Backhand method

[Metalist]

Hi all. I am playing against Soviet AI in a Stalingrad to Berlin scenario. As all rivers are frozen I am faced with Soviet attacks all around the front. In the screenshot below is a case. As you can see the enemy achieved some breakthroughs. I have 4 very powerful mobile divisions that I was hoping to keep intact up until summer to use in a Kursklike limited offensive. However it started to seem unlikely. Up until now, I tried to cover such local breakthroughs with whatever reserves I have but now I am under pressure in almost the whole front. So I think maybe I should change my approach and use what I read as "backhand method"*. I will retreat and allow enemy to gain ground, and as soon as it overextends make a counter-strike to encircle enemy forces. Kinda like what Manstein did in Third Battle of Kharkov. What do you think about this? What would you do in such a situation? I can possibly fill the gaps using SS divisions, but I might have to divide them, and that would amount to being unable to use them offensively further on.



*https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_Bat ... #Aftermath

[EwaldvonKleist]

Makes sense. AI+some advantageous difficulty settings is good at frontal grinding so by trying to maintain static frontlines you are playing its game. Temporarily weaken parts of the front, retreat there and use the freed forces in comcentrated counterattacks against bulges.

[tm1]

Hi all. I am playing against Soviet AI in a Stalingrad to Berlin scenario. As all rivers are frozen I am faced with Soviet attacks all around the front. In the screenshot below is a case. As you can see the enemy achieved some breakthroughs. I have 4 very powerful mobile divisions that I was hoping to keep intact up until summer to use in a Kursklike limited offensive. However it started to seem unlikely. Up until now, I tried to cover such local breakthroughs with whatever reserves I have but now I am under pressure in almost the whole front. So I think maybe I should change my approach and use what I read as "backhand method"*. I will retreat and allow enemy to gain ground, and as soon as it overextends make a counter-strike to encircle enemy forces. Kinda like what Manstein did in Third Battle of Kharkov. What do you think about this? What would you do in such a situation? I can possibly fill the gaps using SS divisions, but I might have to divide them, and that would amount to being unable to use them offensively further on.



*https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_Bat ... #Aftermath

What difficulty level do you the AI on ?, did you manage to break 6th Armee out of Stalingrad ? I am playing this scenario , I have AAR on the forum site here, I tried to also keep the SS Panzer Korps back for as long as possible but in the end I had to send it to Orel.
For me losing that city would have spelt disaster right along the Central Front, can you link up 16th Armee with 9th and cut the Russian Salient off at all ?
If you can it will free up huge numbers of troops, of course it wont be easy and it may take quite a while, also hold The Demyansk Pocket it helps.

[Metalist]

For difficulty, all Axis values are 100, while Soviet ones are 110.

6th Army managed to break out, but lost 2 infantry and 1 Panzer division nonetheless.

I didn't really think that I can destroy the enemy forces in Rzhev salient due to difficult terrain. Actually I had to contain a few breakthroughs in that area. At this point I guess only thing I can do to shorten the line is to withdraw 9th Army to Smolensk, as was the case historically. I do not know when I will have to do this though. About Demyansk, I had to abandon it to strengthen 16th Army's line.

I am adding two more screenshots for extra info. It seems to me that the weakest sector in the Axis front is the one occupied by Hungarian and Italian troops. Soviets achieved a few breakthroughs there and I do not really have any reserves at the moment.

Thanks for comments and suggestions!

[tm1]

For difficulty, all Axis values are 100, while Soviet ones are 110.

6th Army managed to break out, but lost 2 infantry and 1 Panzer division nonetheless.

I didn't really think that I can destroy the enemy forces in Rzhev salient due to difficult terrain. Actually I had to contain a few breakthroughs in that area. At this point I guess only thing I can do to shorten the line is to withdraw 9th Army to Smolensk, as was the case historically. I do not know when I will have to do this though. About Demyansk, I had to abandon it to strengthen 16th Army's line.

I am adding two more screenshots for extra info. It seems to me that the weakest sector in the Axis front is the one occupied by Hungarian and Italian troops. Soviets achieved a few breakthroughs there and I do not really have any reserves at the moment.

Thanks for comments and suggestions!

Well you got 6th Armee out of Stalingrad that's good news but hear is the bad news which has probably already started if memory serves me, OKH starts to withdraw units from both 6th and 4th Pz Armee's on a almost weekly basis, 6th gets hit pretty hard with it.

I see you pulled Army Group A out of The Caucasus so that will cover some of the withdrawals so i would fall back to the Donets river line and maybe get some German troops out and into refit mode,don't give up Voroshilovgrad if you can as its a resource centre.

Your right about the Axis Allies there not to strong however 2nd Hungarian Army is pretty good all things considered, but they will need German support, your biggest worry is the shattered Romanian Armies,you need German troops with them badly.

When I first started playing this campaign i was shocked at how bad the entire front was, Hitler basically stripped every Armee to reinforce Army Groups A / B and now they are paying the price, along the entire front just about every Division is badly under strength, I wont let any spoilers out as they say but depending on how the AI plays you in for a massive offensive against a certain German Armee.
For the record I have the AI at 100 where as you have it at 110 so its going to be a little tougher its been no picnic at level 100.

I still think there is a chance to cut off the main salient ( call me optimistic ) but first you need troops the withdrawal from Demysank also throws a spanner in the works but that's OK, so we need troops and fast so the smaller salient centre between 4th Armee and 2nd Pz Armee is a target of opportunity here.


You will need the SS Pz Korps and 7th Panzer DIV and and other mobile unit you can spare , punch through the weakest unit probably the 5x5 soviet div head straight for 4th Armee's 5 x 40 Inf div and cut off a big force.

If it works you will be able to destroy a large force straighten the line and free up troops.

3 outcomes could happen from this attack

1. the AI launches a massive counteroffensive breaks the pocket and pulls it troops back and you more less get what you want.

2. the SS get crushed and trapped and destroyed not so good.

3 the pocket holds you destroy a huge force freeing troops, it now give troops to try for the bigger salient or for other areas.

Now obviously you not try this plan at all, but looking at you maps I see a chance here.

cheers

[AlbertN]

Right now the 'backhand' method is the way to play the game.
Anyone on the attacking side - but more so the Axis - tires quickly and exhaust rapidly.
The Soviets have the luxury of abundance of units, so in general they attack and then retreat behind fresh formations. Axis do not have such luxury.

Also the 'backhand' is enabled easily by the fact oft attacking units are at the edge of the enemy 'admit movement' allowing large concentrations at once that can possibly hop back a few hexes as well just after attacking.
To just punish what the enemy attack with in general seems the way to go - at least in accord to my own experience.