Review at Out of Eight PC Game Review

[Froonp]

I've read a review of the game at http://jaguarusf.blogspot.com/2007/07/j ... eview.html that says a lot of goods about the game but also a couple of problems. I'm interested in the game and would like to know from players if those problems are that a hindrance, or not.

The review says that :
- The game moves at a snail’s pace, unless you play from the 2-D view
- The user interface needs an update, as finding information is more difficult than it should be.
- The degree of micromanagement is high, and playing large scenarios takes a long, long time as none of your units are self-sufficient (don't remember last turn's orders) and you can’t set waypoints beyond the current turn’s movement limits.

What are your opinions about that ?

If those are real hindrances to enjoying the game, are there patches / corrections that will remove them ?

Thanks for your time !

[Arkady]

ORIGINAL: Froonp

I've read a review of the game at http://jaguarusf.blogspot.com/2007/07/j ... eview.html that says a lot of goods about the game but also a couple of problems. I'm interested in the game and would like to know from players if those problems are that a hindrance, or not.

The review says that :
- The game moves at a snail’s pace, unless you play from the 2-D view
- The user interface needs an update, as finding information is more difficult than it should be.
- The degree of micromanagement is high, and playing large scenarios takes a long, long time as none of your units are self-sufficient (don't remember last turn's orders) and you can’t set waypoints beyond the current turn’s movement limits.

What are your opinions about that ?

If those are real hindrances to enjoying the game, are there patches / corrections that will remove them ?

Thanks for your time !

no real hindraces, review author is lazy to read manual [:)] and if you check some other his articles you will see that he write his review after first look on game only [;)]

you can turn on Fast Human/Fast AI movement then units move fast enough to avoid delays and still see all details

I don't know what info is hard to find, basic gameplay info (turn number, unit stats - ap left, strength, defense and assault vlaues is always on the screen, button filters for range, visibility, movement allowance are on bottom bar always visible and of course you can acces them via hot keys

last point make me laugh, it is tactic game, you play it with intent to move and shoot with your units and if yopu dislike manage hundreds of units just pick small scenario (there is more small scenarios than bigger ones) with twenty units per side

There are some bugs but as reviewer never experience this game he don't mentioned them
And of course MG support this game, two full patches released and two temporary patches before next full patch are available now

[Arkady]

here is thread tm.asp?m=1508480
where almost all complaints from reviewer are shown as void [:D]

[Viriathus]

Froonp,

The game isn't slow in 3D mode; it is wonderfully emersive to watch your units move forward unsure where or if there will be an enemy contact. I've just played First Blood - the first German-Polish skirmish and I got a kick just out of the noise of my motorcycle platoons moving up.

To the people who are used to Sid Meier's Civ series it is slower but for wargamers. gratification comes from planning a strategy, amending it in the light of the opponent's moves and little things like the buzz of a plotting mortar attack at where you think the enemy will be and then watching them move into the hex. This is a proper wargame, if you rush forward the AI will hand you your ass on a plate.

I do think that the documentation both the manual and ingame could be simpler for newbies (and for returnees who've forgotten some of the aspects) but, it is also provides great unit information which I appreciate as well. Like all games, board or pc, if you want to master it you have to invest time in getting to understand it - again to me that is part of the satisfaction, part of the challenge.

The interface is not modern/slick but, it perfectly servicable and once you played a couple of scenarios it slips into the background of your mind - where it should be.

I usually hesitate to recommend a game as everyone tastes are indivual but I have been recommending this game to people. Especially as this updated and revised edition contains almost 200 scenarios from every theatre of WWII, there is excellent and ongoing support and new campaigns/scenarios being released all the time.

Purchasing any game is a gamble, in the end you go by is your interests and instincts. I love this game. I find it hard to believe that anyone interested in miltary history and gaming could not enjoy it.

Viriathus

[Plodder]

Froonp, I'm a long time CM'er and I've only recently gotten this game. I really enjoy it, it's got the old-school charm, and you need to use good tactics.Another thing it's got going for it is scope, it's really cool doing amphibious landings and para drops.[:)]

[Gudadantza]

I love this game and the series a lot of years ago but I personally agree with the two last points of the reviewer.
 
It is not bad criticism it is only a real fact interface related due to the long way the game has.
 
It is not heresy to say that the interface needs a little fix and that the micromanagement on huge battles is too high.
No favor at all to the game is closing our eyes about It.
 
Greetings

[Arkady]

well, I actually want to know what is wrong with current interface ? It looks old, it is only problem with it I think and it is only visual problem, if I compare it with other games I  must appreciate ergonomics of CS interface.

And about micromanagement in huge battle? How do you suppose it could behave ? Except automatic movement orders from point A to point B for entire group (like in Panzer Campaigns)  I don't know how to help with handle of huge number of units. Any other autonomous orders will interfere with AI. And if you choose big battle you probobaly know that it involve handling a lot of units..otherwise choose smaller one.

Arkady

[Gudadantza]

Rational and organizated formation movements in an easy way, with a change in the interface to easy use of that option. Now that exist as a mix of keys. why not add interface and visual aids to it? Why not add things for the less obvious mechanisms of the game?
 
I think an elegant formation movement to accelerate the order process is a must have nowadays. And the basic idea is already into the game. I just talk about deep into that idea. I am speaking about working in it. The best always can be better. If you or me are comfortable with the game is because of the long way the game has.
 
I am not speaking about how bad the interface is. The interface was and is very good, on 1997 graphics and playability were the best on turn based games. Simply I agree with the reviewer about little revisions on 2007.  
 
Greetings
 
 
 

[Froonp]

Thanks for your comments, thanks Arkady for pointing me to the right thread, and sorry for having opened another for nothing.
I think that I will buy this game. I already bought Guns of August today so I will wait a little, but your answers and the other thread convicted me that I could be interested in that game.

[LarryP]

ORIGINAL: Froonp

Thanks for your comments, thanks Arkady for pointing me to the right thread, and sorry for having opened another for nothing.
I think that I will buy this game. I already bought Guns of August today so I will wait a little, but your answers and the other thread convicted me that I could be interested in that game.

I bought GoA and Tillers game at the same time. After playing them both a little at first, I won't be playing GoA for some time, at least until the first patch comes out. Then I will still be playing Tillers Campaign Series. It's excellent and the support is fast and accurate with Jason Pethos on you before you even click "OK." [;)]

Also the manual is big (137 pages) and detailed. There are over 350 scenarios too! [&o]

[andym]

You wont be dissapointed Froonp,you will wish for moer than 24 hours in a day!

[Deus exmachina]

Well it is obvious to me that the writer of the review is more interested in playing some fastmoving stunningly graphic 3d shooters were the only skill you need are good reflexes and  the need to think is only required  to remember the phonenumber of the pizza delivery ...shame tho that games like CS are so rare these days

[jbunnelle]

With regard to micromanagement, my only real beef with the game is the haphazard placement of units at the start of a dynamic campaign battle. Hell, how hard is it to group things together automatically by squad? Right now an art. is over in the trees, his transport's dicking around in a village twenty hexes away with a tank and a few horses. As you increase in rank, you spend an insane amount of time moving units around before you start. What about a blank map with a system of click-and-place, with a small window showing what's up for placement next?