5 Weeks to Christmas Sale-Which to buy

[ravincravin]

5 weeks to the Christmas sale and I need help making decisions. Being A WIPAE player I'm looking to expand to the European front. Which one will it be:

MH Commander-Europe at War
Time of Fury
Strategic War in Europe

Which one has the most features and best AI. I'm more interested in playability over realism. I like a game that allows you a "what if" strategy. Your help and feedback would be appreciated by this ol' sarge.

[doomtrader]

I think that at this moment, nobody is able to tell which games are going to be available during the sale.

[Tac2i]

Check out Advanced Tactics Gold... it has outstanding re-playability with its Random Scenario Creator.

[ravincravin]

Thanks for the heads up. I'll check it out.

[Rasputitsa]

ORIGINAL: ravincravin
5 weeks to the Christmas sale and I need help making decisions. Being A WIPAE player I'm looking to expand to the European front. Which one will it be:

MH Commander-Europe at War
Time of Fury
Strategic War in Europe

Which one has the most features and best AI. I'm more interested in playability over realism. I like a game that allows you a "what if" strategy. Your help and feedback would be appreciated by this ol' sarge.

I have C-EaW, with Grand Strategy mod (soon to be updated to ver. 2.1) and Time of Fury, what I know about Strategic War in Europe comes from the forums and its similarity to ToF. I have enjoyed the first two games, but not sure if the scale of SWiE will interest me.

Of the three games, Time of Fury is more detailed, without being overwhelming in scale. The in-game preferences and settings allow for a wide choice of game play and appearance. The game is easy to mod and several GUI, map and unit icon mods are already available. The working files of the game are easily accessible and can be edited in 'notepad', or 'excel'. If I find game design decisions are questionable, I can change quite a lot, with the warning that the game is the result of extensive game testing and changes can have unexpected results. Several modded scenarios are already available in the forum, aimed at greater realism.

The game is on ver. 1.03 beta, but there have been problems, see forum for details, I am sure they will be resolved soon and early versions on the game patched to 1.01 are fine. There have been complaints about the AI, but that is standard in these games, they all generate complaints.

There is a lot of depth in the game when you see how much you can do with the game system, there have been complaints about lack of detail in the manual, but I have been able to come to grips with the game and the flexibility is brilliant.

The game is covering the Atlantic to the Urals, from North Norway to the Sahara, mostly at Corps/Korps level, but with the option to use Divisions and split any units into yet smaller packets, all of which can be renamed, so you can change and organise however you wish, you are not fixed into a rigid framework. This is a big ask for a game system and sometimes odd things will happen, but war is hell and this game puts the unexpected back in the mix, it will either frustrate, or excite you (probably both).

These are all high command level games, where you are thinking grand strategy, a little politics, production and research development, with many features abstracted, which is a relief from micro management, sometimes it's nice to just have fun, without taking forever to play, so this will not match WiTP/AE, or WitE, but there is a great level of detail to get into if you want. The game doesn't go into any of these aspects in great detail, but the interplay between these sometimes conflicting features, makes for many varied possibilities.

There's more, but it's all in the forum, personal opinion, but my vote goes with Time of Fury.[:)]

[ravincravin]

Thanks Rasputitsa. Just what I am looking for, an informative opinion. Gives me something to think about and research further. 4 weels 5 days left before the sale.

[Rasputitsa]

Realising that I have expressed my own bias, I should say something more about MH-CEaW (or available in the Matrix version). There is the basic game, but also the Grand Strategy mod (mod has semi-official status), which is designed to make the game more realistic. Comments refer to CEaW-GS (CEaW with Grand Strategy mod), but much applies to both versions.

The game has been out long enough to be well out of the teething problem zone and works well, looks great, the scale is different from ToF, having 20 day turns instead of ToF near 1 week turns (48 turns per ToF game year), so CEaW-GS plays through much more quickly and units are on bigger scale. This means that there are a lot less units to shovel round the map, but when you lose one, it make a big hole.

Similar features of production and research, but even more abstracted. This really is grand strategy, with combat mainly there to resolve your strategic decisions. CEaw-GS is a good option for an enjoyable game, same possibilities for wide reaching strategic possibilities, without so much the detail.

I suppose ToF becomes a halfway house between the intense detail of WiTP/AE and the quicker gameplay of CEaW-GS, with SWiE even quicker, with a whole game playable in a day.

It all depends on how much you want to give up on the micro-management, or whether you still want to meddle and manage your forces somewhat, either CEaW, or ToF, are good options, which come off the shelf readily, whilst more expensive games gather dust, because there just isn't the time.

CEaW is the safe option, mature in development, whilst ToF is still developing, but has much more to offer and so many more options, preferences and mods available than CEaW-GS. The reward is that you can set ToF up in so many ways and tailor it to your taste, but you have to be prepared to go through and understand these options and the modding potential, to get the full benefit. CEaW, accepted that you either use the basic game, or apply the GS mod, but after that decision, it's just turn the key and go.[:)]

PS, the three tiles you specified are all grand strategy, covering the whole of the European war, I guess that is the main interest, as although there are a lot of other titles to mention, which may come into any offers, but will not be in this category.

[ravincravin]

Thanks for the additional info Rasputitsa. I have a duplicate post in the MHCEaW forum at Slitherine and been getting replies from their fanboys there.

Originally I was leaning toward MHCEaW but now think ToF will fill the bill. The reason is what you said in your posts and, according to their fanboys, MHCEaW is not working on the AI anymore. They said that the GS 2.0 patch has actually made the AI less viable a factor due to the increased options opened up in the patch.

I guess I want something besides a play-by-email game. I'm not afraid of micromanaging. In fact, I micromanage Distant Worlds until my empire gets so large I can't do it anymore. Only then will I give up some management to my govenors. So ToF doesn't scare me.

Thanks again. Any more input is always welcome.

[Rasputitsa]

ORIGINAL: ravincravin
Thanks for the additional info Rasputitsa. I have a duplicate post in the MHCEaW forum at Slitherine and been getting replies from their fanboys there.

Originally I was leaning toward MHCEaW but now think ToF will fill the bill. The reason is what you said in your posts and, according to their fanboys, MHCEaW is not working on the AI anymore. They said that the GS 2.0 patch has actually made the AI less viable a factor due to the increased options opened up in the patch.

I guess I want something besides a play-by-email game. I'm not afraid of micromanaging. In fact, I micromanage Distant Worlds until my empire gets so large I can't do it anymore. Only then will I give up some management to my govenors. So ToF doesn't scare me.

Thanks again. Any more input is always welcome.

The ToF forum will highlight the present status of the game, I have a bias as I have used the earlier games 'Storm in the Pacific' and 'Time of Wrath' I have become familiar with the way the games can be modded and adjusted to suit. I don't claim to be a modding expert, far from it, put I have gained enough knowledge to work on the files to get the best 'look' to the game and adjust some of the gameplay features. I like the ability to adjust the game with a view to achieving more realism, or using self imposed restrictions, where the game is lacking.

For example I think that railways come back into use for an invader much too quickly, especially in Russia, so I have adjusted the files to slow down rail repair and don't use rail even when it's available. Amphibious operations, you can throw in a D-Day type operation with hardly any preparation, provide you have the PPs, so I've been working on a framework of self imposed time restrictions on mounting amphibious operations.

The point of all this is that you will find features that you think are wrong, but often there is a fix you can work through yourself, the game is going to be as good as you make it. [:)]

[gwgardner]

Haven't played Commander:Europe at War. I can only say that ToF is THE game I've been wanting on the computer since home computers were invented - it's the closest to giving me the feel of the beloved table top game War in Europe of 40 years ago. The upcoming 1.03beta3 patch to ToF bodes fair to resolving the biggest outstanding issues with the game.

Strategic War in Europe is on a grand strategic level that normally would not appeal to me, but I'm beginning to like it after modding it. There's no way it compares to ToF however, in appeal to me.

[Qwixt]

ORIGINAL: Webizen

Check out Advanced Tactics Gold... it has outstanding re-playability with its Random Scenario Creator.

How do the AI's compare between the two games? There seems to be a lot of complaining about the AI of the two games.