Sub System Damage

[ADB123]

I've now gone into the second turn under the new patch and it turns out that ALL of my subs have received system damage - mainly to one or more of their guns and/or one of their torpedo tubes.

Something obviously got damaged in the Data Base...

[michaelm75au]

Can you please post the save used when updating the scenario?
And advise which subs to look at.

It sounds like some class upgrades have kicked in.

[Halsey]

Seen it too.

Looks like US submarine deck guns are highlighted in red.

[Halsey]

OK, US subs now have TWO deck guns.

[Walker84]

In the game I am playing I also noticed a moderate amount of damage (2 - 6 pts) to Japanese subs - seems to be some adjustments to the weapons they are carrying.

Spotted this in the readme.

3.36. 0542 – 0673 Allied Submarines – Change Wpn lists for Split (paired) Tubes
3.37. 1902 – 1990 Japan Submarines – Change Wpn lists for Split (paired) Tubes

[ADB123]

ORIGINAL: michaelm

Can you please post the save used when updating the scenario?
And advise which subs to look at.

It sounds like some class upgrades have kicked in.

This is scenario 1. All of my subs, except for two Dutch subs, have shown the problem. Just sort subs by "Sys Damage" and you can go down the list.

Here's the save where the problems showed up. I'll send the p/w by forum messaging.

[michaelm75au]

Can I please have the save that was updated by the patch?

[ADB123]

ORIGINAL: michaelm

Can I please have the save that was updated by the patch?

Oops - sorry, grabbed the wrong file. This should be the correct one.

[ADB123]

Michael -

In case this helps - here is the previous turn where the "change database?" question first came up. The subs didn't show any unusual damage this turn.

Thanks again -

Anthony

[michaelm75au]

I can see why the damage is happening.
The class weapon array no longer resembles the array the ship is equipped with. [Very similar to the LCU device mismatch that caused issues with TOE upgrades and replacements in the initial release.]

Using a single ship weapon slot as an example, slot 3 on the sub has 1 x gun. The corresponding weapon for that slot on the new class is 2 x TT.

When damage is determined on slot 3, it is comparing 1 against 2 and deciding there is 1 device damaged with a corresponding system damage applied. The type of device is assumed to be the same.

When the ship gets back to port, the damage should be repaired.

This code has been in place since release and was in used when the first data patch ( included in patch 1 or 2 IIRC), but I don't recall if there was a restructuring of the class weapons in that one. ( I am not generally involved in data as my time is spent on coding.)

Going forward, I can protect against this misalignment in the next patch. I can use your save to check my results.

[jwilkerson]

ORIGINAL: ADB123
Something obviously got damaged in the Data Base...

Actually, now we understand the issue. Nothing "damaged". We did try to port the "DaBabes" torpedo mods over ... and they do work fine ... however these changes were clearly too much for the in game update logic.

I would strengthen my recommendation against using the in game update feature. This was always a fragile area and still is.

[ny59giants]

We did try to port the "DaBabes" torpedo mods over ... and they do work fine ... however these changes were clearly too much for the in game update logic.

Is there any way to get this as an optional update?? I'm playing a PBEM (scen 2) against Seille that will go only to March/April 42 before we restart. He is a novice japanese player and this short PBEM is only to help him learn as i give him feedback from what i have learned. It would be nice to be able to add the sub changes in a future game, if possible.

[jwilkerson]

ORIGINAL: ny59giants
Is there any way to get this as an optional update??

Trying to do an in game update will cause issues.

Restarting will pull in the changes with no issues. No need for an optional update.

[Mike Solli]

Can someone explain this to me? What do the number and mount values mean now? It doesn't make any sense to me.

Edit: This occurred after the most recent patch was installed. I think it has to do with this thread (but I'm not really sure about that either).

[jwilkerson]

There are several explanations floating around ... but basically our attempt to plug in the DaBabes torpedo MOD caused issues with the in game update code. We now recommend not using the in game update with patch 05. Go ahead and apply patch 05, this will pick up the DB changes for new games and the code changes - but avoid the in game update. If you have aleady done an in game update we recommend going back to an earlier save prior to your application of the in game update.

Thx.

[Mike Solli]

Thanks Joe. I'll give that a shot.

[Mike Solli]

Fixed it and only had to go back two turns. Thanks guys!

[castor troy]

ORIGINAL: jwilkerson

ORIGINAL: ny59giants
Is there any way to get this as an optional update??

Trying to do an in game update will cause issues.

Restarting will pull in the changes with no issues. No need for an optional update.

so does this mean every PBEM is damaged when using the new patch? As the Allied player I installed the patch and wasn´t even asked if I would like to have db changes or not so obviously those were installed as I then was told I´m using a different phwex (?) than my opponent when I loaded his first turn and I´ve also had all planetops being reset to stock. What else can I do than to double click the patch exe and install the patch? That´s the way I did it all the time and IIRC people are even told they shouldn´t use the auto updater anyway. But then I end up having a different version than my opponent. What´s the alternative? Having all my subs damaged and some other issues other people report after using the db changes? [:(] Or going back to 1.06g again instead of using 1.06i and waiting for the next patch.

[castor troy]

ORIGINAL: jwilkerson

There are several explanations floating around ... but basically our attempt to plug in the DaBabes torpedo MOD caused issues with the in game update code. We now recommend not using the in game update with patch 05. Go ahead and apply patch 05, this will pick up the DB changes for new games and the code changes - but avoid the in game update. If you have aleady done an in game update we recommend going back to an earlier save prior to your application of the in game update.

Thx.

what do you mean by saying "avoid in game update"? Keep going with the earlier patch? 1.06g? I rather have not a single attack bomber and non working radar than my PBEM abandoned because of issues after having played through to nearly 44. The most "funny" thing for me is the fact that my subs never really scored on my enemy´s warships but exactly the turn I did with the new patch (having a "different" version than my enemy) two sub attacks sank the Amagi... go figure if I have to redo this turn...

[Barb]

As I have got it, you could apply the patch (that will resolve code changes like radar and attack bombers), but do not accept DB changes when prompted by scenario (as this will damage subs, reset RD and switch Tojos engine for the right one).

I hope I got it right.