13.7.3 Mutual peace. Option 50: (USSR-Japan compulsory peace)

[rkr1958]

Option 50: (USSR-Japan compulsory peace) If Japan controls Vladivostok during the first war between Japan and the USSR, the Japanese player must agree to a peace if the Soviet player wants one. Similarly, if the USSR controls 3 or more resources that were
Japanese controlled at the start of Sep/Oct 1939, the Soviet player must agree to a peace if the Japanese player wants one. In either case, the new Russo-Japanese border is established by the hexes each controls. Any pocket of non-coastal hexes wholly surrounded by hexes controlled by the other major power becomes controlled by the major power whose hexes surround them.
Example :Hexes A and B are still Japanese controlled even though they are wholly surrounded by Soviet controlled hexes. If the USSR and Japan reach a peace, hexes A and B will become Soviet controlled.

We believe that "Option 50: (USSR-Japan compulsory peace)" is an important enough optional which was/is eventually to be implemented in MWIF that we decided at the start of our game to manually implement, if necessary, as written (above). And now it's necessary but we have a significant question to it's implementation.

The situation:
(1) USSR declared war on Japan on turn 5, May/June 1940.
(2) It's now turn 11, May/June 1941 and the USSR and Japan are still at war/fighting, it's the peace step and the axis player is considering forcing a peace.
(3) The USSR has taken, and controls, all of Manchuria and has captured 3 RPs that Japan controlled at the start of the game, hence the ability according the RAW above for Japan to force peace.
(4) The USSR has also advanced into northern China and has Peking, which is still Japanese controlled, completely surrounded.
(5) MWIF is showing the hexes in China "liberated" by the Soviets as Chinese controlled; however, the USSR was not asked nor has any intention of reverting control back to China during this first war with Japan.

The question/issue: Is MWIF correct? Or, should these hexes still be Soviet controlled?

The implication: Peking which is still Japanese controlled is surrounded by the Soviets. If peace is forced and these hexes are indeed Soviet controlled then Peking becomes Soviet controlled and those Chinese hexes liberated by the Soviets remain Soviet. However; if the surrounding hexes are Chinese controlled when peace is forced then Peking remains Japanese controlled and Japan could march back in/out of Peking. Even as I write this I'm confused as to what is correct according to WIF 7 Rules as Written. So any/all rules expertise is appreciated.

[Centuur]

RAW:

Option 50: (USSR-Japan compulsory peace) If Japan controls
Vladivostok during the first war between Japan and the USSR, the
Japanese player must agree to a peace if the Soviet player wants
one. Similarly, if the USSR controls 3 or more resources that were
Japanese controlled at the start of Sep/Oct 1939, the Soviet player
must agree to a peace if the Japanese player wants one.
In either case, the new Russo-Japanese border is established by the
hexes each controls. Any pocket of non-coastal hexes wholly
surrounded by hexes controlled by the other major power becomes
controlled by the major power whose hexes surround them.
The USSR may surrender at any time during its first war with Japan.
In addition to hexes given up as described above, all hexes on the
Pacific map are surrendered to Japan. Japan may surrender at any
time to the USSR during their first war. In addition to hexes given
up as described above, Japan also cedes Manchuria to the USSR.

MWIF however, reverts hexes automatically in any major power home country which are retaken to the major power who controls that home country. That's not RAW and in this case causes a bug IMHO, because Peking needs to become USSR controlled (as any other hex which was taken by the USSR in China).

[Orm]

The implication: Peking which is still Japanese controlled is surrounded by the Soviets. If peace is forced and these hexes are indeed Soviet controlled then Peking becomes Soviet controlled and those Chinese hexes liberated by the Soviets remain Soviet. However; if the surrounding hexes are Chinese controlled when peace is forced then Peking remains Japanese controlled and Japan could march back in/out of Peking. Even as I write this I'm confused as to what is correct according to WIF 7 Rules as Written. So any/all rules expertise is appreciated.

I agree with Centuur.

The practical difference here is however minor. And they can be solved anyway. Houseruling here is needed anyway since the rule is not implemented.

The Peking hex, and other hexes captured by USSR in China should remain Soviet controlled. Unless, of course, USSR decided to revert those hexes back to China.

And if the Peking hex is Soviet controlled, then the surrounded Japanese unit is 'teleported' to the closest Japanese controlled hex.

That the hexes are Chinese controlled instead of Soviet controlled makes little difference. The only practical one I can think of is that China is allowed to produce by the blue Peking factory if a resource can be transported there. (and this can ofc be solved in production by idling the factory)

So, if peace is made, let the Japanese player move his unit out of Peking to a Japan controlled hex. And then let a Soviet unit enter Peking. Problem solved. Just do not let Chinese units enter those 'Soviet' hexes.

And since the war status remains, the Soviet player can have their units in the hexes captured in China even if they are Chinese controlled instead of Soviet.

And lastly, remember that the foreign HQ rule applies in those hexes in China regardless of whether they are controlled by China, or USSR. So this makes no difference at all.

[Angeldust2]

MWIF however, reverts hexes automatically in any major power home country which are retaken to the major power who controls that home country. That's not RAW and in this case causes a bug IMHO, because Peking needs to become USSR controlled (as any other hex which was taken by the USSR in China).

Unfortunately I am afraid, you might be right. But how to address such situation? I am not so much concerned about the game described by Ronnie in the opening post, because we are using a not fully coded optional rule (Option 50: Soviet-Japan compulsory peace) in a game where Soviet has declared war on Japan early and has managed to not only conquer Manchuria, but also to envelope a still Japanese controlled Peking. How often has this happened before, using MWIF? Probably not once and it will most likely not happen ever again.

But what about similar situation in France 1940, before the fall of Paris? If CW launches a successful counterattack on Lille, which happens from time to time, the hex immdiately reverts back to France. In game terms, it means, France has 2 more factories producing immediately, and France can potentially deploy reinforcements immediately, when city is free of CW units. All of this should not be the case, if players would agree to overrule the way MWIF handles the current situation, which is decribed as an intentional, but undocumented deviation of RAW.

[Courtenay]

You are right in that France should not be able to use those two factories using RAW (although the CW could theoretically use the red factory), however, if the CW were to revert Lille back to France at his first opportunity, then France would be able to put new units into Lille next turn, assuming that somehow the CW had been able to move its units out of Lille, and no Axis units had moved in.