Where the Iron Crosses Grow: K62 (Axis) vs Veterin (Soviet) GC41

[homer82]

Not K62, but consider:
1) Truck losses are a mid to long term concern, SL4 benefits come almost immediately.
2) Faster initial advance=more Soviet trucks captured
3) Fast initial advance, well supplied attacks and good MP=Soviets are outflanked, which reduces the number of battles. If you look at unit supply needs, you note that ammunition weighs the most and is quickly consumed during battles. The number in the unit detail window actually obfuscates the true severity of ammunition consumption, since the unit draws more pre-battle from nearby depots.. If you are only advancing but not fighting, you save a lot of supply consumption.

Taken together, SL4 might even save trucks, but K62 has to answer this.


IRL Soviet counterattacks in 1941 often were failures, but they forced the Wehrmacht to use ammunition and thus reduced transport capacity left for fuel&spare parts to advance. This dynamic creates nother case of the rich getting richer:

Enemy unit destroyed->space to manoeuvre&less ammo use->enough fuel for deep advance->more outflanking, more pockets->more enemy units destroyed etc
This is one of the reasons why IRL and ingame snowball effects are so powerful. Years of war with a mediocre opening will achieve less than a few months with a great opening, as a recent invasion has again demonstrated.

Yes, I'm beginning to understand your well stated points. Thanks!

[HardLuckYetAgain]

Not K62, but consider:
1) Truck losses are a mid to long term concern, SL4 benefits come almost immediately.
2) Faster initial advance=more Soviet trucks captured
3) Fast initial advance, well supplied attacks and good MP=Soviets are outflanked, which reduces the number of battles. If you look at unit supply needs, you note that ammunition weighs the most and is quickly consumed during battles. The number in the unit detail window actually obfuscates the true severity of ammunition consumption, since the unit draws more pre-battle from nearby depots.. If you are only advancing but not fighting, you save a lot of supply consumption.

Taken together, SL4 might even save trucks, but K62 has to answer this.


IRL Soviet counterattacks in 1941 often were failures, but they forced the Wehrmacht to use ammunition and thus reduced transport capacity left for fuel&spare parts to advance. This dynamic creates nother case of the rich getting richer:

Enemy unit destroyed->space to manoeuvre&less ammo use->enough fuel for deep advance->more outflanking, more pockets->more enemy units destroyed etc
This is one of the reasons why IRL and ingame snowball effects are so powerful. Years of war with a mediocre opening will achieve less than a few months with a great opening, as a recent invasion has again demonstrated.

Yes, I'm beginning to understand your well stated points. Thanks!

#2 and #3 not necessarily true based on circumstance on map.

[Champagne]

This is an AAR thread for a new GC41 game that Veterin and I have started.

I intend to keep most updates three turns behind the actual game. All are welcome to read and comment!

Game settings and house rules:

• Open TBs

• No temporary motorization

• No paradrops

• No naval invasions more than 10 hexes from a friendly, non-isolated hex

• No airfield bombing after T1

These House Rules look great. In addition:

My quick thought is that, if this scenario is unbalanced towards the Axis, then, these suggested House Rules might help: 1) Closed TBs; 2) Army Group South zone of operations may not be reinforced with units from AGN or AGC until the Axis front line past the Pripyat Marshes is established East of the marshlands.

[chaos45]

Interesting AAR and well played K62. After not playing for years interesting to see the state of WITE 2.

After just playing the computer on standard settings the massive German CV edge that lasts basically until winter seems to be abit overpowering if the Germans are well played. Esp since russian units just disintegrate from combat while in general the german units even with defeated take less than 800 losses per combat on the whole.

Understand alot of this is designing the game so the Germans can get historical results from decent to average play....but when a player knows the system, logistics, and how the russian units disintegrate on contact seems to be abit overbalanced to the German side in 1941. For 1942 the soviets must just flee from everything being dropped down to 45 NM lol havent played that far as it will just be a matter of sacrificing units for space period with a NM that low or hope you keep enough of the 50 NM russian units from being defeated they stay 50+NM.

Any recommended fixes from someone obviously much more well versed in the system than perhaps even the designers on how to stiffen soviet units/resistance while still allowing historical type play to work?

[K62]

It appears unlikely the game will get a lot more software development at this point. Some of the recently introduced options with reduced retreat attrition and increasing early war Soviet morale seem promising for adjusting balance. But I haven't tried them yet.

[chaos45]

HYLAs looking for a match you guys are both high skill so could be a good one.