Bomber Command memorial being unveiled by Queen Elizabeth today. 67 years too late is better than never, I suppose...
And now only one thing is left to do... to make movie "Bomber" based on the Len Deighton book... one night (31.06.1943 - made up on purpose) with Lancaster crew on mission and with Germans on ground and in the air...
shame so many of the vets have passed on. BC crews risked much, gave all and ended up getting villianized for it.
Yep. Even the current mayor of Dresden sent a message saying it was time that Bomber Command got a memorial.
she has? I haven't heard about it.
But I read that some british newspapers complained that the 600.000 civilians killed by BC aren't even mentioned by a single sentence.
Don't get me wrong, I don't want to start a political discussion and I perfectly agree that those veterans did their job in times of war which deservers remembrance and a memorial.
Without any doubt: I am the spawn of evil - and the Bavarian Beer Monster (BBM)!
There's only one bad word and that's taxes. If any other word is good enough for sailors; it's good enough for you. - Ron Swanson
That's about how I do it. I've been know to go out barefooted at -20F to start the truck.
BTW: Any plans on heading over to Minot this year?
Probably at the end of August. The boy wants to visit the badlands, so we'll take a day.
It's a pain getting checked in there, being a nuke base. When we crused around Wright Pat last Nov, we just showed our IDs and that was it. Here, we have to go through a car search and everything else. It's worth the $39 a night to stay there, though.
But I read that some british newspapers complained that the 600.000 civilians killed by BC aren't even mentioned by a single sentence
They are:
Speaking at Green Park ahead of the dedication ceremony, Bomber Command veteran Cecil Hayley agreed the memorial was about reconciliation as well as remembrance.
"I sometimes look back in horror to think what I was required to do. But it was what we were trying to do... it was part of the task of finishing the war and I console myself that this is what we had to do."
Bomber Command Association chairman Malcolm White said it was clear that the memorial's message included a sense of reconciliation.
"That's why it's writ large on the wall, 'We remember those of all countries who died in 39-45,'" he said.
"Grown ups are what's left when skool is finished."
"History started badly and hav been geting steadily worse."
- Nigel Molesworth.
ORIGINAL: Historiker
she has? I haven't heard about it.
But I read that some british newspapers complained that the 600.000 civilians killed by BC aren't even mentioned by a single sentence.
Don't get me wrong, I don't want to start a political discussion and I perfectly agree that those veterans did their job in times of war which deservers remembrance and a memorial.
Don't stress it H.....here (at least the regulars) arn't gonna take what you say out of context. Case in point.....this is what i heard on the radio this morning.
There's talk about turning part of the Hanford Nuclear Reservation into a park. Seems like a good idea, but there's at least one group that doesn't like the idea.
why?
they point out that the plutonium that fueled one of the bombs dropped on Japan came from Hanford and they fear that turning part of it into a park will "Glorify" the use of nuclear weapons on civilians.
Don't stress it H.....here (at least the regulars) arn't gonna take what you say out of context. Case in point.....this is what i heard on the radio this morning.
My experiences are the exact opposite. That's why I haven't been posting in this thread any more. I accept that the regulars are "regulars" and when they take me wrong or get offended by me, I try to be polite enough to stay away [:)]
Without any doubt: I am the spawn of evil - and the Bavarian Beer Monster (BBM)!
There's only one bad word and that's taxes. If any other word is good enough for sailors; it's good enough for you. - Ron Swanson
I know the Thread regs don't want political discussions. That I can understand given it can cause heated responses. But i didn't see anything political in what you wrote. I wouldn't have been bothered if the current Mayor of Dresden said Nein to the idea of a memorial. I've read a good number of histories now on the Air war over Germany (and Japan)
it has always suprised me how more often than not civilians were tolerant of Allied prisoners (well in Germany at least) even as destruction rained down overhead. My suprise would extend even to the military who sometimes had to protect them when civis were feeling less than charitable. Human nature is funny, even when death is all around you......on how certain rules, mannerisms and moral codes still go into place.
To me....total war in it's purest form is zero tolerance to an enemy. Humanity thankfully tends to shy away from such things more often than not.
anyway. i babble on. I think a memorial to BC is fitting simply because they were military men doing a dangerous job. They had no say in policy which will be endlessly debated. (and i have a recent book on my wish list that takes a controversial view of the Allied bombing campaign.....sure that will be fun)
That's about how I do it. I've been know to go out barefooted at -20F to start the truck.
BTW: Any plans on heading over to Minot this year?
Probably at the end of August. The boy wants to visit the badlands, so we'll take a day.
It's a pain getting checked in there, being a nuke base. When we crused around Wright Pat last Nov, we just showed our IDs and that was it. Here, we have to go through a car search and everything else. It's worth the $39 a night to stay there, though.
Ed-
Stop on by an/or spend the night. I'll shoot you a e-mail. It's about 220+ miles to the base from here. The Badlands are great. We used go camping out near Pretty Butte by the Little Missouri River. I should head out that way again sometime and do some pronghorn hunting.
I know the Thread regs don't want political discussions. That I can understand given it can cause heated responses. But i didn't see anything political in what you wrote. I wouldn't have been bothered if the current Mayor of Dresden said Nein to the idea of a memorial. I've read a good number of histories now on the Air war over Germany (and Japan)
it has always suprised me how more often than not civilians were tolerant of Allied prisoners (well in Germany at least) even as destruction rained down overhead. My suprise would extend even to the military who sometimes had to protect them when civis were feeling less than charitable. Human nature is funny, even when death is all around you......on how certain rules, mannerisms and moral codes still go into place.
To me....total war in it's purest form is zero tolerance to an enemy. Humanity thankfully tends to shy away from such things more often than not.
anyway. i babble on. I think a memorial to BC is fitting simply because they were military men doing a dangerous job. They had no say in policy which will be endlessly debated. (and i have a recent book on my wish list that takes a controversial view of the Allied bombing campaign.....sure that will be fun)
My long time girlfriend in highschool of four years... her grandparents (Her mom is from Germany) lived in Wiesbaden. They hid from the Nazis, even though they were not Jewish, or anything else the Germans were looking for. They just feared for their life and didn't trust them at all. They also mention friends/relatives in other towns taking kindly to Allied POWs... and how they thought it was a gift from god when the Allies liberated Germany.
Life is tough. The sooner you realize that, the easier it will be.
Bomber Command memorial being unveiled by Queen Elizabeth today. 67 years too late is better than never, I suppose...
ORIGINAL: Nikademus
really? It took that long.
shame so many of the vets have passed on. BC crews risked much, gave all and ended up getting villianized for it.
Days like today are the reason I joined the RAF, and specifically why I volunteered for my current posting. The chance to do something to remember and honour those who gave so much in order that people would have a future where they would be able to live freely.
We had two vets at the flight today. One went on the Lanc, I managed to spend some time talking with the other gent. He did 32 ops with 619 Sqn as a WOp in 44/45, including a long slog out to the Russian front and back. As they always do, he said he hadn't done anything special.
They all gave something, some gave more than others, some gave a year or six, and many gave everything so that we could have anything.
I hear you Mike, and I spanked Osterhaut pretty big time. I apologize for his lapse. There's a lot of background stuff going on, so I understand, but do not condone his posts on this thread.
Some of you have come out to Cali and sailed with me and met both me and Mike, so you know we are different; he's 4" shorter and 6" wider and none of it is fat. A fireplug in motion.
Yes, Mike and I, and several other people, share logins. The people who play Babes live in places with business/military servers that don't let them get to where they need to go, so my business (that is an acceptable destination) has a network that we all use. We are all friends, so anybody in the network can use anybody else's stuff.
It's called trust.
So, yeah, Mike has used my login; why not? So has Matt, Jeremy, Jim, woof !! And if I'm dinking around somewhere else and login here, and Mike has been there before me, so I drop in on an overlay, who gives a rats except for some forum winkie who don't know and just wants to be hero?
Anyway, I kicked Mike's butt, so no more Osterhaut Ondergang. (I really do like Mike, he's a prince with a genoa. If you guys ever come out, and I can get us all a ride on "Cunning Stunts", out of Southern YC, I might can get Mike to come out from Cali, and do some damage to the local yokels).
Incredibly and against all predictions Italy won against Germany... [X(]
Final is between Spain (current World Champion and current European Champion) and Italy!
Croatia was unfortunate to be in same group with both Spain and Italy... darn... and Croatia wasn't that far away in both games (with both Italy and Spain)... [:(]
