The Queen of Battle: The Infantry

[KG Erwin]

One of the reasons I think that the "old" SPWaW crowd doesn't hang around here much anymore is because the game NOW recognizes the true "queen" : the infantry.

In truth, the riflemen dominated each and every battlefield of the war, no matter the terrain or the weather.

It took a while for the game code to recognize this basic truth, but now the lessons of combined-arms warfare are accounted for.

[azraelck]

It is entirely due to the fact that SPWaW recognized that infantry is the "queen" of the battle field, and the fact that you can achieve some semblance of effective combined arms engagements within the confines of the engine that caused me to give it more than just a cursory play. SPWaW is not the first WWII strategy game I've played, and certainly not the first strategy game period. It's one of only three that have maintained a healthy level of interest, and is the only one to have maintained continual playing (though work has certainly killed that!). While it's certainly nice to just blow the hell out of something every once in a while, I have other games more suited to mindless destruction. Even when confined to World War II settings. SPWaW keeps my interest simply because I can play a combined arms battle, and not expect that an enemy with masses of tanks will easily overrun and wipe me out because I have rifle companies instead of masses of tanks.  

[Kuokkanen]

ORIGINAL: azraelck

It's one of only three that have maintained a healthy level of interest

What are other two?

[azraelck]

Heroes of Might and Magic II and Age of Wonders. Both fantasy TBS, though of far different scale and design. Both also more of economy management and troop deployment than actual strategy. There's also Medieval: Total War, but it's relatively new, it's not been on three computers straight,  or in the case of HOMMII, on it's 7th straight.

Oddly enough, I was actually looking for a platoon-or-lower- level TBS, not battalion level when I found SPWaW. I still haven't found one close to what I was actually looking for, but I'm quite happy with what I did find. Particularly since it turned out to be free, at least for the regular version.

[Kuokkanen]

ORIGINAL: azraelck

Oddly enough, I was actually looking for a platoon-or-lower- level TBS, not battalion level when I found SPWaW.

There are scenarios and campaigns where number of forces are at or below company. I recall playing some scenario where player had very small force, could had been only two tanks with elite crews (cannon could be fired some 8 times). That was with over 10 year old Steel Panthers though, but it can be converted for SPWAW if it isn't done already.

And sure I know HOMM serie, I've played HOMM3. AOM isn't that familiar though. Anyways I feel more comfortable with scifi than fantasy.

[Goblin]

ORIGINAL: KG Erwin

One of the reasons I think that the "old" SPWaW crowd doesn't hang around here much anymore is because the game NOW recognizes the true "queen" : the infantry.

[8|]

[azraelck]

ORIGINAL: Matti Kuokkanen
There are scenarios and campaigns where number of forces are at or below company. I recall playing some scenario where player had very small force, could had been only two tanks with elite crews (cannon could be fired some 8 times). That was with over 10 year old Steel Panthers though, but it can be converted for SPWAW if it isn't done already.

And sure I know HOMM serie, I've played HOMM3. AOM isn't that familiar though. Anyways I feel more comfortable with scifi than fantasy.

I was referring more to manuvering each member of my platoon/squad, rather than the en masse manuvering. I know there's a few small scenarios flaoting around, though there's so many, I couldn't begin to tell you which is which.

I didn't like HOMMIII as much as I did II, or even the original. I have it, or did, but I lost the disc. That shows how much I liked it, I have every game I've ever purchased for the PC/Commodore 64. I also copied all the older games that I could onto CDRs, since now I don't even have a 3.5" floppy, much less a 5.25". I even have all the games I purchased for consoles as well, but I don't have the systems hooked up anymore, and no emulators or anything to play them.

[Alby]

"Queen" of the battlefield???
[&:]

[KG Erwin]

ORIGINAL: Alby

"Queen" of the battlefield???
[&:]

I thought about that, but what's the most powerful piece on a chessboard? It ain't the king. [;)]

[Riun T]

Ya but the game will continue if the king survives!!

[KG Erwin]

ORIGINAL: Riun T

Ya but the game will continue if the king survives!!

I guess in SPWaW terms that would be the Battalion HQ.

[KG Erwin]

ORIGINAL: Goblin

ORIGINAL: KG Erwin

One of the reasons I think that the "old" SPWaW crowd doesn't hang around here much anymore is because the game NOW recognizes the true "queen" : the infantry.

[8|]

Goblin, you have an aversion to "queens"? Oh, you brute. I might have to smack you with my purse (a cleverly-disguised satchel charge). [:D]

[Bernie]

ORIGINAL: KG Erwin

One of the reasons I think that the "old" SPWaW crowd doesn't hang around here much anymore is because the game NOW recognizes the true "queen" : the infantry.

Huh?

This statement would only make sense if the "old crowd" gave up the game entirely, which we know they haven't.

[Goblin]

ORIGINAL: KG Erwin

ORIGINAL: Goblin

ORIGINAL: KG Erwin

One of the reasons I think that the "old" SPWaW crowd doesn't hang around here much anymore is because the game NOW recognizes the true "queen" : the infantry.

[8|]

Goblin, you have an aversion to "queens"? Oh, you brute. I might have to smack you with my purse (a cleverly-disguised satchel charge). [:D]

Nope, just an aversion to whatever the hell you are smoking when you type in stuff like that. Anyone who has been here for any length of time knows why the old crowd hangs out here less, and it has nothing to do with infantry being dangerous on the battlefield (which it has been for numerous versions, and one of the reasons I fell in love with the game, and chose Goblin as my screen name).


Goblin

[KG Erwin]

ORIGINAL: Bernie

ORIGINAL: KG Erwin

One of the reasons I think that the "old" SPWaW crowd doesn't hang around here much anymore is because the game NOW recognizes the true "queen" : the infantry.

Huh?

This statement would only make sense if the "old crowd" gave up the game entirely, which we know they haven't.

Nah, we haven't given it up, but are definitely getting older. [X(]

BTW, Bernie, don't forget to send Wild Bill greetings for his 70th birthday.

[Steve Wilcox]

double post . . . [:o]

[Steve Wilcox]

ORIGINAL: Alby

"Queen" of the battlefield???
[&:]

Don't know if you're unfamiliar with the term, or just curious as to why it's called that, but if the former is the case, Queen of Battle is a fairly common term for the infantry:

http://www.tomahawks.us/queen_of_battle.htm

https://www.infantry.army.mil/museum/mi ... ritage.htm
(near and at the bottom)

https://www.infantry.army.mil/infantry/
(at the top)

First saw the term in Squad Leader's designer's notes back in '77 or '78 (page 32).

And if the latter is the case, just ignore this. [:)]

[KG Erwin]

The truth of the matter is that the relationship between armor and infantry on the mid to latter-20th century battlefield is mutually dependent.

This is a basic concept in the latest incarnation of SPWaW. Infantry CAN exist without armor support, but armor WITHOUT infantry support is doomed.

This is tactical lesson number one: NEVER advance armor into hostile territory without infantry support. The old -style tactics of using armor as 19th century cavalry will only result in a Custer-style massacre. They will blindly advance, get isolated, and be destroyed one by one . The crews will be killed. This is NOT the way to go.

[Bernie]

ORIGINAL: KG Erwin

ORIGINAL: Bernie

ORIGINAL: KG Erwin

One of the reasons I think that the "old" SPWaW crowd doesn't hang around here much anymore is because the game NOW recognizes the true "queen" : the infantry.

Huh?

This statement would only make sense if the "old crowd" gave up the game entirely, which we know they haven't.

Nah, we haven't given it up, but are definitely getting older. [X(]

Then why did you make such a statement?

The truth of the matter is that the "old crowd", as you term them, are still very active in the SP:WaW community, which in itself is quite robust and healthy. That they aren't "here" at Matrix, as much as they once were can be attributed to a number of reasons, but I think the bigget of those would be that they now have several choices of places to "hang out".

Back, "in the day", MGF was "the" place to hang out, if your were a SP:WaW player, because it was just about the only forum SP:WaW players had. Nowadays they have a few more choices to chose from, like the town that had just a single bar or pub, that suddenly has a few new ones open. It may take awhile, but eventually folks do their relaxing and socializing at the place that best suits them and offers them what they want.

[Orzel Bialy]

Glenn, got to agree with Bernie and Eric.

The manner in which you worded that opening statement looks like an intentional poke in the eye at the "old crowd" members who don't hang around here any more or as much...on the basis that they may have "ran away" because the infantry had suddenly become a force to be reckoned with over the vaunted tank.

As Bernie and Eric mentioned the factors surrounding the real reasons why some of the old crowd doesn't frequent this forum run the range of the rainbow...from just plain "moving on" to finding new forums to post on. I too doubt it has very little to do with the game itself.