Update SPWAW OOB's

[BryanMelvin]

Originally posted by Voriax
The problem with heavy mg's always firing isn't related to the class, but the fact that they have penetration values in the first place. Remove *both* AP and HE penetration and then they behave like every other machine gun.

However as I already hear the scream of 'unjust' I fear this won't change
I don't think that Matrix Guys are willing to make a code change that would make the 'chance to fire' probabilities same to all mg's...?

Voriax

The 50 Cal and 12.7 class HMGs are special class of HMGs. One reason for there evolution was to fill a need for an Anti-Armor role.

The Current Penetration factors this in. I fear that changing these will create unseen coding issues. These could be reduced but this needs more testing verses Aircraft as well as light armor. Any Volunteers??

[john g]

Originally posted by KG Erwin
The satchel charge shows "size" as 222. Should be 2. Easy fix.

Are you sure that this isn't a flag value? Something like the 222 used for small autocannons?
thanks, John.

[BryanMelvin]

The 50 cal co ax fire is a coding issue. I cannot stop these from firing in oob fix

Moving these to another weapon slot (slot 40) prevents these from 360 degree fire

Can someone give me the real armor Pen. a 50 cal armor piercing round can penatrate at 500 yards and at 1000 yards? as well as the normal round can penatrate?

This info can help me decide what to do with these values.

Next, for now, in game play and scenario design - a fix would be to switch the 50 cal co ax HMGs off - using the space bar command and select the 50 cal not to fire. Wild Bill does this often in his spwaw scenarios

[KG Erwin]

Originally posted by john g
Are you sure that this isn't a flag value? Something like the 222 used for small autocannons?
thanks, John.

The Satchel Charge is a secondary infantry class weapon, and shouldn't weapon size be similar to others in that class? The AT Mine is also size 2. Size 222 weapons are all classed as anti-aircraft weapons, like the 20mm Flak. Am I missing something here?

[o4r]

Most of all, I hate it when infantry assault when close in and didnt use all their weapon instead. Instead, inorder they use their weapon, I have to T to target it and then C to select what weapon to use.

And our special sniper with gauss rifle is still around. When play German or any country with high experience, dont buy tanks, buy all sniper and a few counter artillery. The sniper chances to assault is high to destroy a tank complete (I dunno with what but most likely he travel through time and got hold of a gauss rifle).
I have tried this stupid way against human player and it work. I only need to concentrate on counter artillery and whenever a tank come near, it will be assault by a tank. The tank and infantry in it will be so badly suppressed.

I was wondering how the hell they come out the formulae for assault.

I realise this when my tanks was destroyed by a human player who is playing Russian. My crewman destroy all it tank back!!!! So I started with sniper and discover this great sniper of the future.

[Panzer Leo]

Originally posted by Voriax
Those 20mm guns you talk about..they have the weapon code 222 which means they only need one type of ammo, the AP. It's used either as HE or AP depending of target. They tend to have APCR which balances things a bit.

Voriax

This was also a big issue while creating H2H - problem with the automatic cannons (kwks also, not just Flak) was exactly what is prescribed here - ineffectiveness and also an incredible inaccuracy. The "222" code weapons are supposed to only use HE and maybe some shots of APCR - the HE then should be counted as AP when it hits armor, but it does not work. Therefore ALL automaticcannons where applied with AP ammo. A 20mm in an SPW234/1 comes with HE, AP and APCR ammo load, e.g.

That is the only way I could get rid of the performence errors - after one year of extensive use no known sideefects or handicaps are known...works perfect...but is a lot of work

The HE kill of multibarreled AA was also a big change in H2H - I can recommend the values used, battlefield behaviour is very realistic in terms of infantry kill and against planes...the whole heavy machine gun and autocannon stuff suffered a lot from not carefully tested changes in the last versions of SPWAW...

Feel free to use as much of H2H as you want - no need to do work twice and it is so often tested now under PBEM conditions and AI play, that these changes are bulletproof...

Starting to change some OOB errors is like open Pandora's box

[o4r]

Originally posted by Panzer Leo
This was also a big issue while creating H2H - problem with the automatic cannons (kwks also, not just Flak) was exactly what is prescribed here - ineffectiveness and also an incredible inaccuracy. The "222" code weapons are supposed to only use HE and maybe some shots of APCR - the HE then should be counted as AP when it hits armor, but it does not work. Therefore ALL automaticcannons where applied with AP ammo. A 20mm in an SPW234/1 comes with HE, AP and APCR ammo load, e.g.

That is the only way I could get rid of the performence errors - after one year of extensive use no known sideefects or handicaps are known...works perfect...but is a lot of work

The HE kill of multibarreled AA was also a big change in H2H - I can recommend the values used, battlefield behaviour is very realistic in terms of infantry kill and against planes...the whole heavy machine gun and autocannon stuff suffered a lot from not carefully tested changes in the last versions of SPWAW...

Feel free to use as much of H2H as you want - no need to do work twice and it is so often tested now under PBEM conditions and AI play, that these changes are bulletproof...

Starting to change some OOB errors is like open Pandora's box

Panzer Leo, your H2H is great, I downloaded it and take a look. But there is one major problem, can you rename all those unit back to English. Image if another person create another data and maybe call J2J and he uses Japanese.

One day Matrix realise that all the data you all have provided is so useful that they wanted to combine all together, we will have this problem of intergration of data. You use German for German unit and that guy use Japanese but Matrix use German. Then come a Polish old man before he died he created in Polish lanague for Polish unit. I think intergrating is a very big issue.

But overall your data is pretty accurate and nice to see picture which I never really have. I like some of your unit deployment which is pretty close to the OOB of German unit Book I have.

Overall you really did alot of different from the game I started to play about maybe a year or half before. That was really great but I really appreciate you could have a simple english version language for the German.

[BryanMelvin]

The new OOBs are being finalized. Many a fix has gone into to improving combat results.

I did lessen the 50 cal and 12.7 HMG HE penetrates rates as these were too high but I also increase all other HMG's MMHs HE Penetration values to more WW II realistic levels.

HMG's will rain Havoc on Trucks and HT's if these get too close.

HMG, MMG, and LMG will suppress armor slightly more than before when fired from short ranges.

The Too Hit combat for armor combat has been improved and is now what it was originally designed to be. After much testing on this, Paul Vebbers Math for Armor - range - degree of slope work extremely well after the current fix. This means that Low experience crews will hit their target without any need to modify experience, morale, leader rates.

Most of the Formations have been fixed and the Italian OOBs are being cleaned up and I would like to personlly thank Ruxius for his help on these!

A little more formations checks and these should be done!

[TheOriginalOverlord]

Did the HE Kill for the .50cal/12.7's get adjusted down any?

How about the HE Pen for the 20mm AA guns, did it get any?


Thanks

[VikingNo2]

Where will it be posted when it is accomplished, I wish I could pay you guys some how.

[Lars]

Sorry for asking this in the wrong thread, but what can I do. This will be an official update and then maybe... :rolleyes:

It's about the asterisk ( * ) in the game. When playing PBEM if you have the "willy meter" set to unabled you can't change this in the game. BUT, if you play another game with the willy meter set to enabled and then moves over to the PBEM, then the willy meter is enabled there also.

This makes this thing an unsecured preference setting and that's also making it very unusable.
I like to play without it to make things more interesting, but if my partner chooses to switch it off, nothing will hinder him from doing so.

Would it be possible to make it a secure preference without too much trouble?

Thanks
/Lars

[BryanMelvin]

Originally posted by Lars
Sorry for asking this in the wrong thread, but what can I do. This will be an official update and then maybe... :rolleyes:

It's about the asterisk ( * ) in the game. When playing PBEM if you have the "willy meter" set to unabled you can't change this in the game. BUT, if you play another game with the willy meter set to enabled and then moves over to the PBEM, then the willy meter is enabled there also.

This makes this thing an unsecured preference setting and that's also making it very unusable.
I like to play without it to make things more interesting, but if my partner chooses to switch it off, nothing will hinder him from doing so.

Would it be possible to make it a secure preference without too much trouble?

Thanks
/Lars

I am not sure - will look into it..

[BryanMelvin]

Pnazer Leo - I sent a privet message to you about HMG movement issue - just in case it did not go thru since your email box was full when I sent it.

Spwaw is a You Go - I Go system. This is why the MMG-HMG fire and move creates game cheats. The side that moves these MGs first will have an advantage. A player moves - sets up his MGs to fire before the other player can move. If both sides moved in Real Time - the MMG-HMG fire and move feature would work. This was one main reason it was dropped from spwaw. As it is now, you would say to the other play hold up - I am setting up my MGs and after I do so - you can then move into my kill zone. Now. if both sides moved at same time - the other players side would be upon the MG team setting up its MG!

[Wild Bill]

I think you guys are gonna really like these changes Marauder and his team have accomplished. I feel the OOBs will be better than they have ever been before. Great material for a great game!

WB

[Lars]

Originally posted by BryanMelvin
I am not sure - will look into it..

Thanks Marauder! That's all I can ask for...

[rbrunsman]

Originally posted by Wild Bill
I think you guys are gonna really like these changes Marauder and his team have accomplished. I feel the OOBs will be better than they have ever been before. Great material for a great game!

WB

Could someone give us a status on the new OOBs? Gmenfan gives a link for the new OOBs at the beginning of this thread but I suspect that it isn't the final OOB files we are anticitpating. Will there be a General Announcement so that everyone can start migrating to these OOBs?

Thanks for the great work.
Bob

[VikingNo2]

I know its a little late to be bringing up changes, but I feel that the spotting meter I think its a # or something like that should be taken out of the game or changed quite a bit, if a units passes all the checks and spots a unit then great it spots the unit. Unless you really believe that a Truck Driver sitting in a truck , that is running, can really spot a Elite recon squad at 500 meters ! Or ( insert laughter here ) hear them, my fault sence them.


It just makes no sence that units just feel other units. I know you hear reports of such and yes it does happen ( with battle hardeded highly experienced troop ) but the game, does not potray it well; at best it should be a 30%-40% chance ( For elite troops ). And for units that are avarage, or have low experience, even lower, they should regularly be getting false positives as well, for example I have heard this option takes into account hearing someone but not seeing them, this is also one of the biggest reason for false positives. 1 ( the pig in the bush, or the dog or the civilian ect.... ) 2 ( just plain old inexperience and fear)

It should be less accurate and units with little combat experience should be getting a large amount of false positives. I know most like this option, but if it wrong it is wrong.

[BryanMelvin]

The Status on the new OOB is excellent

We are wrapping up the UK and CA oobs and after that - they'll be ready

I would say - they should be out in one to two weeks from now.

Next - as for spotting - this is in the mech.exe itself and not in oobs. I am not sure if a new mech exe update will be released any time soon.

[KG Erwin]

Let's see, the wife & daughter are going to visit the in-laws for a week starting April 17. Hmm... yes, the time frame is just about right to peruse the new "final" OOBs and start a new campaign without interruption, except for going to work and answering the phone. "No, I can't make it to the office today...think I've got...uh, trigger finger!"

[o4r]

Originally posted by KG Erwin
Let's see, the wife & daughter are going to visit the in-laws for a week starting April 17. Hmm... yes, the time frame is just about right to peruse the new "final" OOBs and start a new campaign without interruption, except for going to work and answering the phone. "No, I can't make it to the office today...think I've got...uh, trigger finger!"

Hey, that is "Bachelor week"...... when the cat is out, the mouse is the boss......