Search Arcs

[AlanBernardo]

Have some of my bombers on naval search:





Question. What do the green areas mean when compared to the blue?

Question. What does that arced line mean, intersecting the green area?


Thanks,

Alan

[SuluSea]

Hi Alan, blue and green are morning and afternoon search phases. You can also see all black with is the designated search area covered in both phases. It all depends on how many planes you have patrolling.

The light blue is ASW and that is why the sector is cut in half.

ASW search is half the distance of naval search.

[Lokasenna]

I have a related question.

I know that when clicking the left mouse button to set the first part of the search arcs, it will show the maximum extent of the search arcs by that unit. Let's say that I only want to search half of that area, and want to search it in both morning and afternoon. Will the search arcs always be split in half, morning and afternoon, even if I have severely condensed the search arcs?

That's my suspicion, which would be disappointing, but I would also assume that it would mean having more planes in the arcs and therefore greater detection capabilities. Correct?

(PS - is there a "Nav Search 101" thread somewhere?)

[artuitus_slith]

The color of the the arc will change to black indicating that it is being searched in both phases, asw will turn white if it is being searched both morning/afternoon.

[jmalter]

hi Lokasenna,

each plane assigned to search will fly a 10-degree arc in both the AM & PM phases. if a 12-plane sqn is set to 50% search, 6 planes will fly in both AM & PM, 60 degrees each phase, you can cover a 120-degree arc, half AM & half PM.

change the 50% to 100% and you can search that entire 120-degree arc in both phases. or keep the %age at 50% and reduce the arc to 60 degrees to cover that arc fully. use the 'show arcs' button on the sqn screen to observe your changes, also the ctrl-Z hotkey will display all your current search arcs. black arcs (NavS) or white arcs (ASW) indicate coverage for both phases.

ETA: whoops, that's hotkey 'Z', not 'ctrl-Z'.

[Lokasenna]

Ah ha! So that's how I get the black arcs to show up again... I was wondering what they meant. Good to know that I can get search coverage all day when I want it and the game will actually show me when I do, rather than wondering what's happening. Also good to know about the white arcs for ASW.

Not that it makes a huge difference since the movement phases have already happened before the air phases, but...for ASW at least, it would be nice to get two chances at attacking the same sub as well as increasing detection levels.

Thanks!

[derhexer]

Thank you for the good answers.

Now, what does serach arcs random mean? It is one of the options when you send aircraft out on, say, ASW searches.

[jmalter]

i'd stay away from 'arcs random', it's not gonna give you what you want/need.

[PaxMondo]

Random means it will go out 360 degrees, but based upon the number of planes you have it will take some number of days to complete the arc.  has uses, particularly on ships for ASW.

[Alfred]

Unless it has been changed in the latest patch, search planes out on a random setting do not daily adjust their search area to eventually cover (over a period of time) all 360 degrees. A random setting starts off at 0 degrees and subject to having sufficient aircraft assigned proceeds in clock direction. If only sufficient planes have been assigned to cover 90 degrees, then that was the only coverage area (0-90 degrees) one ever had searched.

Alfred

[PaxMondo]

ORIGINAL: Alfred

Unless it has been changed in the latest patch, search planes out on a random setting do not daily adjust their search area to eventually cover (over a period of time) all 360 degrees. A random setting starts off at 0 degrees and subject to having sufficient aircraft assigned proceeds in clock direction. If only sufficient planes have been assigned to cover 90 degrees, then that was the only coverage area (0-90 degrees) one ever had searched.

Alfred

[&:]

I did not know that ... I have a lot of ship FP's that I need to change. Ouch. My click-fest just got enlarged. [X(]

[AlanBernardo]

Related questions:

1. Is a search more likely to catch something from searches from land or from those on Carriers, all else being equal?

2. What are the best search air units?

3. (a bit unrelated)Explain the logistics of an air-group, say, on a Supply Troops mission that then sets Patrol levels at ASW 20%. Does this mean that 80% of the aircraft will supply troops while the rest will look for submarines, essentially meaning the air-group has two missions? Which would then mean that if an air-group chooses the Naval Attack mission, and then is able to select a second mission (say, Port Attack) and then also sets ASW Patrols at 20%, that that group will have three missions?

4. In other words, what the hell are the logistics of setting Patrol levels and what do they mean relative to the primary missions set?

Thanks,

Alan

[treespider]

ORIGINAL: AlanBernardo

Related questions:

1. Is a search more likely to catch something from searches from land or from those on Carriers, all else being equal?

No difference

2. What are the best search air units?

The ones with pilots that have the highest Nav Search skill, and the unit can be assigned to Nav search.

3. (a bit unrelated)Explain the logistics of an air-group, say, on a Supply Troops mission that then sets Patrol levels at ASW 20%. Does this mean that 80% of the aircraft will supply troops while the rest will look for submarines, essentially meaning the air-group has two missions? Which would then mean that if an air-group chooses the Naval Attack mission, and then is able to select a second mission (say, Port Attack) and then also sets ASW Patrols at 20%, that that group will have three missions?

4. In other words, what the hell are the logistics of setting Patrol levels and what do they mean relative to the primary missions set?

Thanks,

Alan

Think about it...[8|]. If you assign a unit to Nav Attack and assign a value of 20 to Nav Search and 20 to ASW....what do you think that means?

A unit assigned to Naval Attack will perform a Naval Attack. A unit assigned to Supply Transport. If you assign a % of the unit to perform some other mission then that % will perform that mission.

Real World example- p256 "Fortress against the sun" - "For 3 consecutive days beginning Sept 16, 1942 a single B-17 from the 26th BS dropped bombs on Gizo harbor on Gizo island, ...while other planes flew daily reconnaissance flights." (presumably Nav Search)

In game - the 26th BS is assigned the mission of Port Attack, with a value of 80 or 90 assigned to Nav Search. So 80% of the unit performs Nav Search while 1-2 planes bomb a harbor.

[MBF]

ORIGINAL: Alfred

Unless it has been changed in the latest patch, search planes out on a random setting do not daily adjust their search area to eventually cover (over a period of time) all 360 degrees. A random setting starts off at 0 degrees and subject to having sufficient aircraft assigned proceeds in clock direction. If only sufficient planes have been assigned to cover 90 degrees, then that was the only coverage area (0-90 degrees) one ever had searched.

Alfred

Does this mean - that everyday the 90 degree arc is the same (e.g. it goes from 0-90 compass each and every day) or does the 90 degree arc move randomly each day ? (so say on the 3rd day - the arc will cover 230-320 degrees)

Thanks

[mllange]

Stupid question here, but how do you display these arcs? Is this a utility program outside the game?

[AlanBernardo]

2. What are the best search air units?

The ones with pilots that have the highest Nav Search skill, and the unit can be assigned to Nav search.

I guess what I meant to say was which are the best type of search units. For example, Dive Bombers generally do a better job at searching than Fighters.

Think about it...[8|]. If you assign a unit to Nav Attack and assign a value of 20 to Nav Search and 20 to ASW....what do you think that means?

A unit assigned to Naval Attack will perform a Naval Attack. A unit assigned to Supply Transport. If you assign a % of the unit to perform some other mission then that % will perform that mission.

This was the reason for my question. Would your above example mean that 20% of a group is doing a Naval Search, 20% is doing ASW, and 60% Naval Attack? In other words, when selecting as such, are all three of these missions equally different missions, each taking up a percentage. For example, say I do choose Naval Attack as a primary objective, but then pick resting 50% and ASW 50% (equaling 100%). Would I then being doing any Naval searching at all?

In game - the 26th BS is assigned the mission of Port Attack, with a value of 80 or 90 assigned to Nav Search. So 80% of the unit performs Nav Search while 1-2 planes bomb a harbor.

So the Primary mission is the same (as far as weight goes) as a Patrol mission?

This appears to answer the question I was trying to get answered. Primary missions receive the same weight as Patrol missions. (In the end I was confused by the use of the word "Primary" in the game, since that implies it's the main mission and as such would receive most of the weight.)


Alan

[witpqs]

ORIGINAL: Alfred

Unless it has been changed in the latest patch, search planes out on a random setting do not daily adjust their search area to eventually cover (over a period of time) all 360 degrees. A random setting starts off at 0 degrees and subject to having sufficient aircraft assigned proceeds in clock direction. If only sufficient planes have been assigned to cover 90 degrees, then that was the only coverage area (0-90 degrees) one ever had searched.

Alfred

It's my understanding from Michael (emails when reporting bugs quite a while back, I don't still have them for reference) is that it's different from that. It's more akin to the search method in WITP (pre-AE), in that there is a percentage chance of TFs within range being detected, regardless of where they lie in the 360 degree circle. I'm pretty sure that the chances of detection increase with reduced distance between the TF and the planes' base.

Search arcs are certainly more effective within their arcs, but without arcs you get some chance of picking up TFs each turn. I use and recommend search arcs and make only very limited use of the random setting.

[Skyros]

ORIGINAL: nim8or

Stupid question here, but how do you display these arcs? Is this a utility program outside the game?

Hitting the Z key displays all searchs. Also you can turn on a units arc by clicking on display arcs below were you set them on the unit screen.

[jmalter]

IMO there's a big difference between a) not specifying a search-arc & b) using the 'random arcs' button.

if you tag the 'random arcs' button, then the 'show arcs' button, you'll see that the sqn has been set to a specific arc starting from 000.

i believe (hope) that if you leave the arcs unassigned, you'll get a random distribution of planes shooting out. but someone'll have to set up a little test-scenario to check that out.

[witpqs]

ORIGINAL: jmalter

IMO there's a big difference between a) not specifying a search-arc & b) using the 'random arcs' button.

if you tag the 'random arcs' button, then the 'show arcs' button, you'll see that the sqn has been set to a specific arc starting from 000.

i believe (hope) that if you leave the arcs unassigned, you'll get a random distribution of planes shooting out. but someone'll have to set up a little test-scenario to check that out.

Ah - I misunderstood. I'm pretty sure that Michael's comments to me a while back were about not assigning arcs. BTW that means not a random distribution of planes shooting out, rather percentages chances for any TFs within range to be discovered.