Tale of the Sheep! - JocMeister (A) vs. Lowpe (J)

Post descriptions of your brilliant victories and unfortunate defeats here.

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Lokasenna
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RE: Canada and India invaded!

Post by Lokasenna »

ORIGINAL: JocMeister

Got the replay and CR back. Hard to tell for sure without the turn but it looks like a decisive Japanese victory. [:(]

By the looks of it Exeter and Devonshire are sunk after TT hits together with 2 DDs. In exchange only 3 or possible 4 Japanese DDs are sunk. CA Hawkins also hit a mine at Chittagong to add insult to the injury. Not a good evening.

I´ll have more info once I get the turn. Allied high command is not happy.

You took a risk. It might've paid off, but sounds like it did not - and definitively.

Don't worry. You get more ships than I know what to do with [:'(].
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RE: Canada and India invaded!

Post by JocMeister »

[font="Verdana"]Battle of Chittagong[/font]
_____________________________________________________________________________

As already stated the naval battles didn´t go well. I was expecting to run into several CAs and possibly even the Kongos which have been seen in the area months ago.

Instead we run into several small DD TFs. A long lance battles was not what I was looking for.
Night Time Surface Combat, near Chittagong at 55,41, Range 1,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
DD Nowaki
DD Tanikaze, Shell hits 3
DD Mochizuki, Shell hits 6, heavy fires, heavy damage


Allied Ships
CA Dorsetshire
CA Devonshire, Shell hits 5
CA Exeter, Shell hits 10, Torpedo hits 2, heavy fires, heavy damage
CA Hawkins, Shell hits 7
DD Nestor
DD Tjerk Hiddes, Shell hits 2
DD Arrow
DD Encounter
Night Time Surface Combat, near Chittagong at 55,41, Range 1,000 Yards

Allied aircraft
no flights

Allied aircraft losses
Walrus II: 2 destroyed

Japanese Ships
DD Shiranui, Shell hits 17, heavy fires, heavy damage
DD Fubuki
DD Shikinami, Shell hits 3


Allied Ships
CA Dorsetshire
CA Devonshire, Shell hits 1, Torpedo hits 3, and is sunk
CA Hawkins
DD Nestor
DD Tjerk Hiddes, on fire
DD Arrow
TF 39 encounters mine field at Chittagong (55,41)

Allied Ships
CA Hawkins, Mine hits 1

There was several other non conclusive battles which I havn´t posted. A screen with losses are attached. I think 4 Japanese DDs are sunk but I´m uncertain about one of them.

Obviously this is not good. My timing couldn´t had been worse. If Jeff had done this just 2 weeks ago the entire IO Fleet was lurking in ambush position for just a thing like this. Now all the surviving ships need to head back to Colombo and repair and I lost control of the seas. Not good at all.

What is ready of the IO fleet will depart Colombo immediately not waiting for everyone to come out of refits. 4 CVs + Force Z are ready. Most importantly I have some Porter and Mahan class DDs ready. I´ve also dispatched whatever DDs I can spare from Balboa towards CT. That is pretty much all I can do right now.





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JocMeister
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RE: Canada and India invaded!

Post by JocMeister »

[font="Verdana"]Battle of Chittagong[/font]
_____________________________________________________________________________

To end the update on a more positive note...this is why you never ever defend in clear terrain. Especially NOT as the Japanese.
Morning Air attack on 56th Division, at 55,41 (Chittagong)

Weather in hex: Moderate rain

Raid detected at 40 NM, estimated altitude 7,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 13 minutes

Allied aircraft
Hudson IIIa x 10
B-17E Fortress x 7
B-17F Fortress x 3
B-24D Liberator x 43
B-25C Mitchell x 22


Allied aircraft losses
Hudson IIIa: 1 damaged
B-17E Fortress: 1 damaged
B-24D Liberator: 2 damaged


Japanese ground losses:
1229 casualties reported
Squads: 1 destroyed, 47 disabled
Non Combat: 3 destroyed, 82 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 2 disabled
Vehicles lost 5 (1 destroyed, 4 disabled)

Another 1-1,5k losses caused by smaller attacks following up during the day. Still no flak! Ground bombardments are looking much better now despite a Japanese CA bombardment of the allied troops.
Ground combat at Chittagong (55,41)

Allied Bombardment attack

Attacking force 82981 troops, 1342 guns, 953 vehicles, Assault Value = 2659

Defending force 79742 troops, 908 guns, 694 vehicles, Assault Value = 2043

Japanese ground losses:
66 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 3 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled


Allied ground losses:
75 casualties reported
Squads: 2 destroyed, 6 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

If nothing major happens the first deliberate attack will probably happen in 5-6 days.
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JocMeister
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RE: Canada and India invaded!

Post by JocMeister »

ORIGINAL: JeffK

Both of your TF have an older ship, Hawkins in the CA and Dauntless with the CL.

Both slower and "older" guns, not saying it caused problems but sometimes they can affect results.

I think the biggest problem was bringing a nuke to a knife fight. I had known I would only encounter smaller DD TFs I wouldn´t have sent in the CAs. Its a good tactic by Jeff although it will implode once facing Fletchers.
ORIGINAL: Lokasenna
You took a risk. It might've paid off, but sounds like it did not - and definitively.

Don't worry. You get more ships than I know what to do with [:'(].

Yeah, could have been much worse too so I shouldn´t complain too much. But I like those Brits CAs dammit. Sucks to lose them against Long Lance DDs.

I´ll let Jeff enjoy his DDs. Fletcher time is coming. [:D]
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JocMeister
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RE: Canada and India invaded!

Post by JocMeister »

[font="Verdana"]SIGINT[/font]
_____________________________________________________________________________

12th Air Flotilla is planning for an attack on Seattle.
5/2nd Division is loaded on a Kyushu Cargo class xAK moving to Pearl Harbor.
3/2nd Division is loaded on a Aden Cargo class xAK moving to Pearl Harbor.
5th Air Division is located at Lahaina(182,108).

I´ll get that update on the WC up today I hope.
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JocMeister
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RE: Canada and India invaded!

Post by JocMeister »

[font="Verdana"]West Coast defenses[/font]
_____________________________________________________________________________

Basically I can´t cover everything. So I put down a few locations that I under no circumstances can afford to lose. Initially they were the following.

-SF
-LA
-SD
-Seattle

I later added Portland and Alameda to the list after advice here in the AAR. The idea here is very simple. I will rely on forts and a smaller force to hold while I rail in reinforcements. Fort construction is going well.

------------------------
Forces on the WC
------------------------

-7th Motorized, 25th, 35th, 37th, 40th, 41st, 43rd, 44th, 91st and 104th Infantry divisions.
-5th, 6th and 13th Armored divisions.
-3rd Marine division
-14 Regiments/BDEs
-5 Tank Battalions

------------------------
Emergency Reinforcements
------------------------

II USA Armored Corps arrives at San Luis Obispo
II USA Corps arrives at Salt Lake City
2nd Armored Division arrives at Salt Lake City
4th Motorized Division arrives at Salt Lake City
8th Motorized Division arrives at Salt Lake City
36th Infantry Division arrives at Salt Lake City
Provisional Tank Brigade arrives at Mojave
2nd Army Tank Brigade arrives at Canada
Invasion Mobilstn Supply Convoy arrives at Salt Lake City

------------------------
Total in case of Invasion
------------------------

14 Infantry divisions
4 Armored divisions
1 USMC division

So understandably I´m not very concerned. So while I continue to build forts I also save up PPs to buy out the 40th and 41st for the counter attack into NORPAC.

------------------------
Japanese intentions
------------------------

SIGINT is confusing. But I still believe the Japanese reinforcements are defensive ones. In this game the Japanese have invested heavily into Base VPs in NORPAC/CENTPAC. Now Jeff wants to defend them for as long as possible. Especially PH is a huge VP pool for him with 3000 VPs in PH alone.

I also think he overestimates the Allied need for PH and thinks this is my first priority to take back. Its not though as I´m doing just fine without it. Allied Logistics were a bit strained initially but things are now in order.
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Rio Bravo
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RE: Canada and India invaded!

Post by Rio Bravo »

ORIGINAL: JocMeister

[font="Verdana"]West Coast defenses[/font]
_____________________________________________________________________________

Basically I can´t cover everything. So I put down a few locations that I under no circumstances can afford to lose. Initially they were the following.

-SF
-LA
-SD
-Seattle

I later added Portland and Alameda to the list after advice here in the AAR. The idea here is very simple. I will rely on forts and a smaller force to hold while I rail in reinforcements. Fort construction is going well.

------------------------
Forces on the WC
------------------------

-7th Motorized, 25th, 35th, 37th, 40th, 41st, 43rd, 44th, 91st and 104th Infantry divisions.
-5th, 6th and 13th Armored divisions.
-3rd Marine division
-14 Regiments/BDEs
-5 Tank Battalions

------------------------
Emergency Reinforcements
------------------------

II USA Armored Corps arrives at San Luis Obispo
II USA Corps arrives at Salt Lake City
2nd Armored Division arrives at Salt Lake City
4th Motorized Division arrives at Salt Lake City
8th Motorized Division arrives at Salt Lake City
36th Infantry Division arrives at Salt Lake City
Provisional Tank Brigade arrives at Mojave
2nd Army Tank Brigade arrives at Canada
Invasion Mobilstn Supply Convoy arrives at Salt Lake City

------------------------
Total in case of Invasion
------------------------

14 Infantry divisions
4 Armored divisions
1 USMC division

So understandably I´m not very concerned. So while I continue to build forts I also save up PPs to buy out the 40th and 41st for the counter attack into NORPAC.

------------------------
Japanese intentions
------------------------

SIGINT is confusing. But I still believe the Japanese reinforcements are defensive ones. In this game the Japanese have invested heavily into Base VPs in NORPAC/CENTPAC. Now Jeff wants to defend them for as long as possible. Especially PH is a huge VP pool for him with 3000 VPs in PH alone.

I also think he overestimates the Allied need for PH and thinks this is my first priority to take back. Its not though as I´m doing just fine without it. Allied Logistics were a bit strained initially but things are now in order.

Joc-

Your guess as to Jeff's intentions seems reasonable. I can't believe that he wants a fight with 15 Infantry Divisions and all those tanks.

How is your aircraft in the states holding up?

Best Regards,

-Terry
"No one throws me my own guns and tells me to run. No one."

-Bret (James Coburn); The Magnificent Seven
JocMeister
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RE: Canada and India invaded!

Post by JocMeister »

ORIGINAL: Rio Bravo
Joc-

Your guess as to Jeff's intentions seems reasonable. I can't believe that he wants a fight with 15 Infantry Divisions and all those tanks.

How is your aircraft in the states holding up?

Best Regards,

-Terry

They are in good shape! Resting and training. I have all my P40Ks here together with around 100 4Es and most of the USMC DBs.
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RE: Canada and India invaded!

Post by JocMeister »

[font="Verdana"]VPs[/font]
_____________________________________________________________________________

As can be seen in the screen the ratio keeps hovering around 3,2:1. Allied VPs will soon surpass 11k which sets Jeff around 6k VPs short of AV.

He does have a lot of VPs to harvest in China but I don´t think it will be enough. All bases are already in red so the actual VP drop won´t be very big for me. But there are a lot of Army loss VPs to be gained for Jeff.

Hopefully I can gain some extra VPs by defeating the Japanese army in India.

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RE: Canada and India invaded!

Post by BBfanboy »

I agree that he would be foolish to take on your US land forces and hope to hold a beachhead for long. But if you have restrictions on moving them to Canada that SIGINT about Vancouver and Victoria makes sense. Especially Victoria, since you can't safely get your troops there without getting control of the air or the sea first.

If I were him at this game date I would want to bomb your aircraft industries so that there will be a much weakened Allied bomber force later in the game. I would also know that a ground offensive would not likely take a major city like Seattle before you reinforced and drove out the invaders, so destroying your aircraft industry by ground offensive is not going to work. And bombarding with ships just isn't feasible given your air forces in the US.

His first bombing offensive suffered for lack of good enough CAP/escort against your fighters. He now has better fighters so all he needs is some closer bases to improve their time on LRCAP of your bases or the reach of the escort for the bombers. He may be willing to take massive AA losses in exchange for crippling your aircraft manufacturing in the long run.

I like your idea of having your reserves on rails though - flexible response!
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RE: Canada and India invaded!

Post by jwolf »

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

I like your idea of having your reserves on rails though - flexible response!

It's a common tactic in WITE. The one big problem is that if your troops are bombed while on board a train, losses are terrible. Other than that, it's the best way to have a good, fast reserve force.
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BillBrown
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RE: Canada and India invaded!

Post by BillBrown »

You just need to hold the important cities for about 8-10 days. As soon as he lands and triggers the reinforcements
you will need to load them on trains and move them. Most of them show up in Salt Lake City.

As far as I know, his bombing you aircraft factories does about nothing. You can just rebuild them later.
Without firestorms, he can not destroy them, just damage them.
JocMeister
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RE: Canada and India invaded!

Post by JocMeister »

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

I agree that he would be foolish to take on your US land forces and hope to hold a beachhead for long. But if you have restrictions on moving them to Canada that SIGINT about Vancouver and Victoria makes sense. Especially Victoria, since you can't safely get your troops there without getting control of the air or the sea first.

If I were him at this game date I would want to bomb your aircraft industries so that there will be a much weakened Allied bomber force later in the game. I would also know that a ground offensive would not likely take a major city like Seattle before you reinforced and drove out the invaders, so destroying your aircraft industry by ground offensive is not going to work. And bombarding with ships just isn't feasible given your air forces in the US.

His first bombing offensive suffered for lack of good enough CAP/escort against your fighters. He now has better fighters so all he needs is some closer bases to improve their time on LRCAP of your bases or the reach of the escort for the bombers. He may be willing to take massive AA losses in exchange for crippling your aircraft manufacturing in the long run.

I like your idea of having your reserves on rails though - flexible response!

The thing is that as BillB mentions 2 posts down bombing the AC factories only gives him a couple of VPs. To permanently destroy them you either have to create firestorms (something I failed to do even as the allies in 45) or capture them. If they are captured they revert to vehicle factories. When/if the allies recapture them...they doesn´t revert back. [:)]
ORIGINAL: BillBrown

You just need to hold the important cities for about 8-10 days. As soon as he lands and triggers the reinforcements
you will need to load them on trains and move them. Most of them show up in Salt Lake City.

As far as I know, his bombing you aircraft factories does about nothing. You can just rebuild them later.
Without firestorms, he can not destroy them, just damage them.

Exactly my thinking. [:)]
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RE: Canada and India invaded!

Post by JeffroK »

ORIGINAL: JocMeister

[font="Verdana"]West Coast defenses[/font]
_____________________________________________________________________________

Basically I can´t cover everything. So I put down a few locations that I under no circumstances can afford to lose. Initially they were the following.

-SF
-LA
-SD
-Seattle

I later added Portland and Alameda to the list after advice here in the AAR. The idea here is very simple. I will rely on forts and a smaller force to hold while I rail in reinforcements. Fort construction is going well.

------------------------
Forces on the WC
------------------------

-7th Motorized, 25th, 35th, 37th, 40th, 41st, 43rd, 44th, 91st and 104th Infantry divisions.
-5th, 6th and 13th Armored divisions.
-3rd Marine division
-14 Regiments/BDEs
-5 Tank Battalions

------------------------
Emergency Reinforcements
------------------------

II USA Armored Corps arrives at San Luis Obispo
II USA Corps arrives at Salt Lake City
2nd Armored Division arrives at Salt Lake City
4th Motorized Division arrives at Salt Lake City
8th Motorized Division arrives at Salt Lake City
36th Infantry Division arrives at Salt Lake City
Provisional Tank Brigade arrives at Mojave
2nd Army Tank Brigade arrives at Canada
Invasion Mobilstn Supply Convoy arrives at Salt Lake City

------------------------
Total in case of Invasion
------------------------

14 Infantry divisions
4 Armored divisions
1 USMC division

So understandably I´m not very concerned. So while I continue to build forts I also save up PPs to buy out the 40th and 41st for the counter attack into NORPAC.

------------------------
Japanese intentions
------------------------

SIGINT is confusing. But I still believe the Japanese reinforcements are defensive ones. In this game the Japanese have invested heavily into Base VPs in NORPAC/CENTPAC. Now Jeff wants to defend them for as long as possible. Especially PH is a huge VP pool for him with 3000 VPs in PH alone.

I also think he overestimates the Allied need for PH and thinks this is my first priority to take back. Its not though as I´m doing just fine without it. Allied Logistics were a bit strained initially but things are now in order.
I hope this is high level only, and you have Regiments and CD units etc etc at the smaller ports.
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JocMeister
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RE: Canada and India invaded!

Post by JocMeister »

ORIGINAL: JeffK
I hope this is high level only, and you have Regiments and CD units etc etc at the smaller ports.

Basically. No! [:D]

There are about 12 possible landing sites on the WC. Its impossible to protect them all. Besides. Whats the point of having a Regiment defending something that you know that if its attacked it will be wiped out in the first turn anyway?



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RE: Canada and India invaded!

Post by JeffroK »

Given the ability for the IJN to recce using sub based FP & from Coal Harbour it means that he can have a very good idea of your defences. (I assume there is a HR to stop non base landings)

This enables an undefended landing. An RCT, some artillery etc under L6 forts could be hard to move. There are 12 bases he could land at, most are developed to some level and make good targets. Likewise inland bases should be garrisoned to stop para drops.

You have to unpack your forces from their trains (2-3 days) and get them moving by land (Road/Trail), it might be a week before yiu get to react. In the meantime troops & supplies are landed and base construction started.

The Garrisons could also be left on trains as part of your reaction force, I'm not sure recon shows if a force is packed and ready to move??

If Lowpe doesnt intend to attack somewhere on the WC, what his options from these movement?? Is there another move being hidden behind a screen, cant be India, would moving south from Pearl and cutting Australia off from the WC/Panama hurt??
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JocMeister
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RE: Canada and India invaded!

Post by JocMeister »

ORIGINAL: JeffK

Given the ability for the IJN to recce using sub based FP & from Coal Harbour it means that he can have a very good idea of your defences. (I assume there is a HR to stop non base landings)

This enables an undefended landing. An RCT, some artillery etc under L6 forts could be hard to move. There are 12 bases he could land at, most are developed to some level and make good targets. Likewise inland bases should be garrisoned to stop para drops.

You have to unpack your forces from their trains (2-3 days) and get them moving by land (Road/Trail), it might be a week before yiu get to react. In the meantime troops & supplies are landed and base construction started.

The Garrisons could also be left on trains as part of your reaction force, I'm not sure recon shows if a force is packed and ready to move??

If Lowpe doesnt intend to attack somewhere on the WC, what his options from these movement?? Is there another move being hidden behind a screen, cant be India, would moving south from Pearl and cutting Australia off from the WC/Panama hurt??

I´m thinking that "so what" if he lands at Coos Bay or Eureka. All it will do is trigger the Emergency reinforcements for no gain at all. At least that is what I´m thinking or am I missing something? None of the bases on the coast are expanded so they are mostly 1/1 size. Even if he lands a crapload of engineers I should have no problem closing the AF and stopping construction. I have all the inland rail secured from paradrops. [:)]

I´ve looked a lot at the map and trying to figure out what Jeff is doing. To only thing at this point that makes sense is a reinforcement of already captured areas in NOPRAC/CENTPAC and Canada. He could obviously strike south from PH into my LOC. Its a long way from Japan though and he doesn´t get much in return for a huge investment. Besides Japan is ill suited for that kind of war. Not the best amphibious tools, not very good engineer capabilities for base expansion and a long way from the DEI fuel. This while the allies have prepared bases and proximity to both Balboa and NZ/OZ.

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RE: Canada and India invaded!

Post by JocMeister »

[font="Verdana"]17th November -42[/font]
_____________________________________________________________________________

Pretty uneventful.

------------------------
WC/NORPAC
------------------------

Not much here. Had two big convoys leaving CH but failed to intercept with subs.


------------------------
SOPAC
------------------------

Nothing here either. Had a small Japanese TF show up at Vanua Lava. Banshees launched a strike at a DD but missed. Leander and Achilles reached Tahiti together with the oilers. No sign of the raiders.

------------------------
India
------------------------

Reinforcements have arrived in the form of Frobisher, Cornwall, Vincennes, Houston and Northampton. Still desperately short on DDs. Decided to send some from SOPAC as well as Balboa. The extra 12 DDs will make a huge difference.

Ordered another attack on Silchar. Things are going well here and I think the base will fall within 2 weeks even without air support.
]Ground combat at Silchar (59,39)

Allied Deliberate attack

Attacking force 56803 troops, 491 guns, 941 vehicles, Assault Value = 2055

Defending force 39207 troops, 403 guns, 97 vehicles, Assault Value = 1007

Allied adjusted assault: 999

Japanese adjusted defense: 779

Allied assault odds: 1 to 1 (fort level 2)

Allied Assault reduces fortifications to 1 [&o]

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), preparation(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
1227 casualties reported
Squads: 10 destroyed, 159 disabled
Non Combat: 4 destroyed, 10 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 21 disabled
Guns lost 26 (2 destroyed, 24 disabled)
Vehicles lost 6 (1 destroyed, 5 disabled)


Allied ground losses:
1779 casualties reported
Squads: 25 destroyed, 204 disabled
Non Combat: 2 destroyed, 40 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 18 disabled
Guns lost 26 (1 destroyed, 25 disabled)
Vehicles lost 53 (2 destroyed, 51 disabled

Rotated an Indian division out and the 32nd US are coming in for the next attack. 3 more attacks and we are through. [:)]

Things are going very well at Chittagong too. Bombers rained in this turn but bombardments are looking real good now.
Ground combat at Chittagong (55,41)

Allied Bombardment attack

Attacking force 83629 troops, 1384 guns, 991 vehicles, Assault Value = 2655

Defending force 78464 troops, 907 guns, 690 vehicles, Assault Value = 1989

Japanese ground losses:
75 casualties reported
Squads: 1 destroyed, 8 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Vehicles lost 3 (2 destroyed, 1 disabled)


Allied ground losses:
36 casualties reported
Squads: 1 destroyed, 3 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Vehicles lost 1 (1 destroyed, 0 disabled)

If the bombers doesn´t rain in too much in the coming week we will attack shortly. I have 2 Indian IDs and the powerful 2nd British ID in reserve 1 hex out. I´ll grind them down eventually.
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RE: Canada and India invaded!

Post by ny59giants »

Still desperately short on DDs.

I feel that way until about mid-43 when the Americans start pumping out about 8 to 10 DDs per month. It will be nice when you can afford to send about 8 or more Fletchers to India to help out.


Double checking with my Swedish friend, but you do have a Corp and Command HQ prepping for those two bases?? [;)]
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RE: Canada and India invaded!

Post by JeffroK »

Its a long way from Japan though and he doesn´t get much in return for a huge investment. Besides Japan is ill suited for that kind of war. Not the best amphibious tools, not very good engineer capabilities for base expansion and a long way from the DEI fuel. This while the allies have prepared bases and proximity to both Balboa and NZ/OZ.

Sometimes you do things, not to receive something but to take it away from your opponent.

The IJN holds Alaska, parts of the Canadian coast, part of Australia, imagine if they were well suited for this kind of war.

PS Fletchers are not super ships, just good DD's. A lot of their success is when they build up experience, dont commit them "assuming" they can take on the IJN. (Same goes for P47 & F4U)
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