The Great Patriotic War (STE78 vs 821bobo)

tolsdorff · Post by **tolsdorff** » Thu Dec 15, 2016 7:03 am

I learned to read russian which goes rather well. speaking it is an entirely different thing though! extremely difficult to understand spoken russian.

STEF78 · Post by **STEF78** » Sun Dec 18, 2016 6:30 pm

Turn 128, 25th november 1943

Major rivers aren't still frozen. Some axis units benefit from rest before storm.

Leningrad

We have reached the gulf of Finland. German units and finns units are separated!

Center

The germans give some ground between Kursk and Orel. Without level 3 entrenchment a PzGrD is unable to resist.

Don bend

Heavy fights east of Kharkov. The germans give up 20 miles between Boguchar and Rostov

vvs007 · Post by **vvs007** » Sun Dec 18, 2016 9:47 pm

I'm afraid that will leave the game in favor of the game vs Bozo
well that is another game quickly ended [:D](do not be offended - it's just a joke)

STEF78 · Post by **STEF78** » Mon Dec 19, 2016 5:31 am

ORIGINAL: GDHF

I'm afraid that will leave the game in favor of the game vs Bozo
well that is another game quickly ended [:D](do not be offended - it's just a joke)

Bozo is the best player I've played against (except maybe Schascha). We did 3 games and I lost 3 times. My best performance was when I played the germans. As already written I would have liked to see him against Michael T or Sapper222.

vvs007 · Post by **vvs007** » Mon Dec 19, 2016 11:03 pm

WITE has a lot of problems with balance and movement rules, the supply system
-build up
-units have no front or rear
-the supply of all army using a single branch railway
-inability to destroy the air on this branch of the railway
etc etc

these unhistorical and unrelated to real life

Take for example counterattacks mechanized corps of the Red Army, in the game it is a useless thing, a suicide, but in real life Zhukov won a lot of time, resources, caused serious damage to the Wehrmacht and save Kiev from the same as the quick capture of Minsk

there are gamers who have learned to very good use of those errors mechanics
do not like such achievements but nevertheless, we love exactly this game - in other games mechanics more far from reality

topeverest · Post by **topeverest** » Tue Dec 20, 2016 6:52 pm

Been reading since I started my game as the ruskies.

Osmosis isn't working for me, so I will just have to learn the old fashioned way - by studying others' results.
great insight here. Thanks

STEF78 · Post by **STEF78** » Wed Dec 21, 2016 4:39 am

ORIGINAL: GDHF

...WITE has a lot of problems with balance and movement rules, the supply system
-build up
-units have no front or rear
-the supply of all army using a single branch railway
-inability to destroy the air on this branch of the railway...

Agreed.

The game isn't perfect. I would had to the list above:
- Permissive logistics allowing german Pzd to move several hundred of miles without rest...
- Encircled units unable to resist more than 2 weeks
- Time/scale. Due to the IGOYOUGO-one week turn, and in order to avoid great encirclement, the russians build a 40 miles deep defence. That's unhistorical.
- AFV losses are far too low
- once they have the initiative, the russians are able to attack during a whole season without rest

But it's the best simulation of WW2 eastern front so far

STEF78 · Post by **STEF78** » Wed Dec 21, 2016 4:42 am

ORIGINAL: topeverest

Been reading since I started my game as the ruskies.

Osmosis isn't working for me, so I will just have to learn the old fashioned way - by studying others' results.
great insight here. Thanks

Thanks

Learning through others AAR is a good way.

But my best lessons come from my personal mistakes/defeats against human players

STEF78 · Post by **STEF78** » Wed Dec 21, 2016 6:47 am

Turn 129, 2nd december 1943

Russian winter is here. Major rivers won't be an issue within 2 weeks.

Leningrad

The battle for Leningrad has begun. Finns are well entrenched but they are fighting at 1 against 10. And I must sack this Krylov!

Center

The german line is always weaker between Smolensk and Orel

Don bend

The germans are giving 10/20 miles. It prevents hasty attacks.

STEF78 · Post by **STEF78** » Sun Jan 01, 2017 4:45 pm

Turn 130, 9th december 1943

Slow rate of update as we played only 2 turns during the last 3 weeks and as we are only 2 turns ahead. That's why some areas in the center are hidden.

Center

The german line holds but time is hard for front line german units. A routed german Pzd is losing only 20 afv...

Don bend

The germans are still giving 20 miles per week but try to hold Rostov. Very strong line in front of Kharkov

821Bobo · Post by **821Bobo** » Mon Jan 02, 2017 4:45 pm

The german line holds but time is hard for front line german units. A routed german Pzd is losing only 20 afv...

But this applies for Soviets as well. If you check my counterattacks most of the time your routed units have lighter losses than my attacking Panzers.

vvs007 · Post by **vvs007** » Wed Jan 04, 2017 2:37 pm

logically be dependent losses of routed unit:

1.the number of the attacking tanks to harass
2.air superiority
3.the presence of reserves in the second line of defense

wait for WITE2 ? [:)]

821Bobo · Post by **821Bobo** » Wed Jan 04, 2017 4:24 pm

The losses are really ridiculous. Most of my counterattacks are against 1-2 Tank or Cavalry corps with 100-250 tanks and I am committing multiple Panzer divs up to 1000+ AVFs and the results are like me 70 damaged and 30 destroyed, Soviets 20-30 destroyed. Lost men are roughly the same for both sides, 800-1200.

STEF78 · Post by **STEF78** » Wed Jan 04, 2017 4:54 pm

See below some battles of the current turn involving 1000+ german AFV

821Bobo · Post by **821Bobo** » Wed Jan 04, 2017 5:35 pm

You don't think the losses are too light, for both sides?

STEF78 · Post by **STEF78** » Wed Jan 04, 2017 5:53 pm

ORIGINAL: 821Bobo

You don't think the losses are too light, for both sides?

Agreed, losses are too light considering the number of men, AFV and guns involved

timmyab · Post by **timmyab** » Wed Jan 04, 2017 6:08 pm

Losses for routed units are way too low especially forced routs through a cordon. This should cause heavy losses in men and heavy equipment imo. In my experience losses for routed units are actually lower than for retreated units.

Like a lot of things in the WITE I've given up thinking about it and just try to play it for great game that it is.

821Bobo · Post by **821Bobo** » Wed Jan 04, 2017 6:39 pm

Losses for routed units are way too low especially forced routs through a cordon. This should cause heavy losses in men and heavy equipment imo. In my experience losses for routed units are actually lower than for retreated units.

This! I was talking about routed units, they have really low casualties. In Stefs's examples are retreats and the AFVs losses are not that light(1/3 are pretty heavy losses), but men are low.

STEF78 · Post by **STEF78** » Thu Jan 12, 2017 6:21 pm

Turn 131, 16th december 1943

The germans are trying to hold the line from Leningrad to Kharkov and are giving ground in South Ukraine

Leningrad
A strong assault is required to free Pushkin. The finns are isolated.

Center

The german line shows clear signs of weakness... reinforcements are required.

South
Heavy battles around Rostov

jwolf · Post by **jwolf** » Fri Jan 13, 2017 12:45 pm

How hard will it be to cross the river protecting the Finns near Leningrad?

The Great Patriotic War (STE78 vs 821bobo)

RE: November 1943

November 1943

RE: November 1943

RE: November 1943

RE: November 1943

RE: November 1943

RE: November 1943

RE: November 1943

December 1943

December 1943

RE: December 1943

RE: December 1943

RE: December 1943

RE: December 1943

RE: December 1943

RE: December 1943

RE: December 1943

RE: December 1943

December 1943

RE: December 1943