Dec '44 -ENDGAME- IJN Battleline committed to Formosa waters

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tabpub
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5 Battleships accounted for

Post by tabpub »

Here is a small segment of the fighting in Formosan/Okinawan waters.
Over the period of 3-4 days, thousands of sorties were made from land bases in China and approximately 12-15 American CV/CVL and 5 English CV versus AF, transports off Okinawa and IJN surface units. IJN losses were staggering, as the IJA fighters could not keep the strikes from hitting home. IJA strike a/c were also attrited heavily; though, two KAMIKAZE did strike 2 carriers, which were moderately damaged and retired while still operating a/c (damage was around 25-30 on each).

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Sing to the tune of "Man on the Flying Trapeze"
..Oh! We fly o'er the treetops with inches to spare,
There's smoke in the cockpit and gray in my hair.
The tracers look fine as a strafin' we go.
But, brother, we're TOO God damn low...
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Capt. Harlock
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RE: 5 Battleships accounted for

Post by Capt. Harlock »

Over the period of 3-4 days, thousands of sorties were made from land bases in China and approximately 12-15 American CV/CVL and 5 English CV versus AF, transports off Okinawa and IJN surface units. IJN losses were staggering, as the IJA fighters could not keep the strikes from hitting home.

Spectacular! What was the damage to the RN cruisers?
Civil war? What does that mean? Is there any foreign war? Isn't every war fought between men, between brothers?

--Victor Hugo
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tabpub
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RE: 5 Battleships accounted for

Post by tabpub »

ORIGINAL: Capt. Harlock
Over the period of 3-4 days, thousands of sorties were made from land bases in China and approximately 12-15 American CV/CVL and 5 English CV versus AF, transports off Okinawa and IJN surface units. IJN losses were staggering, as the IJA fighters could not keep the strikes from hitting home.

Spectacular! What was the damage to the RN cruisers?

CL Dragon is a hulk in Swatow harbor (98/56); will probably remain there for the duration
CA Suffolk and DD Grenville are in the 60's for SYS and 20's for FLT; when pumped out, will transfer to either Camrahn Bay or Singapore for repair, but will likely miss the end of hostilities also.
The only loss that I can see was the Dutch DD Tjerk Hiddes; I don't remember any others.
Losses have been greater at the landings at Takao that I have just done and will report on later this weekend. 3 Divisions are ashore, but 2 DD were sunk by 8" CD fire; at least 4-5 LST will probably sink soon and 2 AP are in a hard way right now with fires aboard.

Here is the total reports that I have for the fighting around Swatow. In the end, it was evident that the IJ ships had used most of their ammo up; in the final engagement, the English ships closed to under 10000 yds (perhaps as close as 5k, I don't recall for sure) in a long daylight shooting spree. The air attacks must have drained the light guns of most of their ammo; plus the damage to the upperworks of the heavy ships.
Report follows:

Losses during the fighting:

Canton: DD Meredith, while escorting Alabama vs. IJN Mikuma, Kinugasa and escorts. All Japs sunk; Alabama 1 torpedo hit, retires to Canton harbor

Outside Canton: 7 MSW to Mikuma force the night before Canton action.

Swatow:

Day Air attack on TF, near Swatow at 46,42
Allied aircraft
Thunderbolt II x 2
Mosquito FB.VI x 14
P-40N Warhawk x 47
P-38J Lightning x 43
A-20G Havoc x 32
B-25J Mitchell x 40
B-24J Liberator x 2
Allied aircraft losses
Mosquito FB.VI: 1 damaged
Japanese Ships
DD Makigumo, Shell hits 20, Bomb hits 1, on fire
BB Kirishima, Bomb hits 4, on fire
CA Mogami, Shell hits 8, Bomb hits 1
CA Tone, Shell hits 12, Bomb hits 1
BB Haruna, Bomb hits 4, on fire
DD Yugumo, Shell hits 20

Hellcat II x 23
Corsair IV x 5
Firefly x 11
Barracuda x 28
Avenger II x 5
B-24J Liberator x 13
No Allied losses
Japanese Ships
BB Haruna, Bomb hits 5, Torpedo hits 1, on fire
BB Kirishima, Bomb hits 2, Torpedo hits 5, on fire, heavy damage
DD Makigumo, on fire

F6F Hellcat x 19
SB2C Helldiver x 28
TBM Avenger x 14
Allied aircraft losses
SB2C Helldiver: 3 damaged
Japanese Ships
BB Kirishima, on fire, heavy damage
BB Haruna, Bomb hits 3, Torpedo hits 3, on fire, heavy damage
CA Tone, Bomb hits 1, on fire
DD Yugumo

Day Air attack on TF, near Swatow at 46,42
Japanese aircraft
Ki-43-IIa Oscar x 6
Allied aircraft
P-40N Warhawk x 35
P-38J Lightning x 58
A-20G Havoc x 55
B-25J Mitchell x 46
Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-43-IIa Oscar: 5 destroyed
Allied aircraft losses
A-20G Havoc: 12 damaged
B-25J Mitchell: 1 destroyed, 15 damaged
Japanese Ships
BB Yamato, Bomb hits 10, on fire
BB Musashi, Bomb hits 3, on fire

P-38J Lightning x 31
PB4Y Liberator x 3
B-24J Liberator x 17
Allied aircraft losses
PB4Y Liberator: 3 damaged
B-24J Liberator: 1 destroyed, 8 damaged
Japanese Ships
BB Haruna, Bomb hits 5, on fire
BB Kirishima, Bomb hits 2

Day Air attack on TF, near Swatow at 46,42
Japanese aircraft
Ki-43-IIa Oscar x 2
Allied aircraft
Thunderbolt II x 5
A-20G Havoc x 18
B-25J Mitchell x 38
B-24J Liberator x 16
Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-43-IIa Oscar: 1 destroyed
Allied aircraft losses
A-20G Havoc: 2 damaged
B-25J Mitchell: 1 destroyed, 7 damaged
B-24J Liberator: 4 damaged
Japanese Ships
CL Abukuma, Bomb hits 2, on fire
BB Kirishima, Bomb hits 1
BB Haruna, Bomb hits 7, on fire
CA Tone

Day Air attack on TF, near Swatow at 46,42
Allied aircraft
PB4Y Liberator x 15
B-24J Liberator x 69
Allied aircraft losses
PB4Y Liberator: 1 damaged
B-24J Liberator: 1 destroyed, 3 damaged
Japanese Ships
BB Kirishima, Bomb hits 15, on fire
BB Haruna, Bomb hits 5, on fire
CA Mogami
DD Teruzuki
CL Abukuma, Bomb hits 2, on fire

Day Time Surface Combat, near Swatow at 46,42
Japanese Ships
BB Yamato, Shell hits 6, on fire
BB Musashi, Shell hits 3, on fire
DD Amatsukaze, Shell hits 2, on fire
DD Yamakaze, Shell hits 8, Torpedo hits 1, and is sunk
DD Hibiki, Shell hits 5, Torpedo hits 1, on fire, heavy damage
DD Usugumo
DD Sagiri, Shell hits 1
DD Ushio
DD Numakaze, Shell hits 3, and is sunk
Allied Ships
CA Suffolk, Shell hits 7, on fire, heavy damage
CL Dragon, Shell hits 7, on fire, heavy damage
CL Durban, Shell hits 3
DD Le Triomphant, Shell hits 2
DD Van Galen
DD Tjerk Hiddes, Shell hits 4, Torpedo hits 2, and is sunk
DD Ulysses, Shell hits 1
DD Undaunted
DD Undine, Shell hits 1, on fire

Day Time Surface Combat, near Swatow at 46,42
Japanese Ships
BB Yamato, on fire, heavy damage
BB Musashi, Shell hits 2, on fire, heavy damage
DD Amatsukaze, on fire
DD Hibiki, and is sunk
DD Usugumo
DD Sagiri
DD Ushio
Allied Ships
CL Kenya
CL Swiftsure
CLAA Capetown
CLAA Van Heemskerck
DD Relentless
DD Rocket
DD Saumarez
DD Grenville, Shell hits 1, on fire

Day Time Surface Combat, near Swatow at 46,42
Japanese Ships
BB Yamato, Shell hits 3, on fire, heavy damage
BB Musashi, Shell hits 3, on fire, heavy damage
DD Amatsukaze, on fire
DD Usugumo
DD Sagiri
DD Ushio
Allied Ships
CL Kenya, Shell hits 1
CL Swiftsure, Shell hits 1
CLAA Capetown
CLAA Van Heemskerck, Shell hits 1
DD Relentless
DD Rocket
DD Saumarez
DD Grenville, on fire

Day Time Surface Combat, near Swatow at 46,42
Japanese aircraft
no flights
Japanese aircraft losses
F1M2 Pete: 3 destroyed
Japanese Ships
BB Yamato, Shell hits 25, Torpedo hits 2, on fire, heavy damage
BB Musashi, Shell hits 29, and is sunk
DD Amatsukaze, Shell hits 18, on fire, heavy damage
DD Usugumo, Shell hits 13, on fire, heavy damage
DD Sagiri
DD Ushio, Shell hits 4, on fire, heavy damage
Allied Ships
CL Kenya
CL Swiftsure
CLAA Capetown, Shell hits 2
CLAA Van Heemskerck, Shell hits 1
DD Relentless, Shell hits 3
DD Rocket
DD Saumarez, Shell hits 1, on fire
DD Grenville, on fire, heavy damage

Sing to the tune of "Man on the Flying Trapeze"
..Oh! We fly o'er the treetops with inches to spare,
There's smoke in the cockpit and gray in my hair.
The tracers look fine as a strafin' we go.
But, brother, we're TOO God damn low...
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Capt. Harlock
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RE: 5 Battleships accounted for

Post by Capt. Harlock »

CLAA's against Yamato and Musashi??

The entire IJN high command is probably contemplating seppuku . . .
Civil war? What does that mean? Is there any foreign war? Isn't every war fought between men, between brothers?

--Victor Hugo
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Nemo121
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RE: 5 Battleships accounted for

Post by Nemo121 »

Ouch, that's a disastrous series of battles. It looks like the CAs caused damage and then the fires spread and pretty much doomed the IJN BBs. Its a damned embarassing outcome though.
John Dillworth: "I had GreyJoy check my spelling and he said it was fine."
Well, that's that settled then.
1275psi
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RE: 5 Battleships accounted for

Post by 1275psi »

Ummmmmmmmmm, maybe before expressing quotes like -thtas embarressing one should examine both sides of the battle and gain a little perspective of the circumstances........[8|]
big seas, fast ships, life tastes better with salt
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RE: 5 Battleships accounted for

Post by Nemo121 »

1275psi,

Ok, so how WOULD you describe the loss of IJN battleline units to an inferior force on the background of Allied landings on Formosa ( which don't appear to have been repelled by the committment and loss of the IJN battleline or the IJA and IJN aerial fleets. sure the Allies suffered loss but there's no indication here that the results justified the expenditure either purely attritionally or strategically.

So, if not disastrous then what?


There's no personal component to my comment but ANYTIME I see 2 Yamato class BBs being sunk in action against a force which doesn't even contain BBs and, in being sunk, failing to achieve anything of strategic value then, yeah, that is disastrous. Does it make you a bad player? No, not at all. We ALL make mistakes ---- in one of my games I've just had over 100 planes torched on the ground by enemy airstrikes --- but there's no point pretending something wasn't disastrous when it, clearly, was. Did you have many other good options, no. Do you deserve respect for playing on to the bitter end? Absolutely. But was the last series of battles anything but a series loss for you? No, it really wasn't.
John Dillworth: "I had GreyJoy check my spelling and he said it was fine."
Well, that's that settled then.
1275psi
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RE: 5 Battleships accounted for

Post by 1275psi »

yamato, mushia had been hit by some 18 2000 lb bombs between them before the engagement..................might have had something to do with it[:D]

yes - it looked , and was disatorous -but it was worth a shot -
it was fun, and if the game mechanics had reflected real life - my BBs would have intercepted his CVs and or his invasion fleet - in real life you dont have to finish in precisely the right hex!

In no way am I embarressed by having a go. As japan in late 44, Im entitled to pick how Ill go down............
big seas, fast ships, life tastes better with salt
1275psi
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RE: 5 Battleships accounted for

Post by 1275psi »

last comment on this crud

Not shown anywhere in the AAR - but the key to it all - in the face of overwhelming airpower, sea power, a complete armoured div -the 2nd tank -was landed at Okiwana with out loss in this battle - with this now being invaded, that means a lot.

big seas, fast ships, life tastes better with salt
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RE: 5 Battleships accounted for

Post by Nemo121 »

1275psi,
I think you are the only person here focussed on being embarrassed. You tried something, it didn't work and it failed badly. In my world that's nothing to be embarrassed about, that's just what happens in real war and wargames which model such real wars.
 
Ok, you'll hold Okinawa.... But your ability to intercede meaningfully in any future Allied invasions is now gone, forever. It may well have been worth it, but it may not have been worth it.
John Dillworth: "I had GreyJoy check my spelling and he said it was fine."
Well, that's that settled then.
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