWN - overall 40 have been listed
02/44: 52
03/44: 147
04/44: 24
05/44: 82 (the list combining SP+towed gives 100, including the 18Marders to Slovakia)
06/44: 183
07/44: 96
08/44: 47
09/44: 163
10/44: 0
11/44: 0
12/44: 35
Total 1944: 829 (without January)
_____________________
TOTALS: 1410

The Panzerworld page gives 1385. Which is weird because summing up the exports also gives 1410 (and he even leaves out the "unclear" months - as I did - but he has numbers for all those unclear months at least - so rly weird).

currently ingame 366pieces are exported:
Finland "210" 01/1943+ (4/turn)
Hungary "106" 04/1944+
Italy "0" 12/1943+
Romania "50" 03/1943+
Bulgria "0" 04/1944+ →As the notes state, July→December 1943 each month 20 exported = 120.


So, taking those numbers Germany has a surplus of:
(1410exports)-(210+106+50)=1044 exports missing
20001 vs 22046(151turns x 146/week) → surplus of 2045
So a possible surplus of more than 3000guns available to Germany!

The corrected Production 20001/151turns=132,45=~132/turn.
The corrected Production removing foreign exports currently missing:
(20001-1044)/151turns=125.54=~126/turn

OR (assuming the Pak40 also contains Pak41 numbers of 150pieces)

133 (with figuring exports)
127 (without figuring exports)

[MechFO]

TLDR SUMMARY
The current production is way too large.
20001 Guns were produced in the towed variant.
About 1410 were exported. Without figuring out where the Exported guns were exported to, the production should be decreased from current 146 to 126! Or we figure out where the exports went and add those appropriately (120 to Bulgaria seem for sure).

OR (assuming the Pak40 also contains Pak41 numbers of 150pieces)

133 (with figuring exports)
127 (without figuring exports)

---

According to Wikipedia overall "23,303 Pak 40s were produced, and about 3,500 more were used to arm tank destroyers". Which I assume was used to generate the ingame numbers. But looking at the sources page (which is an awesome Source) shows that it has been edited long since then. The Source Wikipedia quotes nowadays (with proper calculations) gives a Quantity of 20001! I assume back then the page contained the totals (towed+SPG).

The game has a weekly production of 146 which means a total Production until T216 of 24323.
Until capitulation this means until week of 07.05.1944 151turns x 146=22046 - so there is a definitive surplus of more than 2000.

As I understand it everything fresh produced needed to first be "accepted" by the Waffenamt "WaA".
Using the Main Sources I have whole 1942 + 02-12/1943 + 02-12/1944, which match the numbers you can also see on this site we get 19625.
Now, 1945 seems mirky. So if we assume he got the numbers right, we get additional 102+270+123(assumed all towed)+100(guessed)+20(guessed May)=615.
So in total assumed Production of 19626+615=20241.
As said it's assumed/guessed and the 20001 of the other Source should definitely be more accurate then my guesses. So let's stick with this 20,001 figure.

Deliveries to foreign countries:
I think here there are many "missing", meaning they stay in German Pools instead of being sold to others.

Deliveries to Foreigners in main my source's notes:
Note: Reports are made with numbers from 01.Month1 and published on 15.Month2, so a February Report contains numbers from January (and so on). This may lead to "confusion" at times. I list Reports from March about Februar as March here!!!
Note: For some reason the 01/19XX reports are not contained in the NARAs I have.
01/43:...
02/43: It notes 36 delivered to entities "outside of the Army" and 37 to the Luftwaffe. Here and before it gets muddy/unclear. Stuff was not separately listed and there are a tons of notes about SP plannings and such.
03/43: 8
04/43: 61
05/43: 64
06/43: 68 (A note states that "July-Dec 1943 20 each month to Bulgaria". [1678/43; 17.06.1943])
07/43: 25 (A note states that "July-Dec 1943 20 each month to Bulgaria". [1678/43; 17.06.1943])
08/43: 25
09/43: 42 (A note states that "July-Dec 1943 20 each month to Bulgaria".)
10/43: 131
11/43: 95 (A note states that "July-Dec 1943 20 each month to Bulgaria".)
12/43: 62 (A note states that "July-Dec 1943 20 each month to Bulgaria".)
Total 1943: 581 (without January/February)
_________
01/44: UNKNOWN - overall 40 have been listed
02/44: 52
03/44: 147
04/44: 24
05/44: 82 (the list combining SP+towed gives 100, including the 18Marders to Slovakia)
06/44: 183
07/44: 96
08/44: 47
09/44: 163
10/44: 0
11/44: 0
12/44: 35
Total 1944: 829 (without January)
_____________________
TOTALS: 1410

The Panzerworld page gives 1385. Which is weird because summing up the exports also gives 1410 (and he even leaves out the "unclear" months - as I did - but he has numbers for all those unclear months at least - so rly weird).

currently ingame 366pieces are exported:
Finland "210" 01/1943+ (4/turn)
Hungary "106" 04/1944+
Italy "0" 12/1943+
Romania "50" 03/1943+
Bulgria "0" 04/1944+ →As the notes state, July→December 1943 each month 20 exported = 120.


So, taking those numbers Germany has a surplus of:
(1410exports)-(210+106+50)=1044 exports missing
20001 vs 22046(151turns x 146/week) → surplus of 2045
So a possible surplus of more than 3000guns available to Germany!

The corrected Production 20001/151turns=132,45=~132/turn.
The corrected Production removing foreign exports currently missing:
(20001-1044)/151turns=125.54=~126/turn

OR (assuming the Pak40 also contains Pak41 numbers of 150pieces)

133 (with figuring exports)
127 (without figuring exports)

Not sure all German production is averaged out over 151 turns as otherwise collapse is programmed in.

End of 1944= 151-17=134

19625+150(Pak41)-(1945 Production:102+270+123)=19280

19280/134=143

Most elegant way would be to put most of 43/44 production in 2-3 factories that can be lost whith territory.

[Wiedrock]

Not sure all German production is averaged out over 151 turns as otherwise collapse is programmed in.

Not all is. Its the number of turns for the production cycle for the Pak40. Start till end of war. So when the war ends by doing this you get the historic max and not 2k more being produced. What's after May 1945 is then surplus for alternate reality, which is fine.

End of 1944= 151-17=134

19625+150(Pak41)-(1945 Production:102+270+123)=19280

19280/134=143

I don't think using some arbitrary date in time during production cycle is a good way of doing it.
Just imagine you'd have the peak of production end of 1943 and then it was historically decided to reduce production to 20%. And now you take end of 1943 as a measure to create production for another 1.5years ending with thousands extra (waaaaaay more then historic) produced at wars end.

In your math. If you want to use the End of 1944 and 134turns(its actually 135) as a point you do not need to substract the 1945 production from what was produced until that point (since those figures are known exactly). That's how you'd get 146.48/turn.
When one does this you then would have a production cap needed to be added, being 20001, otherwise (as now in game) everything from February 1945 already is surplus.
AND You forget about the ~1k exports which seem unknown where they went so far.

Most elegant way would be to put most of 43/44 production in 2-3 factories that can be lost whith territory.

Elegant for sure .
But now adding Factories is out of the realm of doable...if it even works for guns....and where they would be listed in UI segments. The good thing is that you can downscale factories as you like tho.

Imo the only sensible way to reflect historic production is to have the game use a simple spreadsheet for weekly or monthly production figures you enter values in. This way every scenario creator for a certain period's production would not have to think about production at all and only about the starting pool/available when it is set up once properly.
But that's not what we have.

[MechFO]

Not sure all German production is averaged out over 151 turns as otherwise collapse is programmed in.

Not all is. Its the number of turns for the production cycle for the Pak40. Start till end of war. So when the war ends by doing this you get the historic max and not 2k more being produced. What's after May 1945 is then surplus for alternate reality, which is fine.

End of 1944= 151-17=134

19625+150(Pak41)-(1945 Production:102+270+123)=19280

19280/134=143

I don't think using some arbitrary date in time during production cycle is a good way of doing it.
Just imagine you'd have the peak of production end of 1943 and then it was historically decided to reduce production to 20%. And now you take end of 1943 as a measure to create production for another 1.5years ending with thousands extra (waaaaaay more then historic) produced at wars end.

In your math. If you want to use the End of 1944 and 134turns(its actually 135) as a point you do not need to substract the 1945 production from what was produced until that point (since those figures are known exactly). That's how you'd get 146.48/turn.
When one does this you then would have a production cap needed to be added, being 20001, otherwise (as now in game) everything from February 1945 already is surplus.
AND You forget about the ~1k exports which seem unknown where they went so far.

Most elegant way would be to put most of 43/44 production in 2-3 factories that can be lost whith territory.

Elegant for sure .
But now adding Factories is out of the realm of doable...if it even works for guns....and where they would be listed in UI segments. The good thing is that you can downscale factories as you like tho.

Imo the only sensible way to reflect historic production is to have the game use a simple spreadsheet for weekly or monthly production figures you enter values in. This way every scenario creator for a certain period's production would not have to think about production at all and only about the starting pool/available when it is set up once properly.
But that's not what we have.

The historic contraction of production that really set in with January 45 is somewhat jarring if one is still fighting in Eastern Poland in March or April.