Pricing Suggestion

[dutchman55555]

ORIGINAL: JDM

HiDutchman, I. Have no idea about stats or performance of any of these games, but if you can share this with me I would be happy to run an analysis

I sincerely, seriously, mean no disrespect whatsoever, but if I had to go to the trouble of gathering what numbers are out there I'd be asking you to pony up some as well so I could do my own analysis.

It's only my gut, but I'd be surprised if Command has sold 500 units yet. I'd be shocked if it's sold over 1000. Whereas I see on Steam alone that 843 are currently playing ETS2 (1:00 a.m. GMT). And my gut, as well as the kind of following it has on social media such as Facebook (201 160 followers) tells me ETS2 sales are in at least the tens of thousands, probably at least 100 000. Command will be lucky, and Matrix will be ecstatic, to get 1/50th of that. And Matrix will console itself with some thought of how that market is just completely unattainable for them. Again, a self-fulfilling prophecy.

[samspackman]

I'm fairly ambivalent about this. On the one hand I've reached the point where $100 isn't really a large amount of money for me to spend on discretionary items. On the other hand, I am time poor and this is a large time investment to get into. I've read the beta AAR's and watched the videos put up, but they are fairly light on and aren't convincing me this is worth the purchase. Either the price would need to drop to more 'impulse' levels, or a lot more information on the game would need to be put up (like a demo) before I bought it. I only bought WITP because of Grey Hunter's AAR, and I love playing that, mainly because someone has been able to clearly show the delights the game can offer, that make the time investment worthwhile.

[Alejo1968]

ORIGINAL: wombat778

ORIGINAL: Abbeville_01
You dont know what you are talking about. There is a lot more than that in KSP, you are not being fair with that comment.

Nowhere in my post did I say or imply that there was not "a lot more than that in KSP." I merely copied and pasted text directly from their website. The fact that those items are included makes it unappealing to me. That it has "more than that" is irrelevant.

ORIGINAL: Abbeville_01
In fact... Who are you?, a CIC Officer of the USA Navy, having training with a military software? No, you are not. You are just a guy sitting in front of a pc having fun with zeros and ones.

That is true, I am not training with military software, and yes I am just a guy in front of a pc. Never pretended to be anything else (I was a programmer for several years on Falcon 4 BMS...probably spent about 3,000 hours working on that all told...so if you use or have used a BMS version of Falcon 4 you are using my work).

Regardless, I'm not sure what that has to do with anything, and it seems to me that you are being personally insulting for no good reason. I do know what kind of simulations appeal to me and which ones don't and, sorry to say, KSP doesn't. I'll choose to spend my money as I see fit thanks.

ORIGINAL: Abbeville_01
Sorry for being harsh, but please, do not criticize something because it doesnt look like that you consider "serious".

Please point to where in my post I criticized KSP. I did not do that at all. KSP sounds great, just not for me. I merely pointed to the reasons why it does not appeal to me, nothing more.

(1) You implied ksp does not deserves to be compared, the way you put it, you are trying to make it look ridículous. And that is unfair.
(2) Consecuently, who you do you think you are?, I insist.
(3) How you spent your money is irrelevant for me
(4) Congratulation with F4.0. Yes, I flew with it for years, until I met Olegg Maddox Il2. In fact I used Falcon 4 in my old Mil Unit for training pourposes (4 pilots flying virtual missions, old good times). But... not relevant.

[wombat778]

ORIGINAL: Abbeville_01
(1) You implied ksp does not deserves to be compared, the way you put it, you are trying to make it look ridículous. And that is unfair.

The context of the conversation was marketing. In terms of marketing, it seems to me that comparing a bare-bones "ugly" (or non-pretty if you prefer) simulation with essentially no graphics or sound like Command to a cute simulation with animated characters and hairstyles like KSP doesn't make sense. My post had nothing whatsoever to do with the quality of the simulation underlying either piece of software.

ORIGINAL: Abbeville_01
(2) Consecuently, who you do you think you are?, I insist.

I think I am me. What does this have to do with anything?

ORIGINAL: Abbeville_01
(3) How you spent your money is irrelevant for me

Great! So why do you care if KSP appeals to me?

ORIGINAL: Abbeville_01
(4) Congratulation with F4.0. Yes, I flew with it for years, until I met Olegg Maddox Il2. In fact I used Falcon 4 in my old Mil Unit for training pourposes (4 pilots flying virtual missions, old good times). But... not relevant.

I agree not relevant. But you seem to insist on knowing who I am so I was simply answering your question.

[Tomn]

ORIGINAL: JDM

HiDutchman, I. Have no idea about stats or performance of any of these games, but if you can share this with me I would be happy to run an analysis

This is by no means a particularly scientific or exhaustive method of doing things, but looking at the Steam top-seller list right now...

Euro Truck Simulator 2 - Gold Bundle (previously described) is currently outselling Final Fantasy 7.

Euro Truck Simulator 2 - Going East!, an expansion that provides "over 20 hours of driving to explore all the new areas of the world!), is currently outselling Company of Heroes 2, the Age of Empires III Complete Collection, and Final Fantasy 7.

Kerbal Space Program (previously described) is currently outselling all of the above plus GTA IV: Complete Edition, Civ 5 (vanilla), Batman: Arkham Origins, XCOM: Enemy Unknown, and Far Cry 3.

ARMA 3, a highly realistic and hardcore army simulator (to the point where a beginner's guide for an online clan in ARMA 2 looked like an infantry training manual) is outselling all of the above plus GTA IV, Civ 5 Gold Edition, Call of Duty: Black Ops 2, X-COM: Enemy Unknown, Skyrim, Civ 5: Brave New World and Far Cry 3.

The DCS series is apparently free-to-play with purchasable modules around $20 USD in price, and was released in the 18th of March this year - unlikely then as a niche to stay on the top selling list of today.

Train Simulator 2013 was released almost exactly one year ago and is unlikely to have stayed on the top selling list as per DCS.

Again, this is by no means scientific - after all, a lot of the games being outsold have been up for a while and are eating up their tail sales, not their initial enormous bursts. Still, the games list above ARE still on the Steam top-selling list, which isn't quite small potatoes, and whether or no they ARE outselling the listed games at present.

I might ask, by the by - if you've got no data whatsoever about how other games are doing, why are you so completely confident that the course you are taking is the best one possible? Isn't this a little like declaring that you're running at the highest speed possible in a race without noticing where your competitors are?

[Tomn]

ORIGINAL: wombat778
The context of the conversation was marketing. In terms of marketing, it seems to me that comparing a bare-bones "ugly" (or non-pretty if you prefer) simulation with essentially no graphics or sound like Command to a cute simulation with animated characters and hairstyles like KSP doesn't make sense. My post had nothing whatsoever to do with the quality of the simulation underlying either piece of software.
I am so I was simply answering your question.

Seriously, dude, try the KSP demo. The Kerbals are a very small part of the actual game, and you'll argue much better once you give it a go - you may even find that you can overlook the Kerbals entirely and enjoy it. I'm telling you, the demo is free of charge and if you can afford grognard games, surely you can afford the bandwidth to give it a spin!

[wombat778]

ORIGINAL: Tomn
Seriously, dude, try the KSP demo. The Kerbals are a very small part of the actual game, and you'll argue much better once you give it a go - you may even find that you can overlook the Kerbals entirely and enjoy it. I'm telling you, the demo is free of charge and if you can afford grognard games, surely you can afford the bandwidth to give it a spin!

On the strength of all this word-of-mouth (but not the games' marketing!) I am downloading it now. Unfortunately I am a bit like V for Vegas on this...its the time that is much more the issue than the money. I get so little time for any entertainment of any kind these days (maybe 3-4 hours a week), that I am pretty picky with what games/sims I play. I'm not even 100% sure that Command is there yet. Still, I'll give KSP a fair shake.

Also, yes, I agree with your prior post that Command really needs a demo.

[Alejo1968]

ORIGINAL: wombat778

ORIGINAL: Abbeville_01
(1) You implied ksp does not deserves to be compared, the way you put it, you are trying to make it look ridículous. And that is unfair.

The context of the conversation was marketing. In terms of marketing, it seems to me that comparing a bare-bones "ugly" (or non-pretty if you prefer) simulation with essentially no graphics or sound like Command to a cute simulation with animated characters and hairstyles like KSP doesn't make sense. My post had nothing whatsoever to do with the quality of the simulation underlying either piece of software.

ORIGINAL: Abbeville_01
(2) Consecuently, who you do you think you are?, I insist.

I think I am me. What does this have to do with anything?

ORIGINAL: Abbeville_01
(3) How you spent your money is irrelevant for me

Great! So why do you care if KSP appeals to me?

ORIGINAL: Abbeville_01
(4) Congratulation with F4.0. Yes, I flew with it for years, until I met Olegg Maddox Il2. In fact I used Falcon 4 in my old Mil Unit for training pourposes (4 pilots flying virtual missions, old good times). But... not relevant.

I agree not relevant. But you seem to insist on knowing who I am so I was simply answering your question.

(1)I dont care if you like KSP, I care why you dismised it as a comparable item, for it being a ridiculous thing (dont tell me you didnt intended to put it in that place)
(2)Oh, I see... Its my english... Lets put it this way, do you think your opinion is more correct/acceptable because you are not placing as example litle yellow creatures, and instead of that serious military symbols?
(3)I really dont know who you are, sorry. And belive me, Im not interested too. In fact, When did I say I knew who you were?

[wombat778]

ORIGINAL: Abbeville_01
(1)I dont care if you like KSP, I care why you dismised it as a comparable item, for it being a ridiculous thing (dont tell me you didnt intended to put it in that place)
(2)Oh, I see... Its my english... Lets put it this way, do you think your opinion is more correct/acceptable because you are not placing as example litle yellow creatures, and instead of that serious military symbols?
(3)I really dont know who you are, sorry. And belive me, Im not interested too. In fact, When did I say I knew who you were?

Abbeville, I really have no idea what you are talking about with any of the above. You seem to want to pick a fight with me just for the sake of it, and I have no intent on getting into a fight with you. I will not be replying to you further. Good day.

[RoryAndersonCDT]

Does this thread belong in this forum?

[Rob322]

ORIGINAL: Baloogan

Does this thread belong in this forum?

I think this thread strayed away from having a point a long time ago ...

[thewood1]

I think it should be moved in its entirety to the pricing thread in the general forum.

[Alejo1968]

ORIGINAL: wombat778

ORIGINAL: Abbeville_01
(1)I dont care if you like KSP, I care why you dismised it as a comparable item, for it being a ridiculous thing (dont tell me you didnt intended to put it in that place)
(2)Oh, I see... Its my english... Lets put it this way, do you think your opinion is more correct/acceptable because you are not placing as example litle yellow creatures, and instead of that serious military symbols?
(3)I really dont know who you are, sorry. And belive me, Im not interested too. In fact, When did I say I knew who you were?

Abbeville, I really have no idea what you are talking about with any of the above. You seem to want to pick a fight with me just for the sake of it, and I have no intent on getting into a fight with you. I will not be replying to you further. Good day.

I thought I was cleare enough... must be my english.
But you are right, there is no point on keep exchanging massages.

[thewood1]

That's creepy

[Rob322]

Maybe they need to be alone ... [;)]

[Megadyptes]

This game looks really interesting but £65 is just too much for me to justify spending on a single game. There's other games from Matrix that I feel the same way about. I guess I'm just not a 'hardcore' enough grognard to be playing these games. [8|]

[Pii]

ORIGINAL: wombat778

ORIGINAL: Xornox
Actually it is one of the best rocket simulations available currently (at least I do not know better). I learnt basics of orbital flying with it.

Do not let looks to deceive you. The simulation may be excellent although little yellow minions are flying devices. Actually those characters does not do anything in the simulation. They are just living "cargo" for rockets. Kerbal is excellent example how you can combine serious and light content and gain wide audience for the game. Kerbal is played from 10 years old kids to 40-50 years old guys like me.

Good to know, thanks. Still, I think the chances of me buying it went to basically zero when I saw those characters. In contrast, the marketing for Command appealed to me immediately. Just goes to show that different marketing strategies work for different kinds of people...

Hey now Kerbals are kewl and if you really find you don't like them you can have the dumb little bast**ds do a space walk on reentry and I must say they make a great ball of fire and burn very brightly! Hey try that in your girly war game you call Command! [;)]

[JRyan]

I quit reading on page 9,

First is it expensive? Oh yes for sure it is. That being said you must ask what do you get for your $$$? This is where I think the argument is moot. I know some might not have that kind of money but if they like this particular genre, they will find a way.

I bought the boxed version yes. Why because this is the type of game I live for since I first bought Harpoon Classic. I bet I have not spent very much over the years on other games but those I did would not even garner 1/100th of the man-hours spent pooning. Now I expect to spend at least 1000 hours more.

My wife had been hounding me to get a new computer for over 3 years now and I said not until the Red Pill. Well we have it now and I wanted it so bad that I would have paid $150 because I will get my $$ worth from it. The only thing that would compare is maybe Black Ops 2, but here is the caveat to that. I only play the zombies part. The group I play with is actually pretty darn good. Now that we have finished the latest map-pack it is done. How much will I play it now? Maybe a little but Command will obviously take more.

Really I can not believe some of the comments here about the price being too much. It reminds me of the Harpoon 3 for Windows and just how many would buy it. Well it went well and the Classic line also were upgraded. Yes I bought them all. I still shake on the Nuclear and Multiplayer options.

What is a fair price? Well let's do quick comparison shall we?

Wal-Mart - (2) new xbox releases $59 * 2 = $118 Average playing time for each - at best 60 hours each. $1 an hour for your entertainment.

Command - (1) $100 - average playing time , well I would bet for a good portion of the community that buys it, around 500 hours and that will increase as the community starts churning out Quality scenarios. That is $.20 cents an hour.

I wonder how many hours I played Fleet Command? It just never really took off even with the after-community support.


For those of you reading this and wondering.....did you want the Red Pill? What would have have given to have played it? These guys built it and did it right. They will do just fine as will Matrix.

[Pii]

Get your Kerbals to the Mun and back...if you still declare it to not be an in-depth simulation (you literally have to understand college-level Physics to succeed) then I'll accept that. I'll think you're crazy, but I'll accept it.

It's easy once you install the autopilot mod.

[Rob322]

ORIGINAL: JRyan

I quit reading on page 9,

First is it expensive? Oh yes for sure it is. That being said you must ask what do you get for your $$$? This is where I think the argument is moot. I know some might not have that kind of money but if they like this particular genre, they will find a way.

I bought the boxed version yes. Why because this is the type of game I live for since I first bought Harpoon Classic. I bet I have not spent very much over the years on other games but those I did would not even garner 1/100th of the man-hours spent pooning. Now I expect to spend at least 1000 hours more.

My wife had been hounding me to get a new computer for over 3 years now and I said not until the Red Pill. Well we have it now and I wanted it so bad that I would have paid $150 because I will get my $$ worth from it. The only thing that would compare is maybe Black Ops 2, but here is the caveat to that. I only play the zombies part. The group I play with is actually pretty darn good. Now that we have finished the latest map-pack it is done. How much will I play it now? Maybe a little but Command will obviously take more.

Really I can not believe some of the comments here about the price being too much. It reminds me of the Harpoon 3 for Windows and just how many would buy it. Well it went well and the Classic line also were upgraded. Yes I bought them all. I still shake on the Nuclear and Multiplayer options.

What is a fair price? Well let's do quick comparison shall we?

Wal-Mart - (2) new xbox releases $59 * 2 = $118 Average playing time for each - at best 60 hours each. $1 an hour for your entertainment.

Command - (1) $100 - average playing time , well I would bet for a good portion of the community that buys it, around 500 hours and that will increase as the community starts churning out Quality scenarios. That is $.20 cents an hour.

I wonder how many hours I played Fleet Command? It just never really took off even with the after-community support.


For those of you reading this and wondering.....did you want the Red Pill? What would have have given to have played it? These guys built it and did it right. They will do just fine as will Matrix.

It beats giving EA any more money. I wouldn't want to pay $20 for an EA game even if it looks great because I have many poor experiences with their support. Matrix however has managed to support the products I've purchased. Beyond Matrix I think the guys who started this are genuine and want to make a great game. If I play this game 1/2 as much as I've played WITP AE in the last 4 years it'll easily have paid for itself.