FTC and COnquest

[paulderynck]

ORIGINAL: morgil

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets

MWIF Game Engine and CWIF Conversion
In one of the beta testers’ games the USSR had conquered Persia (which aligned to Japan) and then Italy aligned Iraq and had Iraqi units ready to enter and liberate Persia. Here the general rule would prohibit Iraqi units (minor country aligned to Italy) from entering Persia (minor country aligned to Japan, on the same side as Italy). But since Persia is completely conquered, it is now ‘owned’ by the USSR, with which Italy is at war, hence the Iraqi units are free to enter Persia. At least that is how I have coded it. My change is that if a minor country on your side has been completely conquered, then the FTC requirements no longer apply.

Another example is when the Collapse of Vichy France causes Vichy France controlled minor countries to become owned by an Axis major power which has a unit present in the minor country. For instance, if Italy has a unit in Vichy France controlled Tunisia, then the rules state that Tunisia goes to Italy. But the rules say nothing about if there are both German and Italian units present. I decided to count the number of units and ‘give’ the country to the Axis major power with the most units present.

Both the above examples are not covered by the WIF FE rules, so I put in additional code to cover these gaps in (what I consider) a reasonable manner.

You were almost spot on, except the bit where it not being covered, anyhow, your interpretation is quite close, and works for most cases.

In the first example;

Rule 11.11.5
• minor country units can’t enter a hex controlled by another minor country aligned with their side unless they satisfy the foreign troop commitment rules.

So that means that the Iraqies in question could waltz around in any Persian hex, provided it is controlled by the russians.

However Rule 18.2
A minor country unit that ends any step in the home country of an aligned minor country on the same side is destroyed unless:
• it started the step there; or
• it started the step elsewhere and the unit satisfies the foreign troop commitment limit.

But Rule 13.7.1 Conquest,
Complete conquest
When a major power or minor country no longer controls its own or any aligned home country, it has been completely conquered.
Thereafter, it is at peace with everyone it was at war with.

This would suggest that a completely conquered country is no longer aligned to anyone, hence 18.2 does not apply.
When the Iraqis then liberate Persia, it becomes aligned to Italy, and the Iraqi units started the step there so no need to FTC.

However this creates special cases, where the country would not be completely conquered, but minors could enter it, and liberate it, but would still be destroyed.
e.g. Germany has incompletely conquered The Netherlands and DOWed Belgium, then Belgian forces could enter The Netherlands home country, because the hexes are controlled by Germany, but they would be destroyed at the end of any step because they are in another minors home country.

Second Example;
Rule 17.4 Running Vichy France
Vichy French collapse
If Vichy France collapses, it ceases to exist as a major power. All of Metropolitan Vichy France is now conquered by the Axis major power that installed the Vichy government (see 13.7.1).
Each home country or territory aligned with Vichy France becomes conquered by any Axis major power that has a land unit in it.
Other home countries and territories aligned with Vichy France align with Free France (or become Free France with a new home country if it is currently completely conquered).
Rule 13.7.1 Conquest
Territories
If more than one major power from the same side controls ports and cities in a territory, the major power with the greatest influence is the conqueror.
Use this priority to determine who has the greatest influence:
1. Whoever controls the most ports and cities in the territory.
2. Whoever has the highest garrison value (see 13.1) in the territory.
3. Whoever occupied the territory’s last city or port.
Other home countries
If more than one major power from the same side controls the capital and printed factories in a home country, the major power with the greatest influence in that home country is the conqueror.
Use this priority to determine who has the greatest influence:
1. Whoever controls most factories in the home country (with the capital counting as an additional 3 factories for this calculation).
2. Whoever has the highest garrison value (see 13.1) in the home country.
3. Whoever occupied the home country’s last factory or capital city

This also gets interesting if the WAllies have DOWed Vichy, and also has a unit in Tunisia, and then you have the whole Incomplete conquest thing going on...

This thread is created because the topic does not belong in the "When" thread.

I disagree about the Belgium-Netherlands example. If the Netherlands is incompletely conquered, it has a new home country - let's assume the NEI. So the Belgians could be there no problem. Even if they took back the capital and the CW liberated the Netherlands at the end of that turn, the Belgians would still be OK and not need FTC because they'd have started the step there. They just couldn't leave and come back again.

[morgil]

Ofcourse you are right, on both accounts [:)]
Sorry for the misspost.

And while I have your attention, can you DOW one country, have the opponent set up its units, and then DOW a second country the same turn, or do you have to DOW all countries, and have them set up in one go ?

[Extraneous]

ORIGINAL: morgil

Ofcourse you are right, on both accounts [:)]
Sorry for the misspost.

And while I have your attention, can you DOW one country, have the opponent set up its units, and then DOW a second country the same turn, or do you have to DOW all countries, and have them set up in one go ?

ORIGINAL: From the RAW (Rules As Written)

9.2 How to declare war

All major powers on this side announce which major powers on the other side they are declaring war on this impulse. They then all announce which neutral minor countries they are declaring war on this impulse.

[Shannon V. OKeets]

ORIGINAL: morgil

Ofcourse you are right, on both accounts [:)]
Sorry for the misspost.

And while I have your attention, can you DOW one country, have the opponent set up its units, and then DOW a second country the same turn, or do you have to DOW all countries, and have them set up in one go ?

The latter.

Code: Select all

 // ****************************************************************************
 // DOW SubPhases.
 // ****************************************************************************
   TDOWSubPhase = (
     DspDOWMajor,              // RAC 9.2 & 9.3.
     DspDOWMinor,              // RAC 9.2, 9.3, 9.10, & 13.3.2 (#7 & #44).
     DspUSEntry,               // RAC 9.4.
     DspNeutralityPacts,       // RAC 9.5.
     DspReserves,              // RAC 9.6.
     DspChooseAligner,         // RAC 9.7.
     DspSetupAttackedMinor,    // RAC 9.7.
     DspAlignMinor,            // RAC 9.8.
     DspSetupAlignedMinor,     // RAC 9.8.
     DspDone, DspWait);
 

EDIT: The Rules as Coded section references are the same as Rules as Written (RAW).

[Orm]

An FAQ answer has some relevance on this.

From FAQ v1.3 - 7 Jul 2009
Q2.5-9
Question: If the USSR invades China, taking hexes from Japan, who’s hexes are they now? USSR or China? Especially if no one is returning any territory.

Answer: USSR. It is however still Chinese home nation territory for the purposes of the Foreign Troop Commitments rule, regardless of who controls it. Date 01/02/1998