Crushing IJM in Historical scenario at Wake

[bretg80]

It's late July 42 and I am crushing the Japanese navy at Wake. I keep a task force of 2 Essex class carriers at Wake and now have added a CVE. I've loaded up wake with fighters to provide LRCAP for the carriers and the island and the IJN keeps sending one or two carriers and a landing TF every two weeks for a beating. I have so far sunk 5 carriers and totally decimated at least 6 landing forces that have attempted the invasion.

I also badly mauled at least 3 or 4 BBs. Wake seems to take the place of Midway for the IJN and they will go down in flames trying to take it.

I think the AI should be looked at to give up on Wake if it can't take it by a certain time frame or to bring in some heavy firepower to take the island. These small sorties are atypical of how a human would fight. He might try a few small attacks, but if that doesn't work, he's gonna bring in an armada.

At this point, given the AI's penchant for Wake, I have a feeling that by the end of '42 I will own the seas. I'll keep you informed.

[Pratzen]

Fascinating. It is always a thrill to hear about a player's exploits against the AI. [>:]

Just one question--where did you come up with Essex class CV's in July '42?

[Venividivici10044]

Where is KB? That would spell suicide to the Allies!

[fflaguna]

ORIGINAL: bretg80

It's late July 42 and I am crushing the Japanese navy at Wake. I keep a task force of 2 Essex class carriers at Wake and now have added a CVE. I've loaded up wake with fighters to provide LRCAP for the carriers and the island and the IJN keeps sending one or two carriers and a landing TF every two weeks for a beating. I have so far sunk 5 carriers and totally decimated at least 6 landing forces that have attempted the invasion.

I also badly mauled at least 3 or 4 BBs. Wake seems to take the place of Midway for the IJN and they will go down in flames trying to take it.

I think the AI should be looked at to give up on Wake if it can't take it by a certain time frame or to bring in some heavy firepower to take the island. These small sorties are atypical of how a human would fight. He might try a few small attacks, but if that doesn't work, he's gonna bring in an armada.

At this point, given the AI's penchant for Wake, I have a feeling that by the end of '42 I will own the seas. I'll keep you informed.

I found the solution for your problem on this WitP:AE sub-forum. It's a one-time fix that will solve the problem permanently. I did it shortly after I first started playing. [;)]

[Misconduct]

Bretg i just made a post few days ago about why people need to stick to historical timeline or this ends up happening, in your case total destruction at wake.

Honestly I would restart and fall back and let the IJN take what they are after.

[bretg80]

Point noted, I thought Lexington and Hornet were Essex class - my bad. They were when they came back, but first round was not.

Thanks for pointing that out[:)] Part of the KB is on the bottom of the ocean, Akagi, Kaga, Shoho, Zuikaku, Hiryu.

[bretg80]

Thanks Misconduct, I read your posts and while I agree with your perspective, Wake shouldn't be treated any differently than Midway. I guess the AI may be hardcoded to try to capture it the way they did in the War. Anyway, it looks like so far the outcome has been similar to what happened by this time in the real war. The IJN had a lost a serious number of carriers that would affect them going forward.

[mike scholl 1]

ORIGINAL: bretg80
At this point, given the AI's penchant for Wake, I have a feeling that by the end of '42 I will own the seas. I'll keep you informed.

Why bother? Everybody knows the AI (in spite of Andy's unending efforts) is basically a moron. Bragging about finding another way of kicking a puppy is hardly worth the effort of typing it... [8|]

[Misconduct]

ORIGINAL: mike scholl 1

ORIGINAL: bretg80
At this point, given the AI's penchant for Wake, I have a feeling that by the end of '42 I will own the seas. I'll keep you informed.

Why bother? Everybody knows the AI (in spite of Andy's unending efforts) is basically a moron. Bragging about finding another way of kicking a puppy is hardly worth the effort of typing it... [8|]

Yeah but for guys like me on my first AE campaign since coming over for WITP it was nice to practice a few turns and learn the basics, no harm done. I actually deleted my campaign and started fresh from december 8th, going to pull all troops out of singapore, java and let the AI take as much as it wants till 43.

[Mynok]

Seems time for someone to try a PBEM. [;)]

[Misconduct]

ORIGINAL: Mynok


Seems time for someone to try a PBEM. [;)]

I don't have time or I would, Last game I played averaged about 2 turns a week at most, and I hate to have a game played out that slow as I sometimes can't play for week on end.

[Buck Beach]

ORIGINAL: bretg80

It's late July 42 and I am crushing the Japanese navy at Wake. I keep a task force of 2 Essex class carriers at Wake and now have added a CVE. I've loaded up wake with fighters to provide LRCAP for the carriers and the island and the IJN keeps sending one or two carriers and a landing TF every two weeks for a beating. I have so far sunk 5 carriers and totally decimated at least 6 landing forces that have attempted the invasion.

I also badly mauled at least 3 or 4 BBs. Wake seems to take the place of Midway for the IJN and they will go down in flames trying to take it.

I think the AI should be looked at to give up on Wake if it can't take it by a certain time frame or to bring in some heavy firepower to take the island. These small sorties are atypical of how a human would fight. He might try a few small attacks, but if that doesn't work, he's gonna bring in an armada.

At this point, given the AI's penchant for Wake, I have a feeling that by the end of '42 I will own the seas. I'll keep you informed.

A lesson to be learned here Bretg80. Never, never, never post a AAR type post and/or how much enjoyment you are having when playing the AI!!! The PBEM fellows won't tolerate it and they will be on you like stink on stuff (as you can see).

Case in point, Pratzen's response. The guy just joined the forum and this is only his second post, but he leads the charge right at the gun.

There are ways to enjoy the game if you don't want to go the PBEM route. I love the ASW, Air Defense, and logistics game and trying to follow where to place my units according to their historical records. While I do try to save some of the shipping, BFs and Air Units except for the poor Aussies and Kiwi's on the Singapore pensulia I pretty much allow history to take its course.

Have fun guy.

[bretg80]

Thanks Buck, I am enjoying the game and while I constantly find realism issues, it is definitely the best simulation of war in the pacific out there. I know that creating an AI is a difficult task to say the least, but I would at least like to think that the developers put in some rules to mimic high level strategic views at the time. Like don't attack distant bases with small forces over and over again until you are crushed. At some point you have to either build an Armada or concede and pull back.

It is obvious the AI is smart enough to keep trying to take Wake, but at what point does it decide, I'm just not going to be able to accomplish that task and stop. The Japanese fought hard for Guadalcanal until they realized that it was hopeless and then pulled back. I think after losing 5 carriers at Wake, I know that I would give up. Maybe the AI is more tenacious that I [8D]

One last thought, it is only July 42, so maybe the AI still has some additional planso before it does capitulate, so maybe I'm being too hard on it. However, after reading some other posts, I'm not so sure that I am.

Thanks for the great feedback Buck and I'm okay with feedback from those of the PBEM persuasion. I've been on this board reading their comments for quite some time. They all have good points and I'm sure the game is much more challenging against a human opponent, but also much more unrealistic. The game engine allows the player far too much flexibility to reshape the war, such as the guy who took Pearl in March '42. I like to play the AI, because in most cases, it plays true to history and I commend the developers for their efforts.

I just wish the AI would evaluate it's losses and react accordingly. Maybe an enhancement in a future patch, if there is one.

[mike scholl 1]

ORIGINAL: Misconduct
Yeah but for guys like me on my first AE campaign since coming over for WITP it was nice to practice a few turns and learn the basics, no harm done. I actually deleted my campaign and started fresh from december 8th, going to pull all troops out of singapore, java and let the AI take as much as it wants till 43.

Using the AI as a learning tool until you get comfortable with the game is exactly what it was designed for. Thanks to Andy's efforts it can even give you a tussle for a while. My comment was aimed only at the "Wow..., look what I did." tone of your post. We all started with the AI..., and soon learned it's weaknesses. But for a true game experience, you need an opponent who can think.

Come back and post your victories when you gain them over a real live person and no one will make fun of you. And you will have something worth bragging about. Good luck in your learning, and good gaming when you are ready to go.

[Misconduct]

Its a video game, were all here to have fun and enjoy the work done to make this game and the historical aspect of it, not whose balls are bigger because some play PBEM and others who choose not to or unable to.

[Grotius]

The AI is certainly much improved over the AI in WITP, but yes, sometimes I look the other way and give it a break, even in AE. I find that if I impose house rules on my self to make myself play along historical lines, the AI gives me a good game.

I'm in a PBEM now, enjoying it a lot, but there are some things about AI games that I prefer. Games go faster, of course; you can do as many turns a day as you like. I also think the AI sometimes plays more "historically" than humans do. Of course, a human opponent is general a tougher opponent, but sometimes you might just want to relax and enjoy the game without stressing over every last thing, as I tend to do in PBEM. As Misconduct says, it's just a game; enjoy it the way you want to enjoy it.

[mike scholl 1]

ORIGINAL: Misconduct

Its a video game, were all here to have fun and enjoy the work done to make this game and the historical aspect of it, not whose balls are bigger because some play PBEM and others who choose not to or unable to.

If that's all you want from the game, fine. It's your nickle. But you are missing a great deal of enjoyment if you think it's just "Space Invaders".

[Misconduct]

ORIGINAL: mike scholl 1

ORIGINAL: Misconduct

Its a video game, were all here to have fun and enjoy the work done to make this game and the historical aspect of it, not whose balls are bigger because some play PBEM and others who choose not to or unable to.

If that's all you want from the game, fine. It's your nickle. But you are missing a great deal of enjoyment if you think it's just "Space Invaders".

I have no choice in the matter mike, much as I'd love to jump into a PBEM game at best I can pull off 2 turns a week, and most likely when I am overseas I can't log half the time. I don't want the rep like some have gotten for starting a PBEM then bailing out through it, but most likely thats what will happen in my situation.

I have completed 2PBEM's in wITP if I had the time I would prefer playing PBEM in AE, but what can you do when the situation doesn't suit you? But if you feel its just to slam someone from enjoying the game just to play the AI in mean time, thats your cup of tea.

[ckammp]

I got a lot of enjoyment out of "Space Invaders", both playing by myself and against someone else. Just like AE, I've done both PBEM and vs AI, and while I've greatly enjoyed both, IMHO I prefer AI. It allows me full control of the amount of time invested, and the AI does follow a more "historical" gam, which I enjoy.
There's nothing wrong with playing either PBEM or AI. I know that those who choose to play PBEM are very passionate about how good their experiences are, but I wish that some of the more ardent PBEM zealots would express their views without knocking those who choose to play vs AI.

[bretg80]

Hey everyone thanks for the feed back. I do want to point out that I was not bragging about crushing the AI, but I can see how that might have been misinterpreted. I was pointing out a flaw in the AI with the hope that the development team would look into it to see if there are some rules they could improve upon.

I am still a noob in AE and have no bragging rights. However, if I can be this successful taking down the AI, then it needs some tweaks. I do not consider myself a novice wargamer by any means and I would definitely give some of you PBEMs a run for your money, but I enjoy playing the AI and I would just like to see it improved to handle the Wake scenario.

My hats off to Andy for all of his improvements and if the AE dev team is looking for improvements, I am pointing out a potential opportunity.

As for PBEM, well it will have to wait for a while as I have been spending my time writing a WITPAE tool that processes the combat reports after each turn so that you can easily find information and that is consuming my spare time. I will be sharing this with the community when I get it finished in the next month or so. I find it useful and I hope everyone else will too.