Mines No Longer Effective in 2.0?

[KevinRohrer]

I am the Jap player and sent two TFs of three subs each to Brisbane and Nomea on minelaying missions. The mines are there and US TFs have moved into both ports but haven't hit any mines. Each TF has at least ten ships in it and no minesweepers. What could be wrong?

[Ross Moorhouse]

Dont know but i do know in the PBEM game I am in at present the Allies hit the mines I laid at Port Moresby. One of the MSW hit it and was reported as sunk.

[mogami]

Hi, one of my CV hit a mine last turn. &^%$

[SamRo]

I recon they are less frequent but they still happen, I have not had a mine damage a ship since applying version 2 & if anything I am using more mines!!! shore its just coincident, but just thought I would add my experience.

[corbulo]

I had a MSW go down recently as it was clearing a minefield after a destoyer was damaged going though it. Adding insult to injury. My experience is that offensive minefields are deadly, but defensive minefields(mines in a hex one owns) are useless in stopping anything, not worth the effort.

[bilbow]

From what I've seen, offensive mines with 2.0 are far more effective than before.

In one game my IJN opponent seeded Wampuko with a sub or two worth of mines. I've lost several ships so far including a DMS. And that's with all entries to the hex accompanied by sweepers. Time is early June 42.

In another game, I'm the IJN and have been seeding PM with sub mines. My opponent has lost 4 MSW ships so far and it's still May 42.

Both games are snenario 17.

[NorthStar]

. . . when this happens.

Right now over in the Bugs forum, there is a very hot thread of people complaining that mines are too effective!

[Mike Wood]

Hello...

Please note that mines are spaced though out the entire hex, except in the case of a base, where they are placed in and around the harbor and shoreline. This means they will only attack task forces coming close to shore, such as transport invasion task forces, which the mines will attack at double normal strength.

Also, note that the message that a minesweeper has cleared a path through a minefield does not mean the hex is safe, as there may be a number of minefields in the hex.

And, in the next release version, the chances of a miesweeper hitting a mine have been significantly reduced.

Hope this helps...

Michael Wood
Lead Programmer,
Matrix Games

[KevinRohrer]

Originally posted by Mike Wood
Hello...

Please note that mines are spaced though out the entire hex, except in the case of a base, where they are placed in and around the harbor and shoreline. This means they will only attack task forces coming close to shore, such as transport invasion task forces, which the mines will attack at double normal strength.

[P]
Mike,
[P]
1. Will ships hit mines if they are docked (i.e. loading/unloading).
[P]
2. Will they hit mines if their task force has been disbanded in that hex?

[Mike Wood]

Hello...

Mines at a base will usually only attack ships of the player who does not own the base (enemy ships). These cannot dock or disband.

Hope this Helps...

Michael Wood
_________________________________________________

Originally posted by KevinRohrer

[P]
Mike,
[P]
1. Will ships hit mines if they are docked (i.e. loading/unloading).
[P]
2. Will they hit mines if their task force has been disbanded in that hex?

[Apollo11]

Hi all,

Originally posted by Mike Wood
Hello...

Please note that mines are spaced though out the entire hex, except in the case of a base, where they are placed in and around the harbor and shoreline. This means they will only attack task forces coming close to shore, such as transport invasion task forces, which the mines will attack at double normal strength.

Also, note that the message that a minesweeper has cleared a path through a minefield does not mean the hex is safe, as there may be a number of minefields in the hex.

And, in the next release version, the chances of a miesweeper hitting a mine have been significantly reduced.

Hope this helps...

Michael Wood
Lead Programmer,
Matrix Games

In other words you are saying that whenever there is base (or "dot") and
minefields that those minefields are only laid in vicinity of harbour and
shoreline?

Also, for other HEXes, you said that mines are spread out (spaced) through
entire area.


This is very interesting and helpful info...


Only now I understand why minefields had no (i.e. ZERO) impact on bombardment
TFs and submarines in HEXes where there is base (or "dot").

The bombardment TF would never come close enough to shore to hit anything and
the submarines would wait outside harbour (and therefore also be to far away
from minefield).

Thanks Mike!


Leo "Apollo11"

[derwho]

I got smaked really badly when playing #13 as Allies and trying to assault Shortland Islands early on in the game (playing v2.0). I had a invasion tf consisting of a few cruisers, five destroyers, approx 10 AK's and numerous LST's loaded with troops to assault Shortland. Got there fine, but lacking any minesweeping capacity I had 4-5 ships hitting mines every turn while unloading and shorebatterys wrecked havoc on my TF. I got Shortland but only 3DD's and 2AK's returned to Lunga the rest having met their end fighting.

[bobman5352]

I have a related question? What is the reasoning behind reporting mine hits and mine sweeping to the enemy? As is, they function as mobile sensors on fleet movements (e.g., if I want to build a base at Nevea, I have to sweep the mines first, and my opponent knows something's up), which can be annoying.

[mogami]

Hi, The reports were supposed to be "Allied" and "Japanese" but replay problems and people not understanding the reports were supposed to differ led to only one report. Now it is a choice of what to report (that both see) and what not to report (that no one see's) I preferred the 2 differing reports but the IJN could always "watch" the allied report. I think it is this reason that led to only one report. If the combatreport.txt could somehow be incorperated into the player turn it would make for better (different) reports. The combat.txt is a vital tool for playing and recording (AAR) games. But I do think there needs to be two points of view. This I'm sure is a nightmare request for the programmers but it most certainly needs to be considered for WITP

[Dunedain]

I agree, Mogami. There needs to be two discreet reports that are encrypted for each
player as a part of the replay files. So that only the Japanese player can see his own mine
sweeping activity and jap ships that have hit mines, and only the U.S. player can see
his own such reports.

[1089]

Originally posted by Dunedain
I agree, Mogami. There needs to be two discreet reports that are encrypted for each
player as a part of the replay files. So that only the Japanese player can see his own mine
sweeping activity and jap ships that have hit mines, and only the U.S. player can see
his own such reports.

But wouldn't the coastwatchers report some of the Japanese ships that hit mines?

kp

[herbieh]

I love mines, and I cant wait to sow thousands in WIP with my B29s, I wish I could so them with my PBYs in UV, as they actually were doing in 1943, ( Kavieg was abandoned because of mines, not air attacks) but some of you out there probably would think that was dis honorable or sneaky.


Mines never tire, never sleep, and never discriminate

PS Beer is good

Skippy was OK too
Bomb New zealand into dust
Poms please send a proper cricket team
Aussies rule:D

[mogami]

Originally posted by 1089



But wouldn't the coastwatchers report some of the Japanese ships that hit mines?

kp

Hi, Sure, Sometimes.....but not always. And how a coast watcher could tell the IJN was sweeping mines at night (ok but not every night is a full moon, and it rains a lot too. I think Allied report on Japanese actions should be more detailed then Japanese report on Allied actions. But then again there are lapses.)

[dpstafford]

Originally posted by bilbow
From what I've seen, offensive mines with 2.0 are far more effective than before.

In one game my IJN opponent seeded Wampuko with a sub or two worth of mines. I've lost several ships so far including a DMS. And that's with all entries to the hex accompanied by sweepers. Time is early June 42.

In another game, I'm the IJN and have been seeding PM with sub mines. My opponent has lost 4 MSW ships so far and it's still May 42.

Actually, I "seeded" Wampuko with surface MineLayer's. Right Under your nose, so to speak. Pretty nasty, eh?
My only comment on the effectiveness of mines is this: WHEN did Matrix make the change that minesweepers now prefer to clear mines MY RAMMING THEM?!? MineSweeper losses WHILE minesweeping is completely out-of-control..........!

[mogami]

Hi, Minesweeping is getting a tweak as well. I saw one of Arto's minesweepers (Wa-20 I think) it was clearing mines at Cairns

Wa-20 clears a path through mine
Wa-20 hits Mk-10 mine
Wa-20 widens path through mines
Wa-20 hits MK-10 mine
Wa-20 widens path through mines
Wa-20 hits MK-10 mine
" "
" "

Wa-20 sinks