New to the game - Basic Questions

[Orm]

What happened to your avatar, rkr1958?

Edit: Never mind. It looks stunning. [:)]

[rkr1958]

ORIGINAL: Orm

What happened to your avatar, rkr1958?

Edit: Never mind. It looks stunning. [:)]

I messed up the first couple of upload attempts on my new avatar so you caught me in that transition. I do the same thing logging in. About 50% of the time it takes me 2, 3 or even 4 attempts to get that blasted security image correct. [:)]

[rkr1958]

I started my first game and I'm answering yes to everything. Two questions (so far). (1) In the screen cap below why can't the German 9-4 infantry and 9-6 armor corps in the flyout join in the attack on any of the 3 adjacent Russian units (4-3 inf, 3-1 arty or 2-1 inf)? Every time I try to drag them them over any of the 3 Soviet units I see the flyout for the Soviet units

(2) In the minor alignment phase I was given a choice to align Finland or Hungary. I chose Finland. The form went away after that. I also wanted to align Hungary. Did I miss my chance this phase or can I only align one country per phase?

[Dabrion]

1) These units are out of supply (correctly so), which is indicated by the yellow marker in the upper right. OOS land units may not attack (only defend).
2) You can only align one minor country per DOW step.

p.s.: reference for activity limits is 10.2.

[rkr1958]

Is it because the 9-4 inf and 9-6 armor can't trace supply? If so, I need to get use to units losing supply during a phase that they move. By the way I'm still on turn 1 of Barbarossa and have gotten 2 rain rolls out of 4 phases.

EDIT: I need to refresh my browser before I post ... I see my question was already answered. [8D]

[paulderynck]

You can't just dive into this game. You need to familiarize yourself with the rules. It's a complicated game, not an FPS. Answering "yes" to everything reminds me of the time Homer dumped the radioactive waste pond into the town water supply...

[Joseignacio]

ORIGINAL: rkr1958

I started my first game and I'm answering yes to everything. Two questions (so far). (1) In the screen cap below why can't the German 9-4 infantry and 9-6 armor corps in the flyout join in the attack on any of the 3 adjacent Russian units (4-3 inf, 3-1 arty or 2-1 inf)? Every time I try to drag them them over any of the 3 Soviet units I see the flyout for the Soviet units

(2) In the minor alignment phase I was given a choice to align Finland or Hungary. I chose Finland. The form went away after that. I also wanted to align Hungary. Did I miss my chance this phase or can I only align one country per phase?

Yes, you are missing sth. [:)], and yes, that sth. is that you can only align one country per phase. Although this phase is every impulse and not every turn, so it's pretty frequent (a turn consists of like 3 to 6 impulses average each side).

[Orm]

I think the time is right for you to dive into the game. But I recommend that you have RAC at hand when you go through the steps in the game. This way you can look at the rules for the different steps as you perform them on the computer.

[rkr1958]

ORIGINAL: Orm

I think the time is right for you to dive into the game. But I recommend that you have RAC at hand when you go through the steps in the game. This way you can look at the rules for the different steps as you perform them on the computer.

What a wonderful suggestion! Will I get in trouble with Steve if I make notes in the margin of my textbook (uh ... "The Rules as Coded" hardback book)? [;)]

By the way, the font is perfect for old eyes like mine. Another WiF quality product! I just love the books. [8D]

[rkr1958]

I'm in the setup of the Russians for the Barbarossa scenario. I noticed that the 2-1 arty, 3-5 cav and 4-1 arty (yellow box) were out of supply after I initial setup them up. By moving each 1 hex east they are now in supply. Why aren't they able to draw supply from Brest-Litovsk?

[joshuamnave]

The simple answer is that Brest Litovsk is not a supply source for Russian units. Unlike Bessarabia, Eastern Poland does not become part of the Russian homeland when it is annexed.

The more complicated answer is that Brest Litovsk is neither a primary nor a secondary supply source for Russian units. You can find a listing of both kinds of supply sources and how they interact on page 14 of the RAC. In general, primary supply sources are cities in an unconquered major countries 1939 borders (exceptions include Japanese controlled areas of the mainland which are not considered part of Japan, and Bessarabia after Soviet border rectification, which does become part of the Motherland). Secondary sources include HQ's (your own, and active allies) and capitals of minor conquered countries. Since Brest Litovsk is a Polish, not Russian city, it is not a supply source. Even if Russia conquers Poland, BL will not be a supply source.

[Joseignacio]

Brest is a polish city. URSS units don't get supply directly from polish cities (or any minor's except capitals), they need an HQ in range or a URSS city. Through moving them one hex backwards you may have got closer to USSR cities or HQs.

rkr, don't get annoyed with Orm, only those who have played WIF or are experienced MWIF players can know how complex are the rules of this game, you have multitude of these things to keep in mind. I guess we vetern WIF players don't mind to answer such questions, specially because through them you/we can uncover possible bugs, but you'll have a hard time if you try to guess the many many rules about everithing that there are in the game. [:)]
Edit: hadn't seen Zartacla post or I wouldn't have posted [:)].

[Extraneous]

These are the rules effecting the units they are referring to.

ORIGINAL: WiFFE-RAW-7.0.pdf
19.5 The Nazi-Soviet pact
In all World in Flames scenarios that start after Jul/Aug 1939 and before Jul/Aug 1941, the USSR and Germany have a Nazi-Soviet pact in place that regulates their spheres of influence. They signed their pact on the 23rd August 1939 and Germany broke certain of its clauses on the 22nd of June 1941.

19.5.1 Eastern Poland
The USSR can exercise its Nazi-Soviet Pact rights to occupy eastern Poland during any Allied land movement step. However, it can only exercise those rights if Poland has not been conquered. You exercise those rights by moving a land unit into any hex of eastern Poland.

Once you exercise those rights, the part of Poland to the east of the partition line becomes conquered by the Soviets. Move any Axis units there to the nearest Axis controlled hex they can stack in. Any Allied (except Soviet) units there are destroyed. They are removed from the game (internment) until Germany and the USSR are at war, at which point they may be added to the Commonwealth force pool if the Commonwealth player so desires.

ORIGINAL: WiFFE-RAW-7.0.pdf
Railway supply paths
A hex a railway supply path enters, by moving along a railway or road, does not count against the 4 hex limit. A hex it enters across a straits hexside also does not count against the limit, so long as the hexes on either side of the straits are railway hexes.

The 4 non-rail hexes can occur anywhere along the path. Although you will mostly use them to trace supply from an HQ to the railhead, they can be handy for re-routing around an enemy unit that’s blocking a vital rail link.

Perhaps they can explain why the rail hexes in Poland cannot be used to supply the units in Brest-Litovsk.

[Shannon V. OKeets]

Try using the F8 key. It brings up the supply sources and paths. You can click on the different sources to see which units they are supplying. Then you can click on a unit to see the path it takes to reach the supply source.

This falls into the category of "learning by seeing many examples".[:)] It's one of my favorite ways to learn.

[rkr1958]

Wow, thanks again for all the responses. I do appreciate everyone's patience in answering such novice questions! I have started / restarted the Barbarossa scenario four times now. My focus is on learning more and more of the relevant rules and getting a better feel for combat, movements and the associated phases. Though I'm flubbing up the games royally, I am thoroughly enjoying them and can tell that I have 100's to 1000's of hours of game play enjoyment in front of me. At least playing solo I don't feel guilty about making horribly stupid plays and then restarting the game. I'm definitely learning things that I shouldn't do. [:)]

I do have a question concerning of opinion (or feel) concerning tactical air strikes. One I know there's no definite answer to and one which is more opinion than fact. But; when is it better to ground strike for disorganization versus adding factors in support of a ground attack?

[Dabrion]

ORIGINAL: Extraneous

These are the rules effecting the units they are referring to.

ORIGINAL: WiFFE-RAW-7.0.pdf
19.5 The Nazi-Soviet pact
In all World in Flames scenarios that start after Jul/Aug 1939 and before Jul/Aug 1941, the USSR and Germany have a Nazi-Soviet pact in place that regulates their spheres of influence. They signed their pact on the 23rd August 1939 and Germany broke certain of its clauses on the 22nd of June 1941.

19.5.1 Eastern Poland
The USSR can exercise its Nazi-Soviet Pact rights to occupy eastern Poland during any Allied land movement step. However, it can only exercise those rights if Poland has not been conquered. You exercise those rights by moving a land unit into any hex of eastern Poland.

Once you exercise those rights, the part of Poland to the east of the partition line becomes conquered by the Soviets. Move any Axis units there to the nearest Axis controlled hex they can stack in. Any Allied (except Soviet) units there are destroyed. They are removed from the game (internment) until Germany and the USSR are at war, at which point they may be added to the Commonwealth force pool if the Commonwealth player so desires.

ORIGINAL: WiFFE-RAW-7.0.pdf
Railway supply paths
A hex a railway supply path enters, by moving along a railway or road, does not count against the 4 hex limit. A hex it enters across a straits hexside also does not count against the limit, so long as the hexes on either side of the straits are railway hexes.

The 4 non-rail hexes can occur anywhere along the path. Although you will mostly use them to trace supply from an HQ to the railhead, they can be handy for re-routing around an enemy unit that’s blocking a vital rail link.

Perhaps they can explain why the rail hexes in Poland cannot be used to supply the units in Brest-Litovsk.

Because it is not a railway supply path. Railway supply paths are for 2ndS relaying, normal units always use a basic supply path.

[joshuamnave]

ORIGINAL: rkr1958

Wow, thanks again for all the responses. I do appreciate everyone's patience in answering such novice questions! I have started / restarted the Barbarossa scenario four times now. My focus is on learning more and more of the relevant rules and getting a better feel for combat, movements and the associated phases. Though I'm flubbing up the games royally, I am thoroughly enjoying them and can tell that I have 100's to 1000's of hours of game play enjoyment in front of me. At least playing solo I don't feel guilty about making horribly stupid plays and then restarting the game. I'm definitely learning things that I shouldn't do. [:)]

I do have a question concerning of opinion (or feel) concerning tactical air strikes. One I know there's no definite answer to and one which is more opinion than fact. But; when is it better to ground strike for disorganization versus adding factors in support of a ground attack?

Couple ways of looking at it. My answers assume you're using the 2d10 combat charts, but although the numbers may change, the tactics should be similar with the 1d10 charts.

Every unit that you flip in a ground strike will give you +2 on the die roll. Sometimes, using the air unit for combat support will actually give you a guarantee of +2 or better on a roll. For example, a plane with 3 tac factors ground striking a 3 factory infantry sitting by itself will give you a 30% chance of flipping it for +2, or a 100% chance of getting +2 on the die roll in ground support. This assumes that you don't have so much air sitting around that you're exceeding the max ground support numbers. As those numbers change, the value of ground strike v support varies accordingly. Would you rather have a 30% chance at +2 or a 100% chance of a +1? Sure, the long term numbers work out in favor of ground support, but what if you're only comfortable making the attack with the extra bonus? Then ground strike gets better. Ground strikes are also usually better against out of supply units, because disorganized OOS units defend with only 1 defense factor (3 if they are white print). And against stacks of units, ground strikes really take the upper hand. There, the ground support factors are less likely to be enough to boost your attack by even +1, but a ground strike can get you as much as +5!

Balance that against the fact that ground strikes count against your air limits, while ground support does not. Consider that ground strikes may draw out enemy fighters that will then not be available to intercept ground support later.

[paulderynck]

Every unit disorganized is potentially dead meat in a subsequent impulse. FREX when Barb starts, there are lots of Russian units that can be slaughtered immediately. But the ones you can't get good odds against should be ground struck so they can't get away. When their front collapses, those units will be surrounded, put OOS and disposed of. Of course you likely need a Super-combined impusle to really have an impact.

So sometimes it's not just about getting the +2 for the flip verses adding the ground support factors in the attack.

[rkr1958]

I want to confirm if what I think I'm seeing is actually correct understanding of the rules on my part.

1. Do ground support "missions" count against the impulse's air limits? (no?).

2. Are bombers that fly ground support disorganized? (yes?).

3. Are bombers that fly an air mission that don't get cleared through disorganized?

4. Does this count against the impulse's air mission limits?

[Dabrion]

1. yes
2. yes
3. yes (only rebase missions let you stay face up)
4. yes (if this refers to the now disorganised bombers from 3.)

In general there is no discount for failed operations, you "pay" per attempt (which makes sense, since you have no hindsight until the mission is actually conducted).