14.2.1.3 Catastrophic Events

Kull · Post by **Kull** » Thu Jan 20, 2022 11:55 pm

Six days later and I've been violating all the laws of physics and cramming ships into Sydney for their conversions. Fortunately the 3 AVDs we looked at earlier have cleared out their major damage, so it should be easy to shift them over to Pierside right? But only AVD Hulbert is at Pierside! Get off your butt Kull, move the other two!

Kull · Post by **Kull** » Fri Jan 21, 2022 12:03 am

OK, OK! Let's start with AVD MacFarland......except....ummm....there's one little problem. No pierside option.

Why one and not the other two? Oddly enough I looked at other saves and other ports, and similar things happen to other classes. The only common denominator seems to be, "entered the conversion with Sys Damage of 1 or more". If it's zero, then no pierside repair option. It would be interesting if others could replicate that, because if so, it's probably a bug and perhaps Michael could look at it.

dr.hal · Post by **dr.hal** » Fri Jan 21, 2022 12:05 am

Kull in post #7 it shows the APA Bell before it was switched into the yard. Was it selected for upgrade and what date upgrade? In post #18 it shows that the "current" upgrade is March 43, while the next is, as you point out, April 44. If it was put into Sidney with the 3/43 upgrade YET to be done, and then in the next move it was moved into the yard to HAVE that upgrade installed, then it would show the next future upgrade, that of 4/44. So without knowing what date it was moved to Sidney and what it's upgrade status was at that time, it's current status is "strange". BUT it can be explained if the ship entered Sidney after 3/43 and you had oked it for upgrade, then the program shifted it automatically which would then show the next future upgrade. Make sense?

Kull · Post by **Kull** » Fri Jan 21, 2022 12:20 am

ORIGINAL: dr.hal

Kull in post #7 it shows the APA Bell before it was switched into the yard. Was it selected for upgrade and what date upgrade? In post #18 it shows that the "current" upgrade is March 43, while the next is, as you point out, April 44. If it was put into Sidney with the 3/43 upgrade YET to be done, and then in the next move it was moved into the yard to HAVE that upgrade installed, then it would show the next future upgrade, that of 4/44. So without knowing what date it was moved to Sidney and what it's upgrade status was at that time, it's current status is "strange". BUT it can be explained if the ship entered Sidney after 3/43 and you had oked it for upgrade, then the program shifted it automatically which would then show the next future upgrade. Make sense?

The first screen shot was March 20 1943, and shows them as "AP". I was clearing out the system damage in Pierside mode AND had them marked YES for the 3/43 conversion. The next screen shot is March 21 1943 and they are now APAs in Shipyard mode and can't be shifted to Pierside.

BUT....that means I should be able to test the "Sys Damage theory"! Just re-run the save, but this time no pierside repair first, just conversion. Let's see what happens....

RangerJoe · Post by **RangerJoe** » Fri Jan 21, 2022 12:20 am

Those APAs don't need to be in the shipyard at all. Those AVDs can get out when the floatation and engine damage major reach 5 or less on both.

Kull · Post by **Kull** » Fri Jan 21, 2022 12:21 am

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

Those APAs don't need to be in the shipyard at all. Those AVDs can get out when the floatation and engine damage major reach 5 or less on both.

Look at the screenshots....no they can't. Pierside is not a selectable option.

dr.hal · Post by **dr.hal** » Fri Jan 21, 2022 12:29 am

If the ship is put into a port that can accomodate an upgrade and the upgrade is allowed, then it will happen automatically. If there's a shipyard in that port, the upgrading ship will automatically be put into the yard, overload or not. As RJ points out, almost always the upgrading ship can be switched back to "pierside" manually on that turn. It's only NOT possible if the damage incurred by the ship prior to its upgrade OR, OR, OR as a result of the hits taken because of the upgrade, will the ship not be allowed to move pierside (as the upgrade is in progress!!!!). I'm not sure if you can force the ship back to pierside, as I've never tested it.

dr.hal · Post by **dr.hal** » Fri Jan 21, 2022 12:31 am

BUT, as usually we are WAY off topic from my OP!!!!! Ugh.

RangerJoe · Post by **RangerJoe** » Fri Jan 21, 2022 12:32 am

Go to the "Manage ships under repair" screen and change them there . . .

Kull · Post by **Kull** » Fri Jan 21, 2022 1:03 am

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

Go to the "Manage ships under repair" screen and change them there . . .

Hoo Boy! Been playing this game for 13 years and NEVER used that button. [&:] Thanks RJ [&o], and LOL at me!

So Doc, I apologize for grabbing your thread, but there is an important lesson for newbies in all this:

1) You can play this game for over a decade and still learn new things on a regular basis
2) Your failure to know EVERYTHING has no impact on game success or enjoyment
2) And lastly, "Forum Experts" don't always know what they are talking about [:D]

BBfanboy · Post by **BBfanboy** » Fri Jan 21, 2022 1:17 am

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins

I know Don is giving away his books, but I don't recall reading that he's leaving the forum. Did I miss something?

Yes, in his book giveaway thread he said he is leaving the company, the boards and his current residence IIRC.

Macquarrie1999 · Post by **Macquarrie1999** » Fri Jan 21, 2022 1:21 am

I always thought that ships under refit after conversion couldn't be moved out of the shipyard. This is good to know. Will help the poor little shipyards at Brisbane and Sydney.

BBfanboy · Post by **BBfanboy** » Fri Jan 21, 2022 1:22 am

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

Those APAs don't need to be in the shipyard at all. Those AVDs can get out when the floatation and engine damage major reach 5 or less on both.

If the conversion to APA requires a SY (I believe it does - for the cranes), it cannot be shifted to pierside until the turn AFTER it entered the SY to start the conversion.

EDIT: Correction - I thought you could not do it same turn because the option was never available to me. But today I get the chance to convert a DD to an APD and immediately after it went into the shipyard I was able to move it to pierside. So now I am as puzzled as usual!

RangerJoe · Post by **RangerJoe** » Fri Jan 21, 2022 1:30 am

ORIGINAL: Kull

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

Go to the "Manage ships under repair" screen and change them there . . .

Hoo Boy! Been playing this game for 13 years and NEVER used that button. [&:] Thanks RJ [&o], and LOL at me!

So Doc, I apologize for grabbing your thread, but there is an important lesson for newbies in all this:

1) You can play this game for over a decade and still learn new things on a regular basis
2) Your failure to know EVERYTHING has no impact on game success or enjoyment
2) And lastly, "Forum Experts" don't always know what they are talking about [:D]

You can also see just how far it is until the next point of damage is repaired.

geofflambert · Post by **geofflambert** » Fri Jan 21, 2022 1:43 am

It was only recently that I was even aware of plane fatigue. I don't think I've ever "managed" ships under repair either. (referencing Kull's last post)

RangerJoe · Post by **RangerJoe** » Fri Jan 21, 2022 2:29 am

The thing to be careful is of when changing the source of repairs that you will lose all current efforts at repairing any damage. So if things are not getting repaired, don't switch them back and forth. By looking on that screen, you can see how much effort has been done to repair the next repair point. So if a player only wants to repair things so far as to allow the pierside, Naval Support, and Repair vessels to repair any major damage of 5 points or less, does not check every turn, then sees that the ship can change repair modes to get to a hopefully faster mode for the last of the major damage points, check to see how much progress is done on the next point of damage. It it is close to being repaired, leave it alone until that point of damage is repaired.

If a player wishes to change repair modes to see if it is faster to use a different source of repair help, if the player does not want to switch then hit "cancel changes" to make sure. Due to shipyard size, this may be important. Also, ARs and ARDs if selected under "Repair Ship" may only be able to work on one ship at a time. The ARD is limited by size. But as needed, the ARs and ARDs should help repair ships using the pier side repair modes along with the help from any tenders but there the repair points may be spread out over multiple ships.

CaptBeefheart · Post by **CaptBeefheart** » Fri Jan 21, 2022 3:58 am

There's a real good thread somewhere on ship repair with a lot of Alfred's input. I remember Bullwinkle, as seen in his AAR, used to tweak the system to get excellent repair times. Me, I'll settle for about 80-90% efficiency in ship repair and pilot training to save time for more fun stuff like managing individual sub patrols (just kidding--I don't do that very often).

Kull and Gorn: I'm amazed you gents didn't know the "manage ships under repair" button. That shows you don't need to optimize this game to 100% to still do pretty well.

I know plane fatigue is there, I just don't pay any attention to it, or to weather. If there ever is a WITP2 it'd be nice to be able to set parameters like "train to 60 EXP and 70 AIR" or "fly offensive missions until morale goes below 60."

Cheers,
CB

Maallon · Post by **Maallon** » Fri Jan 21, 2022 6:15 am

Alfred's guide on ship repair:
https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.a ... =&#2990845

BBfanboy · Post by **BBfanboy** » Fri Jan 21, 2022 10:34 am

ORIGINAL: geofflambert

It was only recently that I was even aware of plane fatigue. I don't think I've ever "managed" ships under repair either. (referencing Kull's last post)

I never used it much either until I discovered it would sometimes allow you to switch repair modes (usually SY to pierside) when that option was not present on the single ship screen. But there are times where the Manage Ships Under Repair screen is not offered and I have never figured out why that happens. It can't be just Port size, because at a given port sometimes the Manage Ships screen is offered and sometimes it isn't. So I just use whatever tools the game makes available and don't sweat the unknowns.

LargeSlowTarget · Post by **LargeSlowTarget** » Fri Jan 21, 2022 8:39 pm

This is going OT - in my experience, when a certain number of ships - more than 15-20 - in need of repairs are present in the same port, the "Manage Ships Under Repair screen" becomes agonizingly slow to apply a switch of repair mode or priority for a single ship, and even worse if I use the "Set all ships to" button - can take several minutes with the game "freezing" temporarily before the new repair mode or priority is becoming effective. Just wondering if this is just happening on my machine? Or maybe it's only an issue in my mod since almost all ships have some small amount of damage at start (it's simply unrealistic that all ships on the map start on Dec 7th 1941 in pristine condition). Looks like a memory issue, but I have 16 GB of RAM on a 64bit Win11 Gaming Laptop, way above the game specs. Anyone else with that problem?

14.2.1.3 Catastrophic Events

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