9.1.1 broken?

[Peltonx]

As I read it if you move back a unit 10 hexes from front they should gain back moral (10%)if your under the national moral levels.

I have about 20 units more then 10 hexes from front 1 in Germany and none are gaining back moral. They are next to HQ units in supply ect ect.

Is this a bug or am I reading rule wrong?

Pelton

[Peltonx]

I also have 3 finnish units in Finland and only 1 out of 3 gained back a pt.

If they are south of the line exp drops as per rule, but north of line they dont want to gain back exp.

I am sure a Russian fanboy is behind this

Who entered the code last patch?

Pelton

[JAMiAM]

The rule, as described in the manual, is incorrect. There is a precheck as to whether or not the unit will gain *any* morale. This used to be based on a die(75) roll against the unit's current morale, but has gone through some changes in the 1.05 patches that are not entirely documented to the testers.

In short, they may have to just sit and get lucky for a while before they regain any morale.

[Peltonx]

I am 100% its not working.

I have had over 40 units sitting 10+ hexes from front and 1 has gotten 1 pt.

Also the fins should be gaining a pt per turn so its 100% not working.

In past games almost every unit got moral back, most times more then 1.

Its broken, but question is can anyone get themselfs away from witw for 5 mins to check on bug and then find it?


Pelton

[Peltonx]

Ok the following turn 4 out of 38 units got 1 pt of moral.
So basicly 1.05 changed this, because before it was basicly a given most units got atleast 1 pt and some 2-7 pts a turn.

Basicly as it is with 1.05 its not worth it to pull extra units from lines that are digging to try and restore moral.

2 out of 3 of the Finnish units got 1 pt of moral. In past games this was 100% 1 pt per turn for Finns. Did 1.05 change this?

Can this be addressed?

Pelton

[heliodorus04]

I wonder if Soviet units are experiencing something similar?
Would love to hear that a bug affects both sides for a change

[Peltonx]

The game thats having these issues is a 1.04 start upgraded to 1.05.

Might just be something to do with it.

Be a while before anyone with a 100% 1.05+ game can see if its and issue.

Figured I post it and let devs figure it out.

The transfer unit/HQ build-up bug is an old issue that I seen in every patch.

Pelton

[M60A3TTS]

Sorry to disappoint, but in my game with Pelton, morale is climbing just fine, thank you. [:)]

ORIGINAL: heliodorus04

I wonder if Soviet units are experiencing something similar?
Would love to hear that a bug affects both sides for a change

[jwduquette1]

I managed to get the Wiking Motorized Infantry Division destroyed once. Overextended position trying to pocket a bunch of Soviet divisions in the Caucasus by creeping regimental breakdowns of the division through the Mts. 1942 north of Tbilisi. The Wiking regiments were all basically isolated one or two hexes into the mountains because of the difficulty in tracing supply through Mt hexes. Anyway, to make a long story longer, my opponent figured out what I was attempting and managed to scrap togeather a couple mountain divisions for a counterattack and succeeded in killing the whole division.

Wiking reappears a couple turns later on the western map edge for the mandatory six week refit. I was watching it's refit progress pretty intently because the SS Motorized Inf. Divisions are key formations for the Germans. It came back at Morale 60. I think it upgraded to a Panzer Grenadier Division during its six week refit. Morale remained at 60 during the six week rebuild period. But the low morale after the rebuild period made complete sense to me. As it's pretty worthless as an offensive tool at that morale level, I decided to leave it in Berlin in Refit mode for eight more turns hoping it would begin to increase it's morale level. Nothing. It stayed at Morale 60.

[Joel Billings]

Is this the rule from 9.1.1 that you are talking about:

The unit’s morale is below 50, and it is more than 10 hexes away from the nearest enemy unit.

Do the units in question have morale below 50? If so, please send a save to 2by3@2by3games.com.

[Peltonx]

Rule 9.1.1 sates that units below national moral should be gaining moral back also to national level, German nation moral levels are way above 50 heheh.

I will test out a few, but a few above 50 have gained a pt so whats that mean?

Pelton

[Joel Billings]

Yes, they can gain up to their national morale even up over 50, but not because they are in the rear (and it is generally a slow increase when already over 50).

[gingerbread]

It's probably this paragraph:

The unit’s morale is below its national morale. In this case it can recover as much as 10% of
the national morale but not more than the country’s national morale (Example: German national
morale is 70 in 1942 so a unit could recover 7 per turn, not to exceed 70 for a non-elite unit).

There is no requirement (refit, non-adjecency, distance to enemy) mentioned for this in 9.1.1

[JAMiAM]

ORIGINAL: gingerbread

It's probably this paragraph:

The unit’s morale is below its national morale. In this case it can recover as much as 10% of
the national morale but not more than the country’s national morale (Example: German national
morale is 70 in 1942 so a unit could recover 7 per turn, not to exceed 70 for a non-elite unit).

There is no requirement (refit, non-adjecency, distance to enemy) mentioned for this in 9.1.1

The exact requirements are a mystery. Supposedly, it's a complicated set of checks that have not been made known to the testers. However, my bolded bit should be kept in mind, and that it is representing a maximum gain, for this particular aspect of morale gain, given the best of conditions and lucky die rolls.

[Peltonx]

ORIGINAL: JAMiAM

ORIGINAL: gingerbread

It's probably this paragraph:

The unit’s morale is below its national morale. In this case it can recover as much as 10% of
the national morale but not more than the country’s national morale (Example: German national
morale is 70 in 1942 so a unit could recover 7 per turn, not to exceed 70 for a non-elite unit).

There is no requirement (refit, non-adjecency, distance to enemy) mentioned for this in 9.1.1

The exact requirements are a mystery. Supposedly, it's a complicated set of checks that have not been made known to the testers. However, my bolded bit should be kept in mind, and that it is representing a maximum gain, for this particular aspect of morale gain, given the best of conditions and lucky die rolls.

I have personally tested this and the results are 1.4% chance of gaining a single point of moral above 50.

Jamiam is right it is a mystery.

Pelton

[mmarquo]

"9.1.1. Ground Unit Morale Changes

The morale of a unit will increase when it is successful in combat (holds on defense or retreats the defender when attacking).

The morale of a unit may also increase during the friendly logistics phase due to any and all of the following circumstances:

a) The unit's morale is below 50, and it is in refit mode.
b) The unit's morale is below 50, and it is more than 10 hexes away from the nearest enemy unit.
c) The unit¡¦s morale is below its national morale. In this case it can recover as much as 10% of the national morale but not more than the country's national morale (Example: German national morale is 70 in 1942 so a unit could recover 7 per turn, not to exceed 70 for a non-elite unit).
d) The unit is in a very good supply and support situation and its morale is less than 75. If Die (75) is greater than the unit's morale than a gain for this situation is possible."



WAD - read and understand the rules.

Marquo

[delatbabel]

ORIGINAL: Marquo

"9.1.1. Ground Unit Morale Changes

The morale of a unit will increase when it is successful in combat (holds on defense or retreats the defender when attacking).

The morale of a unit may also increase during the friendly logistics phase due to any and all of the following circumstances:

a) The unit's morale is below 50, and it is in refit mode.
b) The unit's morale is below 50, and it is more than 10 hexes away from the nearest enemy unit.
c) The unit¡¦s morale is below its national morale. In this case it can recover as much as 10% of the national morale but not more than the country's national morale (Example: German national morale is 70 in 1942 so a unit could recover 7 per turn, not to exceed 70 for a non-elite unit).
d) The unit is in a very good supply and support situation and its morale is less than 75. If Die (75) is greater than the unit's morale than a gain for this situation is possible."



WAD - read and understand the rules.

Marquo

Marquo -- I am guessing that the wording "any and all of the following" should in fact simply read "any of the following". "Any and all of the following" seems to imply that all of the following must apply for a morale boost to apply. It had me confused for a while.

[alfonso]

"9.1.1. Ground Unit Morale Changes

The morale of a unit will increase when it is successful in combat (holds on defense or retreats the defender when attacking).

The morale of a unit may also increase during the friendly logistics phase due to any and all of the following circumstances:

a) The unit's morale is below 50, and it is in refit mode.
b) The unit's morale is below 50, and it is more than 10 hexes away from the nearest enemy unit.
c) The unit¡¦s morale is below its national morale. In this case it can recover as much as 10% of the national morale but not more than the country's national morale (Example: German national morale is 70 in 1942 so a unit could recover 7 per turn, not to exceed 70 for a non-elite unit).
d) The unit is in a very good supply and support situation and its morale is less than 75. If Die (75) is greater than the unit's morale than a gain for this situation is possible."

I have one doubt here. What happens if instead of a retreat, we have a rout, shatter or surrender? Is it the same?

[mmarquo]

Del,

I agree that the wording is subopimal but the intent is nonehteless clear.

Marquo