Dutch AVP Arend: Scenario 1 Exploits
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Re: Dutch AVP Arend: Scenario 1 Exploits
4Sep was a big day for AVP Arend. It had been expected that new orders would be received soon but no one new when they would be received or what they would involve. As the crew gathered, LCDR Bax, JS filled in some of the blanks. Arend would be leaving Geraldton and heading 320 miles north to Carnarvon. It had been obvious that Command was shifting activity north for some time. Engineers were moving north to improve the base and AF at Carnarvon. Currently there was no protection from enemy submarines as the port was only L2(0). Originally there had been no port at all at Carnarvon so operations were likely to be much more of a challenge then they were at Geraldton, even if additional improvements to the maximum size of L3 were accomplished. It was expected that when Arend reached Carnarvon details on their new mission would be available.
LCDR Bax took some time to review the status of Arend. At 1020 tons, Arend was a small auxiliary ship assigned to ABDA Command. She was slow. Armament was decent for such a small ship. Arend was equipped with a float plane capable of carrying 2x250# bombs. She could provide support for 7 seaplanes of any type and could travel roughly 3000 miles on a single load of fuel.
Arend's crew had relatively low combat experience although there had been some improvement from Day/Night Experience of 25/20 to 33/26 since the start of the war.
The pilots assigned to Arend were FO Ainsworth, K. and FLT Young, EW. They had replaced the original assigned pilots about a month ago and were recently training on Naval Search. FLT Young was clearly the more experienced pilot, having flown 10x as many missions with a search skill rated as double of Ainsworth's.
LCDR Bax took some time to review the status of Arend. At 1020 tons, Arend was a small auxiliary ship assigned to ABDA Command. She was slow. Armament was decent for such a small ship. Arend was equipped with a float plane capable of carrying 2x250# bombs. She could provide support for 7 seaplanes of any type and could travel roughly 3000 miles on a single load of fuel.
Arend's crew had relatively low combat experience although there had been some improvement from Day/Night Experience of 25/20 to 33/26 since the start of the war.
The pilots assigned to Arend were FO Ainsworth, K. and FLT Young, EW. They had replaced the original assigned pilots about a month ago and were recently training on Naval Search. FLT Young was clearly the more experienced pilot, having flown 10x as many missions with a search skill rated as double of Ainsworth's.
Last edited by WEXF on Wed Jul 24, 2024 2:01 pm, edited 3 times in total.
Re: Dutch AVP Arend: Scenario 1 Exploits
If you are going to use Arend so support aircraft Naval Search and ASW, then the pilots should train for those skills and not Low Naval attack.
Seek peace but keep your gun handy.
I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!
“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
; Julia Child

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”


Re: Dutch AVP Arend: Scenario 1 Exploits
Agree completely. See the complete posting above.RangerJoe wrote: Wed Jul 24, 2024 1:49 pm If you are going to use Arend so support aircraft Naval Search and ASW, then the pilots should train for those skills and not Low Naval attack.
Re: Dutch AVP Arend: Scenario 1 Exploits
5Sep found the AF at Carnarvon 32%>L4. Arend was at sea in TF 188 heading to Carnarvon. With her were 2 minesweepers and an AG. When Arend reaches Carnarvon it is expected that she will be given new orders that will put her in harms way. The rumor is that Arend will be part of small convoys delivering supplies to and removing resources from northern coast bases.
In some posts on this forum it has been said that the resources located on the north coast of Australia are not of real value to the Japanese and therefore do not need to be defended by the Allies. Everyone is entitled to their opinions.Re: Dutch AVP Arend: Scenario 1 Exploits
6Sep found TF 188 about 1 day away from reaching Carnarvon and the AF at that base 35%>L4. What the crew of Arend did not know was that Command was currently reviewing how Arend and other assets in the region would be deployed to the task of extracting valuable resources at Corunna Downs in anticipation of the enemy invading northern Australia. In a small conference room at Exmouth a number of senior officers were going over the data. It was well known that the mines at Corunna Downs produced 2000 tons of valuable materials each day and that the only major transportation avenues out of the mines were a single road and rail connection to Port Hedland. Of course there were numerous small networks of dirt roads and trails that would allow some movement of resources through the desert at a slow pace but it was not entirely clear how efficient that would be. Since the start of the action there had been roughly 273 days of production generating 546,000 tons of resources. A test had been put in place at the start of September to try to get some answers. Exmouth had been selected as a base where resources could be stored awaiting the arrival of ships that could move them south to larger bases with RR connections. On 1Sep Exmouth was set as a base with the "Resource Storage" button set to yes. The thinking was that since Exmouth was closer to Corunna Downs and Port Hedland than to any other potential source of resources the mechanics of movement of resources to a base designated as a storage location would draw resources across the desert from these locations.
It was clear that the numbers at Corunna Downs were not adding up. If there were 33644 tons there on 5Sep and 2000 more were produced, there should be 35644 there on 6Sep unless some moved somewhere. Were they in the desert heading to Exmouth or elsewhere?
A closer look at the overall production at Corunna Downs provided some more data. Of the 546,000 tons produced, there were currently 337,293 tons in the three bases of Port Hedland, Corunna Downs and Exmouth. What happened to the other 208,707 tons? Sure there was a few convoys over the last 8 months that extracted some resources like the 2400 removed by TF 339. It was recalled that on 12Jul 7000 tons were extracted by TF256 (see post of November 4, 2023). Likely there were others but not in a number that could account for the missing tonnage. Clearly, over 100,000 tons of resources had made it out of Corunna Downs through the desert on the small networks of dirt road and trails.
Almost immediately, some resources had moved to Exmouth, a little over 7200 tons had made the trip but had not increased in the last four days. The data for the 5th and 6th of September was very interesting as nothing additional had reached Exmouth and the resources at Port Hedland had gone down by 2400. What happened at Port Hedland was easily explained. TF339 had recently arrived and was in the process of loading resources.It was clear that the numbers at Corunna Downs were not adding up. If there were 33644 tons there on 5Sep and 2000 more were produced, there should be 35644 there on 6Sep unless some moved somewhere. Were they in the desert heading to Exmouth or elsewhere?
A closer look at the overall production at Corunna Downs provided some more data. Of the 546,000 tons produced, there were currently 337,293 tons in the three bases of Port Hedland, Corunna Downs and Exmouth. What happened to the other 208,707 tons? Sure there was a few convoys over the last 8 months that extracted some resources like the 2400 removed by TF 339. It was recalled that on 12Jul 7000 tons were extracted by TF256 (see post of November 4, 2023). Likely there were others but not in a number that could account for the missing tonnage. Clearly, over 100,000 tons of resources had made it out of Corunna Downs through the desert on the small networks of dirt road and trails.
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Re: Dutch AVP Arend: Scenario 1 Exploits
Some of the resources could have gone east to Broome and then on the road from there. Darwin can accumulate a lot sometimes, although it also produces 400 per day so it is hard to know if any came there from CDowns. Exmouth port is likely too small to store any more than the amount you are seeing. Just as supply storage is limited by port and airfield size, so is resources until you get to level 9. And then there is the loss of resources through 'wastage'. Supply suffers 'spoilage' (and pilferage) during long trips in back country so resources likely does too. Local mule skinners likely sell some coal to hunters for fresh or dried meats or water.
No matter how bad a situation is, you can always make it worse. - Chris Hadfield : An Astronaut's Guide To Life On Earth
Re: Dutch AVP Arend: Scenario 1 Exploits
It goes south via Exmouth.
The hexes between Exmouth and Port Hedland are Desert. The hexes between Port Hedland and Broome are SandDesert. Nothing reaches Broome from Port Hedland.
At least that is what I read when I press "5".
The hexes between Exmouth and Port Hedland are Desert. The hexes between Port Hedland and Broome are SandDesert. Nothing reaches Broome from Port Hedland.
At least that is what I read when I press "5".
Re: Dutch AVP Arend: Scenario 1 Exploits
Note to WEXF: apparently the '5' key only works in games against the AI, not in PBEM.
No matter how bad a situation is, you can always make it worse. - Chris Hadfield : An Astronaut's Guide To Life On Earth
Re: Dutch AVP Arend: Scenario 1 Exploits
In theory, you could disable res stockpiling in Exmouth, dock an xAK in Exmouth, load resources, and with time, the xAK should load some of resources piling up in Port Hedland.
Re: Dutch AVP Arend: Scenario 1 Exploits
I agree with Yaab. In this AAR on 6Sep there are zero resources in all of the bases east of Port Hedland until you get to Darwin. It will be interesting to watch what happens on a day by day basis, in the three subject bases, to see if some patterns develop that might provide a better understanding of the process.Yaab wrote: Mon Aug 12, 2024 1:22 pm It goes south via Exmouth.
The hexes between Exmouth and Port Hedland are Desert. The hexes between Port Hedland and Broome are SandDesert. Nothing reaches Broome from Port Hedland.
At least that is what I read when I press "5".
Re: Dutch AVP Arend: Scenario 1 Exploits
WEXF, allow me to post this in your ARR.


Re: Dutch AVP Arend: Scenario 1 Exploits
Yaab, great to have it posted here. It will help lots of players to better understand what could be happening.
Command has decided that the shipping to be used will be Coastal Cargo xAKL. These small ships are only 1050 tons and can load 1000 resources each. They are also only 1 VP if lost. The plan is to use 5 ships at Exmouth (P1) as all will be able to dock and load 400 resources/day for a total of 2000/day. That remains under the maximum daily load capability of 2,500. Loading will take 3 days.
At Port Hedland (P2) 7 ships will be used. Each will be able to load 800/day for a total of 5600, within the maximum load capability of 6250. Loading will take 2 days.
Command has decided that the shipping to be used will be Coastal Cargo xAKL. These small ships are only 1050 tons and can load 1000 resources each. They are also only 1 VP if lost. The plan is to use 5 ships at Exmouth (P1) as all will be able to dock and load 400 resources/day for a total of 2000/day. That remains under the maximum daily load capability of 2,500. Loading will take 3 days.
At Port Hedland (P2) 7 ships will be used. Each will be able to load 800/day for a total of 5600, within the maximum load capability of 6250. Loading will take 2 days.
Re: Dutch AVP Arend: Scenario 1 Exploits
Wait, isn't resorces production capped like oil? Corunna Downs can only store 100 x daily production of 2000 resources. But Corunna Downs has access to base of Port Hedland, and the port can hold unlimited amount of resources, so resources jsut flow from Corunna Downs to Port Hedland. If there is a leak of resources, I don't think so many of them can leak via Exmouth.
Re: Dutch AVP Arend: Scenario 1 Exploits
I am not completely clear on the special rule regarding "storage maximums". I have seen references that limit the amount of oil that can be stored (by setting the storage button to "yes"), in a base that produces oil. I would like to know where that rule is stated?Yaab wrote: Mon Aug 12, 2024 2:54 pm Wait, isn't resorces production capped like oil? Corunna Downs can only store 100 x daily production of 2000 resources. But Corunna Downs has access to base of Port Hedland, and the port can hold unlimited amount of resources, so resources jsut flow from Corunna Downs to Port Hedland. If there is a leak of resources, I don't think so many of them can leak via Exmouth.
I have not heard that the same restriction is in place for the storage of resources.
In any case, since the daily production of resources at Corunna Downs is 2000, if the restriction were applicable, Corunna Downs would have to have the resources storage set to yes and then there would be a maximum storage of 200,000. In this AAR, Corunna Downs does not have the resources storage button set to yes so the issue is moot.
That being said, it is clear that the vast amount of resources produced in Corunna Downs flow to Port Hedland like you say. The current numbers clearly show that.
Once in Port Hedland resources can certainly flow to Exmouth over the small trails.
Re: Dutch AVP Arend: Scenario 1 Exploits
It is unlikely that the resources will flow over the small trails that aren't marked on the map unless there was a demand for them. Are you short of resources elsewhere?
Seek peace but keep your gun handy.
I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!
“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
; Julia Child

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”


Re: Dutch AVP Arend: Scenario 1 Exploits
Looking at the numbers it is clear that resources moved to Exmouth after the storage button was set to "yes". The only way for the resources to get to Exmouth, since there was no sea transport of resources, was over the small trails. It will be very interesting to see what happens going forward.RangerJoe wrote: Mon Aug 12, 2024 8:31 pm It is unlikely that the resources will flow over the small trails that aren't marked on the map unless there was a demand for them. Are you short of resources elsewhere?
Re: Dutch AVP Arend: Scenario 1 Exploits
Yes some will travel especially if there is a demand there such as from CS convoys but which bases are short of resources? Do you have enough resources elsewhere so you won't have to ship these resources out if you don't need them elsewhere?WEXF wrote: Mon Aug 12, 2024 9:16 pmLooking at the numbers it is clear that resources moved to Exmouth after the storage button was set to "yes". The only way for the resources to get to Exmouth, since there was no sea transport of resources, was over the small trails. It will be very interesting to see what happens going forward.RangerJoe wrote: Mon Aug 12, 2024 8:31 pm It is unlikely that the resources will flow over the small trails that aren't marked on the map unless there was a demand for them. Are you short of resources elsewhere?
Seek peace but keep your gun handy.
I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!
“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
; Julia Child

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”


Re: Dutch AVP Arend: Scenario 1 Exploits
None of the bases in Australia are short on resources. So there is no "need" for resources to move in game terms. But they definitely are moving. Command is trying to do what would likely have been the decision IRL by getting as many of the Corunna Downs resources to bases that are less likely to be taken by the enemy.RangerJoe wrote: Mon Aug 12, 2024 11:43 pmYes some will travel especially if there is a demand there such as from CS convoys but which bases are short of resources? Do you have enough resources elsewhere so you won't have to ship these resources out if you don't need them elsewhere?WEXF wrote: Mon Aug 12, 2024 9:16 pmLooking at the numbers it is clear that resources moved to Exmouth after the storage button was set to "yes". The only way for the resources to get to Exmouth, since there was no sea transport of resources, was over the small trails. It will be very interesting to see what happens going forward.RangerJoe wrote: Mon Aug 12, 2024 8:31 pm It is unlikely that the resources will flow over the small trails that aren't marked on the map unless there was a demand for them. Are you short of resources elsewhere?
Re: Dutch AVP Arend: Scenario 1 Exploits
7Sep found the AF at Carnarvon was now 38%>L4. A report on the status of the movement of resources from CD was the first meeting of the day.
The numbers made complete sense. No change was reported at Exmouth with resources remaining at 7253. At CD the new production of 2000 tons remained at the base. There was a 600 ton reduction at Port Hedland and that was easily explained as the result of the final loading of TF339. The previous day each of the 3 xAKL cargo ships had 800 tons loaded for a total of 2400. TF 339 now had 3000 tons loaded and was enroute to Carnarvon. The final destination of TF 339 is likely to be changed to allow the resources to be unloaded at Geraldton to take advantage of the rail connection to the rest of Australia.
An afternoon meeting was scheduled, now that Arend had arrived at Carnarvon, to detail how she would fit into the overall plans for the region.Re: Dutch AVP Arend: Scenario 1 Exploits
At the afternoon meeting Command provided the crew of Arend with a rough outline of their role in transporting critical resources produced in CD to rail connections on the west coast of Australia. Arend was ordered to Exmouth where she will be used mainly for ASW missions. However, as cargo convoys move between Exmouth and Port Hedland, Arend will be used to escort convoys when enemy submarines have been noticed in the region. Command believes that Arend's single aircraft will help in protecting the convoys. For Arend the job of escort will be difficult. Her slow cruise speed of 1 will require movement at "full speed" to be able to keep up with the cargo ships. Command expects the convoys to move at full speed to provide safety from subs. Movement will also only be in shallow, costal water whenever possible.
Exmouth is considered relatively safe from the enemy. It is almost 1000 miles from the best enemy base at Koepang and therefore is out of range for the best currently known enemy bombers and fighters. Only Mavis patrol planes can reach Exmouth and even they would be flying at extended range.
At the close of the meeting details were provided on a successful American submarine attack on a small Diagen Cargo ship near Lautern. The Chosen Maru was attacked on the surface by SS Stingray. 10 hits were scored from Stingray's 3" gun, setting the cargo ship on fire. Stingray did not get away clean. She was hit twice by the cargo ship's 8cm/40Type 88 gun. Damage to Stingray was not too bad but since she is out of ammo she will be heading back to port to rearm and get some repairs. (Stingray also fired some torpedoes in a separate attack but they did not explode.) Stingray's captain was fortunate in not getting hit by the enemy's larger 12cm/12 Short gun, located at the bow of the ship. That gun has higher penetration and is 3X more effective than the small gun located on the stern.
Exmouth is considered relatively safe from the enemy. It is almost 1000 miles from the best enemy base at Koepang and therefore is out of range for the best currently known enemy bombers and fighters. Only Mavis patrol planes can reach Exmouth and even they would be flying at extended range.
At the close of the meeting details were provided on a successful American submarine attack on a small Diagen Cargo ship near Lautern. The Chosen Maru was attacked on the surface by SS Stingray. 10 hits were scored from Stingray's 3" gun, setting the cargo ship on fire. Stingray did not get away clean. She was hit twice by the cargo ship's 8cm/40Type 88 gun. Damage to Stingray was not too bad but since she is out of ammo she will be heading back to port to rearm and get some repairs. (Stingray also fired some torpedoes in a separate attack but they did not explode.) Stingray's captain was fortunate in not getting hit by the enemy's larger 12cm/12 Short gun, located at the bow of the ship. That gun has higher penetration and is 3X more effective than the small gun located on the stern.