The Fate of Gunboats

[Jaguar1]

I love the game and the new patch looks to be excellent. Congrats to the Team!!

A very small item I've noticed (or not noticed, in this case) is that damage to gunboats that comes about for whatever reason does not seem to be reported anywhere. Likewise, I haven't noticed the destruction of entire gunboat units noted. On several occasions I've been surprised to find gunboats I was counting on to continue a siege simply disappeared during my subsequent movement phase came up. Perhaps a line item could be included in the end-of-turn reports indicating the destruction of and/or damage to gunboats (and reason) and likewise any repair info?

Again, many thanks for an outstanding game. I plan to recommend FoF to my Civil War Roundtable discussion group.

Ron

[Johnus]

I think you need to be careful where and when you move your gunboats. If you move them into enemy territory to help with a siege, and the besieging army fails to also move into said territory, I think you may lose the gunboats for being unsupported.

[Twotribes]

Yes that seems to be true.

[Jaguar1]

I agree that there are multiple ways to lose your gunboats. My thought is, however, that it would be great if the game reported those events and the underlying reasons e.g., supply/support or combat.

[Twotribes]

Agreed. I have lost them due to what must be a supply situation. No enemy present and in a controlled province.

I now check via supply function if the province they are in is positive supply. Whats worse is you can not see their strength go down.

[Jaguar1]

Good advice for checking supply sit in province. My experience has often been like yours: the gunboat seems happy and healthy then... poof, it's history. Hate it when that happens.

[General Quarters]

It is puzzling that, when you click on the gunboat, the strength shows and, if you pass your cursor over the area below, popups show the quality and supply, but you kinda have to go feeling for them in the dark. It would be nice if that information appeared without having to uncover it.

[ericbabe]

I believe the rule is that gunboats and siege artillery alone in provinces containing only other enemy units are simply disbanded at the end of all the movement sub-phases.

[Twotribes]

ORIGINAL: ericbabe

I believe the rule is that gunboats and siege artillery alone in provinces containing only other enemy units are simply disbanded at the end of all the movement sub-phases.

That is not the problem though, I have had them vanish in controlled provinces with no enemy forces. And the interface does not work like other units, you can not easily see supply level, status or strength level.

I have learned to keep the same gunboats no longer than 2 or 3 turns in a siege. I make double what I need and rotate them in and out on long sieges. I have not learned how to see supply or changing strength has someone posted above. And I make sure the province they are in has positive supply.

[Yogi the Great]

For what it's worth, I have been a bit surprised as well to see how easily gun boats dissappear.  Almost has made me wonder if it is worth the time and resouces to bother building them. 
 
Almost seems like the enemy is able to swim out in force, board and take over boats in the river. [;)]
 
Well, I'm still working on how to deal with it and getting over the surprises of where the heck did my boat go.  Wonder if there is any change in the new patch on this?

[Yogi the Great]

One more thought - seems like it would be hard to actually create and keep enough gunboats to "duplicate" the historical situation on the rivers and still be able to adequately carry out all other asppects of the war.

[Drex]

How many gunboats participated in actual civil war combat? Wouldn't you need them to besiege a river province city? In the game, you don't need them.

[Mike Scholl]

ORIGINAL: ericbabe

I believe the rule is that gunboats and siege artillery alone in provinces containing only other enemy units are simply disbanded at the end of all the movement sub-phases.

Which is really rather odd as Union Gunboats often ranged the rivers far ahead of their armies. Foote sailed down the Mississippi to meet up with Farragut at Vicksburg after Memphis and Island #10 fell. And Grant's gunboats penetrated the Tennessee all the way to Mussel Shoals well before the Army came up as far as Pittsburg Landing.

[Erik Rutins]

True - in FOF gunboats are not really used for that type of raiding, but they are the quickest and cheapest way to get a siege bonus when dealing with fortificatinos on a river. It would be great in the future to be able to model more of the riverine battles and some of the other gunboat operations.

[dude]

ORIGINAL: ericbabe

I believe the rule is that gunboats and siege artillery alone in provinces containing only other enemy units are simply disbanded at the end of all the movement sub-phases.

Ok, if so then there's a bug... I've been playing the beta... and now the the new patch and in two games I saw gunboats that wouldn't die... see the screenshot from my current game with the new patch installed (though the game was started under the beta.)

Dude



ps... I shoud say they've been sitting there in those provinces for a year... (it's Jan 1863) and the AI (CSA) hasn't been in them in all that time.

[General Quarters]

ORIGINAL: ericbabe

I believe the rule is that gunboats and siege artillery alone in provinces containing only other enemy units are simply disbanded at the end of all the movement sub-phases.

They also die if there are friendly units but they are inside cities. For example, if a Union gunboat is in the Cairo area, and the city is held by friendly forces, the gunboat dies when the CSA moves into conduct a siege, even if the siege is unsuccessful. This does not seem right, since a gunboat would presumably find a safe haven in the unconquered city.

[dude]

I finally had to remove them the hard way... I edited the save game file and changed their prov. locations to CSA territory.  The promptly reinforced both our gunboats, and allowed production to restart in both places.
 
Only wish I had thought of it sooner.  I kept expecting them to either die or move... they did neither.
 
Dude

[Twotribes]

The AI doesn't follow the same rules as us....

[showboat1]

It never does, the damned cheater....

[Gil R.]

Dude, do you still have save files with those immortal gunboats? If so, you should zip them up and send them to ericbabe@west-civ.com, with a detailed explanation of what was happening. This seems like a bug which, while rare, still ought to be fixed.