War Plan Orange: October Update

[Sneer]

Hi
what is orange mod staring date ???

a lot of ships were put out of service in 23-24
how can they be in service for 26 i.e. ?

is Washington treaty off in this mod ???

[KPAX]

Tanker,

Can not wait, looks awesome !![8|]

[bstarr]

Outstanding!

Good to see Matrix is lending a hand, but I'm not surprised. That's what makes the company stand out. They actually even follow up on their product after they have your $$$. I mean, everyone offers patches, but how many really listen to gamers requests when designing them. And most companies don't even want outside modifications, much less assist in their creation. They certainly do inspire fan - I mean, customer - loyalty. [:)]

[steveh11Matrix]

Yup - Matrix is one, Paradox is another, but now I'm really struggling. These two are class acts.

Steve.

[m10bob]

Tankerace,I love what you have been doing with this mod..
Lemme put in an early request for your consideration.
I would like the inclusion of the USN Los Angeles,Acron and Macon....
(The latter 2 carried airplanes!).
If you really consider them,I have all kinds of details on them.They could be plotted like ships as they were so slow,with long duration,and WERE part of Plan Orange's spotting capability.[:D]

[Tankerace]

ORIGINAL: Desertmole

I gather that Saratoga and Lexington will not show as carriers in WPO. Will they show up as CCs? How about the other Washington Cherry Trees (US and Japanese)?[&:]

Correct. I'll add a "synopsis" in the first post for the new guys to explain the premis.

The Washington Treaty is not in effect, so 3/4 of the Japanese 8-8 Program, and all US BBs and CCs will be available in the mod. In addition, several predreadnoughts, and all surviving WWI dreadnoughts will be included.

@ Jorm

Thank you very much. I might do a 1936 start in the future, but right now this mod is taking Just about every second of time that I'm not sleeping or in class. SO, for now, I want to expound on the 1920's campaigns (yes, plural) and a good collection of smaller scenarios.

ORIGINAL: Sneer

Hi
what is orange mod staring date ???

a lot of ships were put out of service in 23-24
how can they be in service for 26 i.e. ?

is Washington treaty off in this mod ???

THe Mod's starting date is June 1, 1922. THe Japanese, in an effort to assert naval superiority, have declared war on the United States. Their goal is pretty much the same as in WW2, but now there is no pressing need to (Japan would not run out of resources until 1940), and can thus fight a "traditional" naval war with the United States.

The Washington Treaty of February 8, 1922 (65 years before my birthday, same date) is not ratified. The Major forces do not scrap their dreadnoughts, and the US only scraps its eldest Spanish-American War dreadnoughts.

Yes, a lot of ships were inactive. The mod has 2 campaigns, a 1922-1926 campaign, and a 1926-1930 campaign. The first one features the ships of WWI, and the goal is to basically bring about a "Jutland of the Pacific". THe 1926 campaign features some of the "never were" designs, but at the cost of several pre dreadnoughts being retired. You have to remember, this mod is purely historical up to about 1918, and from then on it goes "what-if". However, it is deeply rooted in history. You will not see the fantastic designs bristling with 20" guns from stem to stern.

ORIGINAL: m10bob

Tankerace,I love what you have been doing with this mod..
Lemme put in an early request for your consideration.
I would like the inclusion of the USN Los Angeles,Acron and Macon....
(The latter 2 carried airplanes!).
If you really consider them,I have all kinds of details on them.They could be plotted like ships as they were so slow,with long duration,and WERE part of Plan Orange's spotting capability.[:D]

I have had several requests of this nature. However, at this time I will not be adding them in to the mod. The reason being is that WitP has no way to tell a derigible from a fighter, and I can't make them a ship, because if brought to battle they could come under fire from 16" guns, which is totally unrealistic. In the future I may add them in, but for the initial release of the mod they will not be included.

Thank you all very much for all the encouragement. There had been times in the past when I considered stopping the mod (before it really got off the ground), but all the support on this forum has kept it alive.

I'll be editing my first post, and put a brief synopsis on the mod, whats in it, etc. Hopefully, that should answer some questions I haven't already answered.

[PeteG662]

m10bob,

I believe they found one of these off the coast of California near Monterey a few years back. It crashed during a storm way back when.....

[Skyros]

ORIGINAL: fbastos

I can see others being inspired to produce further mods going back to battles with pre-Dreadnoughts.

Pre-Dreadnoughts? Hah! I'm going to write a mod with Godzilla and Megalon. Who will need Yamato and Musashi after those?

PS: Just wait to see the AA rating of King Kong!!

F.

[:D]

Just don't do a Starblazers MOD with the Battle Crusier Yamato.

[Feinder]

I think it would be funny if "Warplan Orange" is ready before, that thing that shall not be named is ready.

Great work Tankerace! Looking forward to it!
-F-

[Tankerace]

Two more new screens. Also, an F4B-1 has been added to the first post. Enjoy!

[Onime No Kyo]

Hey Tanker,

I was just wondering, are you keeping all the bases? I would think that half the actual bases that can be considered such were nothing more than a tree patch in that time period. Mind you, I know absolutely nothing about that period myself.

[Tankerace]

Nope. A few bases will be there, to represent coaling stations, but about half the bases will be removed, or made very small. In fact, Pearl Harbor isn't even going to be a big base. The Player can improve it, but it can't become a size 9 port (I think 6 is a good number, to reflect only recent usage). I will still include several bases, probably more than you will need.

As opposed to taking bases to gain or control airsuperiority, in WPO you will take bases to set up coaling ports, to increase the range of your fleet. While you may "own" an island, you may find that it is to small to do you any good. In addition, amphibious landings are going to be difficult, because there is absolutely no doctrine. So, your primary objective is to get only the bases you need, and destroy the enemy's fleet. Then you can go about taking over territory.

[ColFrost]

i just can't wait to see the AARs with USS Albany leading the fleet! [:D]

[HawaiiFive-O]

I am so jazzed at how well this mod is coming along.

Can't wait, can't wait, can't wait...

[Jorm]

Its a shame
i just returned a book on WPO that described in great detail the issue of forward bases and coaling
the USN changed over to oilfired ships some time in the mid 20's so you might find this is not as big a problem as it might seem at 1st

The issue of at sea replensihment somes up, ie they couldnt recoal effectivly at sea, sure they could do it on a very limited basis, or do it in the lee of atols/islands. But that was the point of the 'thrusters' and 'through ticket" plans, to grab a recoaling base in the phillipines or similar island

cheers
Paul

[Tankerace]

They did change over to oil firing yes. But, to change over to oil firing, you have to dock your ships. When there is a war on, that isn't the quickest thing to do. Plus, a lot of your older ships are still going to use coal, as they are good enough to fight, but not good enough to worry about modernizing.

[Desertmole]

Great, that is really nifty. I love the idea of using the CCs for their intended purpose.[&o]

I'd like to throw out an idea for addition. Hector Bywater, in Seapower in the Pacific, written in 1921, mentioned a plan to convert the 6 Connecticut and Virginia class OBBs to Assault Ships for the Marines. It would have involved removing the tertiary batteries (7" and some 3") to allow the ability to carry a 1500 man battalion landing team. The ships retain their 12" and 8" guns for fire support, freeing the battleline to provide protecting anf fight the good fight,

Good luck on your project!

[Tankerace]

Actually, you hit something I was toying around with. I hadn't decided yet, but I was thinking of making it where some US predreadnoughts would be converted to transports, or to depot ships like other countries predreadnoughts. The only thing stopping me is trying to figure out how to do it. Troops can only load on a transport, but Im not sure how a transport with battleship armament would behave. Once I get into the main testing phase, I'll play around with it, and see what could be done with it.

[Desertmole]

Hope it works! The Marines I talked to mostly seemed to get a H**d-on when they were told of a dedicated fire support ship that was a transport too (they got the same way when shown the late '50s plans for the Iowas). [;)]

[Tankerace]

While I am thinking of it, before I go watch a movie and turn in for the night, I'd like to take a moment to describe Aircraft upgrades and replacements in Plan Orange.

In the 1920s, aircraft were still seen as a nuisance. Naval aircraft especially, like submarines, were considered dead end careers for naval officers. While more squadrons will appear than historically existed in the 1920s (to simulate the war), they will be nothing on the scale of those involved in WW2. Aircraft production, in comparison to that of regular WitP, will be very small. Aircraft mass production simply did not exist in either the United States or Japan, and both countries usually produced enough planes to fill out 5 or 6 squadrons per type (max), plus some spares. While the player will get more planes than this, they will not get much more. What does this mean? Well, fo rone thing you can't launch mass air offensives on the scale of WW2. However, given the vast area of the Pacific, and the range of the planes, this won't be too much of a concern.

In addition, based on the small number, through 1930 you will probably have a mix of planes in your front line units. Whereas in WitP you;d instantly upgrade all F4Fs to F6Fs, in Plan Orange you will find you can maintain force and strength levels better if you have a mix and match, I.e. the Langley having 12 F4B-1s, 11 F6C-4s, and then either 11 TBMs or O2Us. This not only makes sure you don't run out of planes, it also represents the "hodge-podge" of planes that served on American carriers at the time.