Team Midway in the Taiwan Strait, 1962 -- new beta for testing

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HalfLifeExpert
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Re: Team Midway in the Taiwan Strait, 1962 -- new beta for testing

Post by HalfLifeExpert »

Mgellis wrote: Mon Oct 23, 2023 2:28 am I've made the changes to the gun settings.

I've also changed Triumph from 900 points to 1,500 points. You get points for staying on station until the scenario ends. The goal of the scenario is to survive the first day of air attacks and THEN the submarines show up at night and THEN the bombers show up the NEXT day (they were not ready on the first day but now the Chinese intend to make at least one last attack against the Americans). It's supposed to be a three-step gauntlet for the Midway and her escorts.

I will also change the Chinese air bases so they can be attacked, etc. and put in a message letting the player know when attacks are allowed. I like that idea...does the player take the risk of striking the air bases, which might cause more losses, or simply wait to see if more attacks show up?

I will post Version 3 shortly.
Yeah, since players either know beforehand (or will quickly get a hard schooling) that US ship and air defenses against small maneuvering targets in this period were not that great, having the ability to strike the source before those little buggers can hit you in force makes all the difference in the world.

I don't know if the PRC had SA-2 sites in 1962, so the main defense against the Skywarriors would be AAA, which can be avoided by conducting bombing runs at altitude, with the major accuracy penalty of course.

As for the politics of striking the PRC airbases, I think the US could get away with it due to:

A) Red China did not yet possess nuclear weapons

B) The ongoing Sino-Soviet Split fracturing relations to the point of limiting Krushchev's response. (The USSR would actually benefit from Mao taking a beating from the Americans)

C) The US not diplomatically recognizing the PRC yet.

D) The PRC would have just been winding down the disastrous Great Leap Forward.

E) Finally, such an overt attack on US vessels in international waters could not go unresponded. It would be politically unthinkable to not do what was needed to protect US ships in those circumstances. President Kennedy would get a big boost at home. Smashing the PLAAF bases that launched the attacks would probably be enough for Mao to back down, given everything else.
(and perhaps Khrushchev would decide against sending those missiles to Cuba, and that would have all sorts of positive and negative changes to the timeline)
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Mgellis
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Re: Team Midway in the Taiwan Strait, 1962 -- new beta for testing

Post by Mgellis »

Just posted Version 3. Please let me know what you think. Thanks!
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Re: Team Midway in the Taiwan Strait, 1962 -- new beta for testing

Post by HalfLifeExpert »

I've fully completed a playthrough in Version 3

Much better than previous. I lost more aircraft, but It was a more manageable battle.

The scoring determined victory with about 9 hours to go. Got a final Triumph score of 1860.

Only encountered one sub, which was at all stop, so I blasted it with an ASROC.

I ended up destroying one Bat on the ground during a poorly executed Skywarrior attack, but I think the scenario ended before the Bats could launch.

UPDATE: Upon inspection of my save in Edit Mode, There's still 24x MiG 17s and 20x Bats that haven't launched. They're assigned to the strike mission and are all ready. I destroyed all 16 MiG 17s that did attack, but something kept the subsequent strikes from launching. Additionally, the PLAN Subs are sitting stationary. I've attached my Save.

Losses & Expenditures:
SIDE: United States
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------
2x F-8C (F8U-2) Crusader
7x A-4B (A4D-2) Skyhawk
1x F-3B (F3H-2) Demon
1x A-3B (A3D-2) Skywarrior
1x A-4C (A4D-2N) Skyhawk


EXPENDITURES:
------------------
272x AN/SSQ-2 Jezebel LOFAR
38x AIM-7C Sparrow III
93x AIM-9C Sidewinder
32x Mk82 500lb LDGP
48x Mk83 1000lb LDGP
7x 20mm M39 x 2 Burst [80 rnds]
33x 20mm Mk12 x 4 [100 rnds]
23x AIM-9B Sidewinder
47x 20mm Mk12 x 2 [50 rnds]
98x RIM-2E Terrier
8x 127mm/38 Twin AA-VT Burst [Anti-Aircraft Common, 2 rnds]
10x 127mm/38 AA-VT [AntiAircraft Common]
1x 127mm/38 HE-PD [HiCap]
7x 76mm/50 Twin Frag Burst [2 rnds]
1x RUR-5A Mod 3 ASROC RTT [Mk44]



SIDE: China
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------
78x J-2 Fagot
2x F 507 Chengdu
3x Polikarpov Po-2
2x D 101 Anshan
3x H-5R Beagle
16x J-5 Fresco C
4x 100mm KS-19
2x Binoculars (Visual)
1x Vehicle (Fire Can [SON-9])
4x 57mm S60
1x Tu-2 Bat
1x PL-633 Romeo


EXPENDITURES:
------------------
60x 23mm NR-23 x 2 Burst [40 rnds]
102x 37mm N-37 Burst [10 rnds]
3x 23mm NR-23 x 3 Burst [60 rnds]
192x 100mm KS-19 Frag
244x 57mm S60 HE
2x Generic Acoustic Decoy



SIDE: Neutrals
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------


EXPENDITURES:
------------------



SIDE: Taiwan
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------
6x F-104B Starfighter
2x F-104A Starfighter


EXPENDITURES:
------------------
47x 20mm/85 M61A1 Vulcan Burst [100 rnds]
51x AIM-9B Sidewinder


Attachments
Team Midway V3 Save.zip
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Mgellis
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Re: Team Midway in the Taiwan Strait, 1962 -- new beta for testing

Post by Mgellis »

Yes, I think I need to tweak the times for certain events, but that should take care of the problem with the Bats not launching before the scenario ends.
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Re: Team Midway in the Taiwan Strait, 1962 -- new beta for testing

Post by schweggy »

I just finished a playthrough with version 3. The Chinese air attacks are more manageable, but I know (more or less) when to expect them. There's a bug in the Mission Planner that fires off a balloon notification about making altitude/speed changes to AI generated missions that use flight plans. Thus, the player knows that an AI mission using flight plans is about to launch. It's been reported. As reported, the Chinese subs are stationary. The mission is apparently active, but the subs are not moving.

Here's my tab:
Team Midway Scoring.JPG
Team Midway Scoring.JPG (27.88 KiB) Viewed 588 times

SIDE: United States
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------
3x A-4B (A4D-2) Skyhawk
3x F-8C (F8U-2) Crusader
1x A-4C (A4D-2N) Skyhawk
2x A-3B (A3D-2) Skywarrior
8x AD-6 Skyraider
1x F-3B (F3H-2) Demon


EXPENDITURES:
------------------
145x AN/SSQ-2 Jezebel LOFAR
122x AIM-9C Sidewinder
94x 20mm Mk12 x 4 [100 rnds]
41x AIM-9B Sidewinder
63x 20mm Mk12 x 2 [50 rnds]
58x Mk83 1000lb LDGP
88x Mk82 500lb LDGP
24x AIM-7C Sparrow III
12x 20mm M3 [200 rnds]
144x RIM-2E Terrier
24x 20mm M39 x 2 Burst [80 rnds]
15x 127mm/38 Twin AA-VT Burst [Anti-Aircraft Common, 2 rnds]
8x 76mm/50 Twin Frag Burst [2 rnds]
2x 127mm/54 HE-CVT [HiFrag]
10x 127mm/38 AA-VT [AntiAircraft Common]
1x 127mm/38 HE-PD [HiCap]
4x Mk77 Mod 1/2/3/4/5/6 500lb Incendiary Bomb
1x B28 Strategic Bomb [1.45mT Nuclear]
2x RIM-2D Terrier [W45-0 1kT Nuclear]



SIDE: China
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------
79x J-2 Fagot
2x D 101 Anshan
2x F 507 Chengdu
3x Polikarpov Po-2
3x H-5R Beagle
40x J-5 Fresco C
3x Building (Control Tower)
17x Tu-2 Bat
21x A/C Hardened Aircraft Shelter (1x Large Aircraft)
39x A/C Tarmac Space (2x Large Aircraft)
2x AvGas (400k Liter Underground Tank)
1x A/C Hangar (2x Medium Aircraft)
8x Ammo Shelter
4x A/C Revetment (1x Large Aircraft)
11x Runway Access Point (Very Large Aircraft)
3x Be-6 Madge
5x Building (Airport Terminal)
1x Runway-Grade Taxiway (2600m)
12x 57mm S60
6x Binoculars (Visual)
12x 100mm KS-19
3x Vehicle (Fire Can [SON-9])
1x Marker (City)


EXPENDITURES:
------------------
83x 37mm N-37 Burst [10 rnds]
47x 23mm NR-23 x 2 Burst [40 rnds]
1x 23mm Twin Burst [20 rnds]
4x 100mm/56 Frag
4x 37mm/63 Triple Burst [30 rnds]
420x 100mm KS-19 Frag
708x 57mm S60 HE
2x 23mm NR-23 x 3 Burst [60 rnds]
18x FAB-250M-54 GPB
2x 20mm M39 Burst [40 rnds]
38x 12.7mm/50 MG x 4 Burst [100 rnds]



SIDE: Neutrals
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------


EXPENDITURES:
------------------



SIDE: Taiwan
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------
3x F-104B Starfighter


EXPENDITURES:
------------------
84x 20mm/85 M61A1 Vulcan Burst [100 rnds]
95x AIM-9B Sidewinder
- schweggy -

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Mgellis
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Re: Team Midway in the Taiwan Strait, 1962 -- new beta for testing

Post by Mgellis »

I think I fixed the submarine issue.

Note to self...when you have a mission set to Inactive, be sure to add an Event that will eventually make it Active. Duh! :)

I will post Version 4 soon so people can try it out with the fixes. I also tweaked the launch times for the Chinese planes a little.
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Re: Team Midway in the Taiwan Strait, 1962 -- new beta for testing

Post by Mgellis »

Version 4 posted.

* Rewrote the submarine mission so the Chinese subs will show up (mostly at night)
* Tweaked the scoring
* Tweaked the times when the aircraft launch for various missions...the attacks are a bit more coordinated now

Please let me know what you think. Is this version ready for the Community Scenario Pack or is there anything else I need to fix, change, improve, etc.?

Thanks!
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BH5hyb
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Re: Team Midway in the Taiwan Strait, 1962 -- new beta for testing

Post by BH5hyb »

Hi Mark. My grandfather was the veteran on the Taiwan Strait's frontline solider of the PLAN. Here is some advice for me.

1.I think in 1960s,the mainly and priority target for the USN maybe could be the Battery near the Quemoy (Kinmen)island. Here is the battery deploy on 1958,
QQ图片20231115150927_副本.png
QQ图片20231115150927_副本.png (379.71 KiB) Viewed 439 times
1958.png
1958.png (977.69 KiB) Viewed 439 times
2.About the SA-2 Site(or we say Surface to air missile Troops),until 1962, PLA has 3 Regiment. But it mainly to deal with the U-2 Recon. The set up is decided for yourself.

3.in 1958, the mainly Fighters of the PRC is Mig-17, almost set up 23 Air Regiment (Include 1st Div, 1st Reg"The First Div", PLAN 4th Div 10th Reg"Eagle of the Air and Sea:...), Tu-4 and H-5 is replace than Tu-2 Become the mainly power on the Taiwan Frontline.
Because in 1960s, the Taiwan problem always is the priority military strict for the PRC.

4.About the Surface Ships, My grandfather was served one of it. As i think, These ships tend not to go out to sea, but to operate near the sea (3 nautical miles from the coastline). And you should add some of the PT boat(Group by the 4-5 ships)

5.SSN could replace the Destroyer or Cruiser Flotilla.

6.I like the real callsign set up. On my scenario, all the unit has real callsign. Here is the road you could find it:

http://www.gonavy.jp/AIRLANTf.html

I'm not always work on the Forums. You can contact me on the Steam Community:)
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BH5hyb
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Re: Team Midway in the Taiwan Strait, 1962 -- new beta for testing

Post by BH5hyb »

I forget one thing. You forget to set up radar station on the China Mainland. According to Taiwan's Report,
these radar control & command station. Has large amount, precision and effective.
But database has not much China Radar. Here is advice for me:

Spoon Rest B (P-12)
Knife Rest (P-10)
Tall King A(P-14)
Patty Cake(PRV-9)
Side Net HF(PRV-11)

And SSC-2 SSM is import in China at 1958.

Hope it could be helping you.
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Mgellis
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Re: Team Midway in the Taiwan Strait, 1962 -- new beta for testing

Post by Mgellis »

BH5hyb, interesting information. Thanks. I may not use it for this scenario, but if I do another one set in the Taiwan Strait, a battle involving Quemoy is a definite possibility. Thanks again.
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Re: Team Midway in the Taiwan Strait, 1962 -- new beta for testing

Post by Mgellis »

Anyone have any thoughts about Version 4. Anything else I need to fix or improve? Or is this ready for the Community Scenario Pack? Please let me know what you think. Thanks.
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