Hairy Yankee Reports: Q-Ball (A) v Greyjoy (J)

[CarnageINC]

WOW....what bad luck Q....Good luck on saving what you can and thanks for the update [;)]

[JocMeister]

Ouch, that sucks! Bad luck with the CV reaction! I think I will consider bunching all CVs together from now on. Seen CV reaction mess things up on too many occasions now.

I don´t think it was a mistake not to wait for the Hellcats. If not for the reaction things could just as well have gone in your favor. Keep on fighting. Loosing a CV, 2 CVEs and 2 fast BBs arn´t the end of the world for you! [:)]

[JohnDillworth]

yikes!! a significant but not crushing defeat. GJ has the initiative again for sure. 1 CV and 2 BB's hurts but looks like you saved the other flight decks, for now. How badly banged up are they? I ask because I don't think you can fix much flotation damage in Australia. If they have to go to the big drydocks they are going to have to run the gauntlet of SS's

[Canoerebel]

Hey, Brad, I hadn't read either of the two AARs for ten days.  Checked in today and discovered all that had transpired.  Always hurts to see the Allies suffer in a carrier battle, so "I feel your pain."
 
No, really, I do.  I've been through much worse.  (You may have too, though considering how good you are you probably haven't lost an entire fleet of carriers like I have at least twice.)  It will seem very bleak for a few days.  Then, you'll begin to emerge from the cloud of pain.  A few ideas for what you might do down the road will come to mind.  And eventually you'll come back, do well, and feel a heckuva lot better.
 
Good luck!

[crsutton]

Nah, you got off lucky. And are in decent shape. You still should win the game. It just might be a little more interesting for the rest of us for a bit longer.[;)] You are just going to have to redirect your focus for the next half year.

I never split my Allied carriers into separate TFs. Never. One need only read these AARs to see how many times they have reacted and separated. I learned this the hard way myself. The coordination penalty is not severe and it is easier to bitch over lousy coordination than about sunk carriers...

Two things I have learned as an Allied fanboy. China does not matter as much as you think and the Allied player has to screw up way more than you just did to have any chance of blowing the war. Keep grinding, I am enjoying both AARs. Both you and the Greyboy are playing good games.

[Q-Ball]

2/10/43:

As it happened, I was saved by proximity to Australia, which wasn't entirely unplanned.

NORTH CAROLINA and PRINCE OF WALES were goners, so we just left them behind to soak attacks; they sank.

Everyone else, though, made it to Townsville. Greyjoy prudently stayed away during the daytime, which was wise; I have a ton of planes there. I have 50 or so on Night, including some Night Fighters, in case he tries a night raid, but there's alot of flak there, so that could be costly for him. Between mines and PTs, a bombardment would be suicide. So we should be OK.

Butcher's Bill:

We lost 2 Fast BBs (PoW, North Carolina), CV ENTERPRISE, and 2 CVEs. We also lost CL CLEVELAND, and CL TRENTON, plus a DD.

What bugs me is he lost nada, nothing, just KITAKAMI and a Sub, and some planes, but hardly a scratch

Still, we should be back in business by July; by then, I should have the damage repaired, have Hellcats, plus more CVs, and be able to make a better show.

Next Steps:

Obviously, this sets back the planned March/April invasions until later in the summer. I think I will lose 3 months, but that's it; I should be stronger by then, with the new CVs and CVLs coming online

In the meantime, all the damaged ships are heading to the West Coast to get patched up. The BBs may not be done in 3 months, but the CVs will be.

[goran007]

Hi m8, how come area wasn't flooded with your subs? Just one turn of extra warning that KB is near would have been enough for u to good chance of aborting operation and retreat in order. In the same time GJ would have had a nasty choice of follow or not to follow in your LB cap...?

Strange that GJ reacted to your move and he had million subs there, he did every thing he possibly could and did it great, really good play by him.

[crsutton]

Yes, Lex and Saratoga are total bitches to repair. They repair just like battlewagons and take forever. Of course they can take a good pounding too...

Considering how lopsided it was, you came out of it just fine. Nothing more than a speedbump.[;)]

[JohnDillworth]

Yes, Lex and Saratoga are total bitches to repair. They repair just like battlewagons and take forever. Of course they can take a good pounding too...

Considering how lopsided it was, you came out of it just fine. Nothing more than a speedbump.

You have a lot of hardware that needs repair. The KB has to reload so you might have just a bit of time to move these assets out of Indian country. Don't forget CapeTown has a pretty good drydock

[PaxMondo]

Well, as big a disaster that it could have been, your losses were fairly light with regards to ships.  CV reaction is one of the biggest unknowns in the game ... just have to be so careful anytime you are near any islands, and with all of those subs in the area ... he played that pretty good.

[Olorin]

Now that the dust has settled we can say that you were a bit unlucky with the CV reaction, but it could have been worse. The loss of one CV, while certainly a setback, is not a disaster.

[Q-Ball]

Good thoughts from the gallery, and I agree on one thing: Could have been alot worse

The tactical result was one-sided; the react really screwed me, and I have never seen a 200-plane strike get no hits before. But after that, lady luck was with me, as Allied damage control limited problems. The proximity to Australia really helped, as I was able to get cover quickly, and use PTs to disrupt any possible surface actions (which he didnt' try anyway).

Greyjoy has done a really good job with his subs; he doesn't use them for commerce raiding at all, but rather as wolfpacks whenever I make a move. This is a good strategy, because the Allies have a bottomless supply of AKs and even TKs. He has sunk several capital ships with subs. Though I haven't seen a sub in sealanes in months, I bet he'll have some looking for these CVs; I plan to cover is with an ASW TF, and have all the DBs on the CVs on ASW. SARA, LEX and HORNET will head to West Coast for repairs, YORKTOWN will repair in Sydney.

I lost alot of aircraft, but even then it's not a huge deal. I have replacements for the planes, and enough pilots survived from ENTERPRISE and the 2 CVEs to make up alot of losses.

Anyway, the main impact will be to end any CV-supported ops until June/July; by then, I'll have F6F as well as more CVs, so a fight with KB will have a different result next time

2/14/43:

China:

I ambushed a bunch of bombers over Chengtu, shooting down over 30; while satisfying, it's not going to change the outcome where Chengtu falls. This is bad.

My biggest problem at Chungking is keeping it under 160K troops (stacking limit); more appear all the time, so we are marching corps off to the south where we can. It's kind of ridiculous, but I wish I could stop Chinese production

Around KUNMING, we stopped the latest assault cold in the mountains, at 1-3 attack. Unlike the rest of China, supplies are not a problem here, thanks to the HUMP fliers. Not sure how he is going to crack this area, but he could just leave it; it's not like I can break out easily either.

Burma:

I am bombing again, but I am not going to attempt an attack; with stacking limits, it's very tough to make any headway against troops in rough terrain, given my own supply problems. I need to make enough of a demonstration to keep him busy here, but I plan to advance elsewhere.

Northern Oz:

The obviously point to advance from is Darwin; it's pretty built up now, and I have supplies and fuel flowing freely to it, via Normantown.

The main problem is that it's obvious; there are alot of IJN warships at Ambon, and probably KB will lurk nearby, so any move on Samlauki and Babo will result in maximum reaction. He'll see any move coming, because I can only get warships to Darwin by sailing them past Horn Island, where they can be observed easily.

So, any move is obvious, but I have PT and LBA support, so bring enough of a hammer and we can get there. A close-in fight may not be all a bad thing.

First I have to get more supplies and fuel there; a fuel convoy with 40K is about to arrive, and more supplies are coming from Normantown. To date, Greyjoy hasn't tried to interdict this supply route, other than observing it.

We'll see, this is one possibility

[Q-Ball]

2-19-43:

Slow couple days, mostly me moving ships around.

Repairs:

A TF consisting of 2 BBs, SARA, and LEX left Sydney for the West Coast of US. They are trailing an ASW TF, and have large escort. SBDs are on ASW. We are staying clear of main sea lanes. I am moving search aircraft ahead. Hopefully this is enough to prevent a sub hit.

YORKTOWN, HORNET, and WASP are all repairing at Sydney; they will complete repairs by April 1943, so no big deal. By then, they will have Hellcats.

LEXINGTON might take longer to repair then I would like, but we start getting the ESSEX class in June, so that helps.

In addition to above, we already have several BBs under long-term repair/upgrade, including:

NEVADA, OKLAHOMA, CALIFORNIA (these are all due late 1943), and IDAHO. CALIFORNIA, in particular, was really hammered at Pearl, taking 83 major float damage. It took a year just to get her seaworthy, and I went ahead and let her do the 270-day AA upgrade due to the fact she was so damaged anyway.

Next Moves:

So, the big thing is what to do next. Some candidates:

--Invasion north from Darwin: I already highlighted pros-cons; supportable by LBA, but figures to be oppossed by max effort on the part of the IJN/IJA forces. I think I can get ashore on those islands.
--Marcus Island: I think invading here would really cause him to think. I have a full division, tanks, etc already prepped. The problem is this is tricky; I would need to grossly overstack to take it, then get everyone off. If KB shows up, it could get very ugly ou there. I figure to have a free 2-3 days at least though.
--Kuriles: This would freak him out; I am going to begin RECON at any rate, because this will at least draw more troops to the area and let me know what's up
--Christmas Is: I can get to this before KB can, but likely to get alot of resistance quickly
--Guad/Tulagi: This is the one spot I can invade, and I am not likely to face max LBA. KB can get there quickly. It's also not very strategic, but possibility.

Lots of choices, none of them great. I am inclined to just slug it out north of Darwin, but we'll see

[JocMeister]

Why not do two things? If you start out with a Guad/Tulagi you can then advance North towards Rabaul under LBA for the remainder of 43? It shouldn´t need a massive naval presence after the first landing. And once the troops are onshore you can dash to NOPAC with the fleet.

I bet once you land on Guad/Tulagi GJ won´t expect another landing. Especially not in NOPAC. Don´t know if you have to forces to go for both though and still remain a threat enough around Darwin? As long as GJ thinks you will go for DEI I bet he will keep the KB there.

[DivePac88]

I would suggest (humbly) that operations from Darwin, into the Banda and Timor Sea areas. Is your only real option at present, owing to the fact that your Flight-decks are unavailable for now. Landings at Babar, Saumlaki, and Taberfane can be easy supported by LBA from Darwin. While it is an easy run for any Support/landing forces from Northwest Aussie, and they can be covered by LBA on approach and withdrawal.

You have already seen what a 1943 model KB is capable of, and any of your other planned operations could easily be disrupted by his carrier force. At present your strongest weapon of power projection is your LBA, and it is the only real counter to KB you have also. I would also suggest deploying a Submarine Task Force into the Banda Sea, as any approach by his naval forces would have to come through that restricted area.

[bigred]

I like the Tulagi/Lunga Idea. Basicly because it is a shorter supply run. If you start ops north of Darwin it will be an extra 30 hexes of sea transport and will weaken the punch you need to attack into finch/lae/Umboi island complex later. Also I noted the traditional approach of Mac and Nimitz allows for some form of supporting coordination. If you send
SWPAC into Sumlakai then you have a wide split between adjacent army coordination.

My humble 2 cents..

[Q-Ball]

I'm not worried about length of supply line; the Allies have so many transports, and so many excess engineering units, it's not a big deal at all.

Airpower Help:

The biggest problem is lack of aircover, particularly the lack of range of Allied fighters. Although Samlauki and Babar are 6 hexes from Bathurst Island, well within range of my aircraft, those spots can be easily attacked from Lautem, Ambon, etc, several large airbases that are more than 8+ hexes away from Bathurst. That is within range of the P-38, but I don't have that plane in sufficient numbers to sustain a bombing campaign. Also, this mod the effects of bombing are reduced, so it's tougher for the Allies to shut down airfields easily.

I've been hoarding P-38s and using them sparingly, but I don't really have an aircraft that I can use on Sweeps. I can use P-38s, but I can't sustain that. When I have the 2nd generation P-47 with drop tanks, I'll finally have a fighter in numbers that can tackle Tojos and George at favorible kill rates, but not before then.

I would like advice from a veteran player on the later air war, because Greyjoy actually has more experience than I do there; I have never played a PBEM past mid-1943. Help is needed!

Can the P-38 be used as sweepers without high losses? Corsair looks good, but it also has low replacement rates. The Hellcat might be a solution, but need to fill out CV groups first. The lack of a good fighter is a real problem.

The other challenge is accumulating bombers in numbers, though the B-24D is now producing at 48/mo which should fill-out the 4Es pretty soon. I am still short of 2Es, though B-25 production is also increasing, just not enough.

Southern DEI:

So, assuming I have large, well-supplied, maxes out airbases at Bathurst (size 8) and Darwin (size 9), tactically, how can I get ashore cleanly at Samlauki, Babar, and Selaroe?

Assume the IJN is there with everything, and that he has several large airbases packed with torpedo bombers, etc. How can I manage this tactially?

About the only advantage I have is that I can move ships to within 2-3 hexes of those points without any attacks. His Nav Attack settings are all lower-range to avoid cap traps, so he is allowing me free passage very close to those islands. The other point is that he won't know the exact target that turn before, since I can easily reach one of 4 or 5 places, so he can only send surface ships to a couple points. I can also deploy PTs, which will help break-up surface attacks.

Trying to LRCAP from 6 hexes away vs. 400+ LBA is daunting; not sure how to do that. I could send in a dummy TF on turn 1 to chew-up his attackers, but eventually I have to jump in the fire. And if KB shows-up, that's just more strike power.

If Bathurst is piled high with fighters I can maybe get 100-150 LRCAP at that range, but I really need CVEs to provide extra support. That adds to the risk.

So, I have some real problems trying to slog onto those points. Advice from 1943 vets is appreciated!

DEI Happenings:

I bombarded Dobo, sinking a DD, but screwed-up orders on another TF that got plastered with VALS. DETROIT and CONCORD, two older cruisers, were sunk. I've lost 5 Omahas now, almost the entire class! Really bad on my part.

THey were 3 hexes from Dobo, which is the max setting. Greyjoy is cleverly setting his bombers to shorter-range, so if I send surface TFs they will dispatch any cripples. Yet, if they were longer range I would CAP-trap them.

The fact that he is NOT setting his naval range too high is allowing me to build up Darwin at will, but it is also putting a break on further expansion.

Chengtu Falls:

Chengtu falls, and with it the last city in China other than Chungking. This also releases more IJA troops for service elsewhere.

I am already seeing units from China all over the place, so the IJA will be massively respositioning units from China. That, coupled with stacking limits, will make the task very difficult, and stretch my divisions to the limit.

This won't be easy

[crsutton]

As for your air problem, I have little to offer. If the Japanese player has control of production an PDU is on then you are going to face superior aircraft until the hellcat comes on line. And neither the thunderbold or hellcat takes drop thanks until late 43, so your range will still be limited.

The good news is that the hellcat can take on any Japanese fighter and beat it with the exception of the Frank, but you will not see the Frank for a while. The early corsair and lightning both suffer from and 3 service rating. You cannot use them in a sustained manner. They are good planes otherwise but you don't have enough to make a difference. The hellcat was my go to fighter in late 43. I used a lot of them from land bases and lost a lot. But I killed a lot of tojos and georges with them.

You will never have enough mediums until you get enough dominating fighters. Mid 1944 perhaps.

The thunderbolt is your best fighter-forever and can work over the frank. You just never have enough. Spit VIII is not bad either. You just have to wait if out. It gets better every month.

[Bullwinkle58]

Hey, Q-Ball. I read this, but don't comment as you're far better at PBEM than I am.

I've played 1943 three times agaisnt the AI. The air war is probably the most similar to PBEM since the combat code is the same and the AI Japanese get even more "free" planes than in a PBEM. All I can say is you're on the right track. The P-47 is your great friend. You don't need as many since they get hurt but get home. They can really dish out high-altitude damage as well.

To me the P-38 in game is a litle disappointing. The twin engines make them somewhat hangar queens. You have to be careful not to push them over the edge. They are decent sweepers, but you have to pick and choose.

The Corsair is great from islands. Good maintenance rates and can also take a fair bit of damage. Really benefit from the best pilots you have. The Brits get some and by the time they do sometimes don't need them in British areas since the Spits are also so good, so you can move some of the Brit Corsairs.

The P-40Ks are also not worthless if you need volume. Have to pick your party though.

I've found the P-51As to be mostly a waste.

On bombers I usually don't use the mid-war 2Es on airfileds much. I'm an anti-shipping guy.

As for the DEI, it's a bear when you find yourself where you are. To quote an old "Hee Haw" routine, "Doc! It hurts when I do this!" Doc says, "So don't do that!"

Mid-Pac plays to his weakness in carriers. DEI plays to his strength in plane production nirvana.

Since I'm in a first PBEM myself I fear I've said too much. [:)]

Good luck!

[PaxMondo]

Playing from the other side, let me suggest some weaknesses.
 
Planes he can have depending upon how he is running his economy.  AV though is fixed and limited.  IJ doesn't have enough AV support for longterm air campaigns in multiple theatres like the allies do.  If he is supporting ~1000 planes in the DEI he is weak elsewhere and not mobile.  All those Engr units at 24AV each ... that's a lot of units to have to try and move around.  And those precious Air HQ's ... so few.  If they are in the DEI, then again they are not elsewhere.
 
If he is building lotsa Tojo's now, then he didn't pay attention in MikeS' IJ Economics 101.  In '45 he won't have the HI to build all the Shindens he would like, you'll be facing Tojo's with your Stangs.  [;)]
 
Patience.  It's still early in '43.  You have another couple of months before you fighter production really ramps up.  Float like a butterfly ... etc.