Naval and Defense News

[Jagdtiger14]

US struck 3 radar sites. Weak response as usual.

[Gneckes]

What, would you have preferred a massively escalating response instead?

[Jagdtiger14]

As it is, Gneckes...Iran is now sending two of its destroyers to the Gulf of Aden on the "concern for pirates".

Since you are concerned about escalation, I'll ask again if anyone thinks a no fly zone in Syria is a good idea?

I'm not sure if there is a naval blockade vs the Houthi's but there better be one now. How are they getting their hands on cruise missiles (Chinese Silkworms perhaps)?

See Dysta's post #2 in Yeman Scenario? (Mods and Scenarios) for further suggestions.

[Gneckes]

Can we keep the politics out of here please?

[Jagdtiger14]

Can we keep the politics out of here please?

Obviously "politics" is how/why this is happening in the first place, don't you think? Are not politics and military affairs intertwined? If this thread is only about the types of missiles, weapons being used, my apologies. I'll go ahead and delete what I think you think is political. Correct me if I hav'nt been thorough enough.

[kevinkins]

Where is the political post? I think operational considerations in the news are OK for this thread.

Anyway, not sure if the response was weak per se but delayed. What's with the second salvo for example?

As far as Syria and a no-fly, this was in the morning news:

https://www.yahoo.com/news/exclusive-ob ... 59609.html

"Anthony Cordesman of Washington's Center for Strategic and International Studies think tank suggested the United States' failure to act earlier in Syria, and in Aleppo in particular, had narrowed Obama's options.

"There is only so long you can ignore your options before you don’t have any," Cordesman said."

[mikmykWS]

Response was perfect. Precision strikes on relevant targets. I'm hoping they'll hit the arms dumps too that might be storing the missiles.

Mike

[ExNusquam]

ORIGINAL: mikmyk

Response was perfect. Precision strikes on relevant targets. I'm hoping they'll hit the arms dumps too that might be storing the missiles.

Mike

Mike, I concur with your assessment. Much about the missile exchanges over the last 2 weeks has not been publicly disclosed, but there's quite a bit we can determine from the information released.

1. The USNI article says that the 3 Radar sites were also active on 30 September when the Swift was hit. This indicates that the US has been watching these sites preemptively, well before the first incident.

2. Tacking on to that point, the fact that the Radars were hit within 24 hours after the second incident likely means that the US had target/weaponeering plans in place already. Since nearly 2 weeks have passed since first CDCM shot, there has been ample time to ensure that these were the sensors that were passing targets to the CDCM TELs.

3. While we don't know the exact combination of weapons/countermeasures employed in each exchange, this is a big for the USN; It's been 25 years since anyone last successfully defeated a Warshot ASM. This means several things:
a. The USN's training has not atrophied over 25 years of doing nothing but shooting LACMs.
b. The AEGIS system is still effective in the littoral.
c. Alternatively, the Houthi's have poor coordination in their CDCM C2 systems and either launched out of range or engaged the wrong vessels (Much like MV Moonlight was hit when Hezbollah engaged the INS Hanit).

4. Unless there are further CDCM shots I don't expect the US to undertake inland strikes against the Houthi CDCM TELs or Ammo dumps. The US is attempting to insert itself as a neutral party as part of a political resolution, and additional strikes would undermine this narrative.

5. Pending more information or additional launches, I think the biggest impact this will is on shipping through the Bab el Mandeb strait. It will be interesting to see what next months statistics are on tonnage transiting through BAM and the Suez.

[kevinkins]

Thanks for the summary. Out of curiosity (scenario design based), what other sensors would be in that area of the Arabian Peninsular? I mean that the USN would not want to pick off by mistake. This could make for an interesting addition to a scenario I am finalizing. My thoughts are radars to monitor shipping for legitimate navigational purposes. But these should be known as easy to avoid.

[Jagdtiger14]

Response was perfect. Precision strikes on relevant targets. I'm hoping they'll hit the arms dumps too that might be storing the missiles. Mike

The response was so perfect that they shot another missile the next day at the same ship.

Can someone explain to me:
1. Are the Saudi ground forces so small or weak that they cant go on any offensive? Or even defend their own territory from the Houthis?
2. Why hasn't the West (in conjunction with Arab allies) done something about controlling the bottleneck area?...ie...why are the Houthis allowed to control Perim Island (Mayyun) in the Red Sea bottleneck, and have an army base adjacent at Bab-el-Mandeb???

See the Yemeni Civil War up to date active template:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template: ... tailed_map

[Triode]

14/10/2016 , Severomorsk

[xavierv]

MBDA' Sea Venom/Anti-Navire Leger (ANL) Antiship Missile Testing Well On Track

Testing of Sea Venom/Anti-Navire Leger (ANL) anti-ship missile (a key UK-French program) is well on track, Navy Recognition learned from European missile company MBDA. The first jettison test of the missile from a DGA (French defense procurement agency) helicopter took place in December 2015 in Cazaux. We were told that the first live test firing should take place "in a few months" while full development of the missile is expected to be completed in 2018.

http://www.navyrecognition.com/index.ph ... ew&id=4434

[bpstalker]

ORIGINAL: Jagdtiger14

US struck 3 radar sites. Weak response as usual.

this reminds me to proportional response part in the west wing season 1

[ExNusquam]

14/10/2016 , Severomorsk

So the Kuznetsov has sortied...Probably a 2 week transit to Syria? It will be interesting to see how the Russians integrate it's airwing into their ATO. Also, assuming they use it, will this be the combat debut of the AS-20?

[mikmykWS]

ORIGINAL: Jagdtiger14

Response was perfect. Precision strikes on relevant targets. I'm hoping they'll hit the arms dumps too that might be storing the missiles. Mike

The response was so perfect that they shot another missile the next day at the same ship.

Can someone explain to me:
1. Are the Saudi ground forces so small or weak that they cant go on any offensive? Or even defend their own territory from the Houthis?

They've been doing well defending their territory but haven't actually made any statements as to what their war objectives actually are other than to defeat the Houthis. They're definitely a strong and capable enough military to meet reasonable objectives. Keep in mind that Yemen's terrain is very rough and gives the defender a tremendous advantage. The British fought there in the 1960's and weren't exactly all in either.

2. Why hasn't the West (in conjunction with Arab allies) done something about controlling the bottleneck area?...ie...why are the Houthis allowed to control Perim Island (Mayyun) in the Red Sea bottleneck, and have an army base adjacent at Bab-el-Mandeb???

See the Yemeni Civil War up to date active template:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template: ... tailed_map

To be fair the west has a lot on its hands if you consider Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq, and possible Russian aggression in Ukraine. They do however value their role in securing the global commons and nobody is going to support anybody attacking ships in a vital straight for too long. My sense is we just need to wait and see but what is going on is the start. USS Ponce is a special warfare mothership and its no accident its there.

Mike

[jtoatoktoe]

Good article on the Mason's defense over the past week. Confirms the Wednesday attack was defeated by SAM's.

http://www.stripes.com/news/aegis-defense-system-helped-stop-missile-attack-on-uss-mason-1.433974

[mikmykWS]

ORIGINAL: jtoatoktoe

Good article on the Mason's defense over the past week. Confirms the Wednesday attack was defeated by SAM's.

http://www.stripes.com/news/aegis-defense-system-helped-stop-missile-attack-on-uss-mason-1.433974

An nice. Some clarity starting to appear[:)] OODA at work folks.

Mike

[thewood1]

This is a press release from Lockheed, so take it for what its worth.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/f-35-aegi ... 00423.html

I found the most interesting aspect is the LLS-1 land-based ship. I wonder how fast it can go. But it does show the US commitment to the connected combat environment.

[Triode]

ORIGINAL: ExNusquam


So the Kuznetsov has sortied...

Tomorrow.

It will be interesting to see how the Russians integrate it's airwing into their ATO. Also, assuming they use it, will this be the combat debut of the AS-20?

combat debut for Kh-35U already happened with Su-34 in Syria

More likely this will be hundreds of OFAB-250-270 from eight Su-33 with SVP-24-33 "Gefest" upgrade

Mig-29K more likely will use Kh-38 and KAB-500 family
so far on "Kuznetsov" recently seen:
Mig-29K 6 (№ 31,33,37,38,46,49)
Mig-29KUB 3 (№ 50,51,53)
how many will go to Syria is interesting question

what is interesting is Ka-52K on "Kuznetsov", according to rumors they also can use Kh-38 and Kh-35 missile
so we will see how it goes


Su-33 and Mig-29 on deck:

[severe7]

Someone on reddit claiming to be on a Burke DDG stated that the standard operating procedure is to always run with full SLQ-32 EW capability turned on outside of port. Is this really true? It sounds stupid to have such a sensitive system always online for every potential adversary to study, and wouldn't it be dangerous to jam radars around a ship in peace time?