optional rules

World in Flames is the computer version of Australian Design Group classic board game. World In Flames is a highly detailed game covering the both Europe and Pacific Theaters of Operations during World War II. If you want grand strategy this game is for you.

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lomyrin
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RE: optional rules

Post by lomyrin »

ORIGINAL: Froonp
My guideline is RAW August 2004 and there is nothing in there about this. It sounds like a house rule. In MIWF the 3 dice are rolled at the same time.
I seem to remember the contrary from the CWiF game.
First you knew what the odd were (fractional odd rolled just before).
Then you chose the table.
Then the game rolled the game and you knew the result.
Maybe I'm remembering wrong.

CWiF does roll the fraction first and then gives the player the choice of tables showing the die roll modifier for both assault and blitz.

Lars
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paulderynck
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RE: optional rules

Post by paulderynck »

CWiF does roll the fraction first and then gives the player the choice of tables showing the die roll modifier for both assault and blitz.

Lars
Upon re-reading that section of RAW it looks like we have been "house-ruling by accident". The choice of the table occurs before the fractional odds resolution, so all the dice could be rolled together.
Paul
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RE: optional rules

Post by Shannon V. OKeets »

I thank everyone for their advice on this. Here is what I am going with for the preset optional rule sets.

This stuff is merely a convenience for the players and I am mainly concerned with giving a novice player a 3 step learning curve for the optional rules: Novice, Standard, and Advanced.

For the Novice level I almost always went with the easier setting. If having the rule On made the game easier, then it was set to On. And the same for Off. there are only a couple of places where I deviated from that criterion.

For the Standard I added a lot of stuff but left out some of the big items (e.g., Cruisers in Flames and Convoys in Flames).

For the Advanced, I included most of the chrome, only omiting a few optional rules that are either controversial, affect the play balance in a big way, or that I especailly don't like (hey, I get some perogatives![:)]).

Again, these are not life and death decisions, and players can effortlessly ignore them all if they choose to do so.

==============

NoviceDefaultOptions: TOptions = (
Divisions: False;
Artillery: False;
Fortifications: False;
SupplyUnits: False;
CombatEngineers: False;
FlyingBoats: True;
Territorials: False;
LimitedOverseasSupply: False;
LimitedSupplyAcrossStraits: False;
HQSupport: False;
EmergencyHQSupply: False;
SyntheticOilPlants: False;
OffCityReinforcement: True;
RecruitmentLimits: False;
HQMovement: False;
BottomedShips: False;
InThePresenceOfTheEnemy: False;
SurprisedZOCs: False;
BounceCombat: False;
VWeapons: False;
AtomicBombs: False;
Frogmen: False;
SCSTransport: False;
AmphibiousRules: False;
OptionalCVSearching: False;
Pilots: False;
FoodInFlames: False;
FactoryConstruction: False;
SavingResources: True;
CarpetBombing: False;
TankBusters: False;
MotorizedMovementRates: True;
BomberATR: False;
LargeATR: False;
RailwayMovement: False;
DefensiveShoreBombardment: False;
BlitzBonus: True;
ChineseAttackWeakness: False;
FractionalOdds: False;
AlliedCombatFriction: False;
TwoD10LandCRT: False;
ExtendedAircraftRebasing: True;
VariableReorganizationCosts: False;
Partisans: True;
IsolatedReorganizationLimits: False;
OilRules: False;
HitlersWar: False;
USSRJapanCompulsoryPeace: False;
EnrouteInterception: False;
NightMissions: False;
TwinEnginedFighters: False;
FighterBombers: False;
OutclassedFighters: False;
CarrierPlanes: False;
RoughSeas: False;
LimitedAircraftInterception: False;
Internment: False;
FlyingBombs: False;
Kamikazes: False;
Offensive: True;
Ukraine: False;
Intelligence: False;
JapaneseCommandConflict: False;
SkiTroops: False;
Queens: False;
CityBasedVolunteers: False;
Siberians: True;
NavalSupplyUnits: False;
GuardsBannerArmies: False;
ChineseWarlords: True;
PartisanHQs: False;
CruisersInFlames: False;
ConvoysInFlames: False;
OilTankers: False;
ConstructionEngineers: False;
ScrapUnits: False;
AddChineseCities: True;
UnlimitedBreakdown: False;
ExtendedGame: False;
UnrestrictedSetup: False;
NavalOffensiveChit: False;
);

StandardDefaultOptions: TOptions = (
Divisions: True;
Artillery: True;
Fortifications: True;
SupplyUnits: True;
CombatEngineers: True;
FlyingBoats: True;
Territorials: False;
LimitedOverseasSupply: True;
LimitedSupplyAcrossStraits: True;
HQSupport: True;
EmergencyHQSupply: True;
SyntheticOilPlants: True;
OffCityReinforcement: True;
RecruitmentLimits: False;
HQMovement: False;
BottomedShips: False;
InThePresenceOfTheEnemy: False;
SurprisedZOCs: False;
BounceCombat: False;
VWeapons: True;
AtomicBombs: True;
Frogmen: False;
SCSTransport: True;
AmphibiousRules: True;
OptionalCVSearching: True;
Pilots: True;
FoodInFlames: False;
FactoryConstruction: False;
SavingResources: True;
CarpetBombing: True;
TankBusters: True;
MotorizedMovementRates: True;
BomberATR: True;
LargeATR: True;
RailwayMovement: False;
DefensiveShoreBombardment: False;
BlitzBonus: False;
ChineseAttackWeakness: True;
FractionalOdds: True;
AlliedCombatFriction: True;
TwoD10LandCRT: True;
ExtendedAircraftRebasing: True;
VariableReorganizationCosts: True;
Partisans: True;
IsolatedReorganizationLimits: True;
OilRules: True;
HitlersWar: False;
USSRJapanCompulsoryPeace: True;
EnrouteInterception: False;
NightMissions: False;
TwinEnginedFighters: True;
FighterBombers: True;
OutclassedFighters: True;
CarrierPlanes: True;
RoughSeas: False;
LimitedAircraftInterception: False;
Internment: False;
FlyingBombs: False;
Kamikazes: True;
Offensive: True;
Ukraine: False;
Intelligence: False;
JapaneseCommandConflict: False;
SkiTroops: True;
Queens: True;
CityBasedVolunteers: True;
Siberians: True;
NavalSupplyUnits: True;
GuardsBannerArmies: True;
ChineseWarlords: True;
PartisanHQs: False;
CruisersInFlames: False;
ConvoysInFlames: False;
OilTankers: False;
ConstructionEngineers: False;
ScrapUnits: True;
AddChineseCities: True;
UnlimitedBreakdown: False;
ExtendedGame: False;
UnrestrictedSetup: False;
NavalOffensiveChit: False;
);

EnhancedDefaultOptions: TOptions = (
Divisions: True;
Artillery: True;
Fortifications: True;
SupplyUnits: True;
CombatEngineers: True;
FlyingBoats: True;
Territorials: True;
LimitedOverseasSupply: True;
LimitedSupplyAcrossStraits: True;
HQSupport: True;
EmergencyHQSupply: True;
SyntheticOilPlants: True;
OffCityReinforcement: True;
RecruitmentLimits: False;
HQMovement: False;
BottomedShips: True;
InThePresenceOfTheEnemy: True;
SurprisedZOCs: False;
BounceCombat: True;
VWeapons: True;
AtomicBombs: True;
Frogmen: True;
SCSTransport: True;
AmphibiousRules: True;
OptionalCVSearching: True;
Pilots: True;
FoodInFlames: False;
FactoryConstruction: True;
SavingResources: True;
CarpetBombing: True;
TankBusters: True;
MotorizedMovementRates: True;
BomberATR: True;
LargeATR: True;
RailwayMovement: False;
DefensiveShoreBombardment: True;
BlitzBonus: False;
ChineseAttackWeakness: True;
FractionalOdds: True;
AlliedCombatFriction: True;
TwoD10LandCRT: True;
ExtendedAircraftRebasing: True;
VariableReorganizationCosts: True;
Partisans: True;
IsolatedReorganizationLimits: True;
OilRules: True;
HitlersWar: False;
USSRJapanCompulsoryPeace: True;
EnrouteInterception: False;
NightMissions: True;
TwinEnginedFighters: True;
FighterBombers: True;
OutclassedFighters: True;
CarrierPlanes: True;
RoughSeas: False;
LimitedAircraftInterception: False;
Internment: True;
FlyingBombs: True;
Kamikazes: True;
Offensive: True;
Ukraine: False;
Intelligence: False;
JapaneseCommandConflict: False;
SkiTroops: True;
Queens: True;
CityBasedVolunteers: True;
Siberians: True;
NavalSupplyUnits: True;
GuardsBannerArmies: True;
ChineseWarlords: True;
PartisanHQs: True;
CruisersInFlames: True;
ConvoysInFlames: True;
OilTankers: True;
ConstructionEngineers: True;
ScrapUnits: True;
AddChineseCities: True;
UnlimitedBreakdown: True;
ExtendedGame: False;
UnrestrictedSetup: False;
NavalOffensiveChit: False;
Steve

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Froonp
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RE: optional rules

Post by Froonp »

Some comments :

For the Advanced set, you activated CoiF and not Food in Flames.
Food in Flames was designed to give the CW the BP necessary to build the ASW unit they need now that (playing with CoiF) they have no more built-in ASW in their CP units.
So, you should activate Food in Flames if activating CoiF.

For the Advanced set, you chose not to activate Japanese Command Conflict.
This is a realism option that tries to put in the game the rivality that opposed the IJN and the IJA, and that led to large wastes of energy, and lots of battles. Have you seen "Letters fro Iwo Jima" that C Eastwood did ? It shows that pretty well. A WWII game without this option is not a WWII game, so I think that it should be activated in the hightest level of option choices.

For the Novice choice, you activate Blitz Bonus, and not for the 2 other sets of options ? Why ? Blitz options were designed for the play with the 2d10 CRT, so it is bizarre to include them in an 1d10 game, and not in the full chrome 2d10 one. I think that this choice should be reversed. BLitz Bonus should be activated for 2d10 play, and unactivated with 1d10 play.

For the Advanced set, you activate the In The Presence Of The Enemy that is in my opinion one of the worst options in the game, resulting in Japan spreading lone cruisers in the Pacific, just top make the TF-58 Armada slow down and unable to wreak havoc in the Japan home waters. If the option required that the blocking TF was at least half the size of the moving TF, but here as is, it is pretty much ridiculous (personal opinion).

On the other hand, you choose in the Advanced set not to activate the En route Interception option that gives a new layer of realism in the game, allowing to intercept long ranged air missions on their way, rather than only at their target. I would reverse this choice.
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Zorachus99
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RE: optional rules

Post by Zorachus99 »

ORIGINAL: Froonp

For the Novice choice, you activate Blitz Bonus, and not for the 2 other sets of options ? Why ? Blitz options were designed for the play with the 2d10 CRT, so it is bizarre to include them in an 1d10 game, and not in the full chrome 2d10 one. I think that this choice should be reversed. BLitz Bonus should be activated for 2d10 play, and unactivated with 1d10 play.

Incorrect. The blitz table has been around for as long as I can remember, which includes the old 1d6 tables. Anyone remember what it was like before the 1d10 was used?

Regardless, the blitz combat table should be used in novice play. It's primary effect is to allow you to advance an additional hex, which I consider intuitive.
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RE: optional rules

Post by Shannon V. OKeets »

ORIGINAL: Froonp

Some comments :

For the Advanced set, you activated CoiF and not Food in Flames.
Food in Flames was designed to give the CW the BP necessary to build the ASW unit they need now that (playing with CoiF) they have no more built-in ASW in their CP units.
So, you should activate Food in Flames if activating CoiF.

For the Advanced set, you chose not to activate Japanese Command Conflict.
This is a realism option that tries to put in the game the rivality that opposed the IJN and the IJA, and that led to large wastes of energy, and lots of battles. Have you seen "Letters fro Iwo Jima" that C Eastwood did ? It shows that pretty well. A WWII game without this option is not a WWII game, so I think that it should be activated in the hightest level of option choices.

For the Novice choice, you activate Blitz Bonus, and not for the 2 other sets of options ? Why ? Blitz options were designed for the play with the 2d10 CRT, so it is bizarre to include them in an 1d10 game, and not in the full chrome 2d10 one. I think that this choice should be reversed. BLitz Bonus should be activated for 2d10 play, and unactivated with 1d10 play.

For the Advanced set, you activate the In The Presence Of The Enemy that is in my opinion one of the worst options in the game, resulting in Japan spreading lone cruisers in the Pacific, just top make the TF-58 Armada slow down and unable to wreak havoc in the Japan home waters. If the option required that the blocking TF was at least half the size of the moving TF, but here as is, it is pretty much ridiculous (personal opinion).

On the other hand, you choose in the Advanced set not to activate the En route Interception option that gives a new layer of realism in the game, allowing to intercept long ranged air missions on their way, rather than only at their target. I would reverse this choice.
I'll reconsider Food in Flames to go with Convoy in Flames then.

Someone in a post above gave a real good reason for not using Japanese Command Conflict.

Blitz Bonus is not used with 2D10. They are mutually exclusive.

As for Enroute Interception and In the Presence of the Enemy, you are at the mercy of my preferences.[;)]
Steve

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Froonp
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RE: optional rules

Post by Froonp »

ORIGINAL: Zorachus99
ORIGINAL: Froonp

For the Novice choice, you activate Blitz Bonus, and not for the 2 other sets of options ? Why ? Blitz options were designed for the play with the 2d10 CRT, so it is bizarre to include them in an 1d10 game, and not in the full chrome 2d10 one. I think that this choice should be reversed. BLitz Bonus should be activated for 2d10 play, and unactivated with 1d10 play.

Incorrect. The blitz table has been around for as long as I can remember, which includes the old 1d6 tables. Anyone remember what it was like before the 1d10 was used?

Regardless, the blitz combat table should be used in novice play. It's primary effect is to allow you to advance an additional hex, which I consider intuitive.
Zorachus, you are confusing two things, the Blitz Bonus has nothing to do with the Blitz CRT.
This is an optional combatm odifiers set that gives bonus to attacking armor in Blitz combat (and lot more).

You still have the Blitz CRT even if playing without the Blitz bonus optional.
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Froonp
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RE: optional rules

Post by Froonp »

Blitz Bonus is not used with 2D10. They are mutually exclusive.
Steve, I beleive that here is a confusion here.

In WiF FE, the Blitz bonus is not mutually exclusive with the 2d10 CRT

It is even more different, it is that the Blitz bonus are indeed included in the 2d10 CRT, just look at the 2d10 CRT table, you'll see them all on the right side, adapted for 2d10 play. They are all there, the bonus for attacking ARM / MECH, the penalty for defending ARM / MECH, the bonus for PARA dropping, the penalty for factories). You'll even see that these modifiers are all preceeded by the "==>" sign, indicating that they are optionals.

Moreover, historicaly those bonuses were first designed for 2d10 CRT, and were then converted for 1d10 CRT play in RAW7aug04, and made an optional rule by themselves.

So you can play 1d10 CRT with or without Blitz bonuses, and you can play 2d10 CRT with or without blitz bonuses, but the more common combination are 1d10 CRT without the Blitz bonuses (the early WiF FE design indeed) and 2d10 CRT with the blitz bonuses (the normal WiF FE 2d10 design).
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RE: optional rules

Post by Froonp »

As for Enroute Interception and In the Presence of the Enemy, you are at the mercy of my preferences.
Yes, [:D] fortunately I can save my own personal preferences [:D].
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RE: optional rules

Post by Froonp »

Someone in a post above gave a real good reason for not using Japanese Command Conflict.
I can't see any.
It is as if you said me that someone gave a real good reason for not using Kamikaze, or the A-bomb, or Tank Busters. WWII without Japanese Command Conflict is not WWII [:D].

PS : Look at "Letters from Iwo Jima", it is a blast.
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RE: optional rules

Post by lomyrin »

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets

ORIGINAL: Froonp

Some comments :

For the Advanced set, you activated CoiF and not Food in Flames.
Food in Flames was designed to give the CW the BP necessary to build the ASW unit they need now that (playing with CoiF) they have no more built-in ASW in their CP units.
So, you should activate Food in Flames if activating CoiF.

For the Advanced set, you chose not to activate Japanese Command Conflict.
This is a realism option that tries to put in the game the rivality that opposed the IJN and the IJA, and that led to large wastes of energy, and lots of battles. Have you seen "Letters fro Iwo Jima" that C Eastwood did ? It shows that pretty well. A WWII game without this option is not a WWII game, so I think that it should be activated in the hightest level of option choices.

For the Novice choice, you activate Blitz Bonus, and not for the 2 other sets of options ? Why ? Blitz options were designed for the play with the 2d10 CRT, so it is bizarre to include them in an 1d10 game, and not in the full chrome 2d10 one. I think that this choice should be reversed. BLitz Bonus should be activated for 2d10 play, and unactivated with 1d10 play.

For the Advanced set, you activate the In The Presence Of The Enemy that is in my opinion one of the worst options in the game, resulting in Japan spreading lone cruisers in the Pacific, just top make the TF-58 Armada slow down and unable to wreak havoc in the Japan home waters. If the option required that the blocking TF was at least half the size of the moving TF, but here as is, it is pretty much ridiculous (personal opinion).

On the other hand, you choose in the Advanced set not to activate the En route Interception option that gives a new layer of realism in the game, allowing to intercept long ranged air missions on their way, rather than only at their target. I would reverse this choice.
I'll reconsider Food in Flames to go with Convoy in Flames then.

Someone in a post above gave a real good reason for not using Japanese Command Conflict.

Blitz Bonus is not used with 2D10. They are mutually exclusive.

As for Enroute Interception and In the Presence of the Enemy, you are at the mercy of my preferences.[;)]

Blitz bonus when using the 2D10 tables is of enormous importance and certainly is used by almost all palyers.

Japanese command conflict when one considers all the new Chinese cities is not a desirable option in my mind.

Lars
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RE: optional rules

Post by Shannon V. OKeets »

ORIGINAL: lomyrin

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets

ORIGINAL: Froonp

Some comments :

For the Advanced set, you activated CoiF and not Food in Flames.
Food in Flames was designed to give the CW the BP necessary to build the ASW unit they need now that (playing with CoiF) they have no more built-in ASW in their CP units.
So, you should activate Food in Flames if activating CoiF.

For the Advanced set, you chose not to activate Japanese Command Conflict.
This is a realism option that tries to put in the game the rivality that opposed the IJN and the IJA, and that led to large wastes of energy, and lots of battles. Have you seen "Letters fro Iwo Jima" that C Eastwood did ? It shows that pretty well. A WWII game without this option is not a WWII game, so I think that it should be activated in the hightest level of option choices.

For the Novice choice, you activate Blitz Bonus, and not for the 2 other sets of options ? Why ? Blitz options were designed for the play with the 2d10 CRT, so it is bizarre to include them in an 1d10 game, and not in the full chrome 2d10 one. I think that this choice should be reversed. BLitz Bonus should be activated for 2d10 play, and unactivated with 1d10 play.

For the Advanced set, you activate the In The Presence Of The Enemy that is in my opinion one of the worst options in the game, resulting in Japan spreading lone cruisers in the Pacific, just top make the TF-58 Armada slow down and unable to wreak havoc in the Japan home waters. If the option required that the blocking TF was at least half the size of the moving TF, but here as is, it is pretty much ridiculous (personal opinion).

On the other hand, you choose in the Advanced set not to activate the En route Interception option that gives a new layer of realism in the game, allowing to intercept long ranged air missions on their way, rather than only at their target. I would reverse this choice.
I'll reconsider Food in Flames to go with Convoy in Flames then.

Someone in a post above gave a real good reason for not using Japanese Command Conflict.

Blitz Bonus is not used with 2D10. They are mutually exclusive.

As for Enroute Interception and In the Presence of the Enemy, you are at the mercy of my preferences.[;)]

Blitz bonus when using the 2D10 tables is of enormous importance and certainly is used by almost all palyers.

Japanese command conflict when one considers all the new Chinese cities is not a desirable option in my mind.

Lars
Please compare the following.
====================

23.7 Blitz Bonus
This optional rule magnifies some of the effects of blitzkrieg warfare. Armor does better
in the open but all units do worse when attacking cities containing factories. Paratroops get an
added bonus. This optional rule cannot be used in combination with the 2D10 CRT optional
rule; they are mutually exclusive.

Note that this optional rule for Blitz Bonus is completely separate from choosing between
the Blitzkrieg and Assault tables. The standard rules discuss the effects of choosing the
Blitzkrieg table (sometimes referring to it as the Blitz table) and the optional rule for using the
2D10 land combat results table has a column labeled Blitz. Despite the similarity in words, this
Blitz Bonus optional rule is separate and distinct.

There are 4 changes to the combat calculations when the Blitz Bonus is in effect:
∙ 1 is subtracted for attacking a 2 or 3 factory stack.
∙ 1 is added to the die roll for each two attacking armor, mechanized, and HQ-A units conducting a blitzkrieg attack against a non-city clear or desert hex in fine weather.
∙ 1 is subtracted from the die roll per defending armor, mechanized, and HQ-A in a non- city clear or desert hex in fine weather.
∙ 1 is added to the die roll for each unit that paradrops (after air to air combat and anti aircraft fire, if any).

23.5 2D10 and Combat Results Table
This optional rule replaces the 1D10 (1 ten-sided die) land combat results table with the
2D10 (2 ten-side dice) land combat results table. The 2D10 is a more complex table in that it
provides for more modifiers to the dice roll and takes into account more variations in the combat
situation (e.g., terrain and units engaged effects). Besides using 2 dice and summing them to
determine the combat result, the 2D10 also converts the odds ratio into a dice roll modifier for
reading a column, rather than using the odds and the die roll as 2 indices into the CRT like the
1D10 CRT does.

The procedure for determining the modifiers, rolling the dice, etcetera, is not really
relevant to players of MWIF, since the program takes care of that for you. However, the players
should be aware of the effects of terrain, weather, unit types, odds ratio, and combat type, so they
can reasonably predict the outcome of an attack. Therefore, they are described below.

When using 2D10 optional rule, 2 dice are rolled and their values are added up. To that
sum are applied the modifiers, and the modified total is used to look up the combat result, either
on the Assault or the Blitz column of the 2D10 CRT.

The 2D10 table includes 2 new results: (1) the half disrupted, and (2) the extra loss to the
attacker in bad weather or terrain. The half disrupted result means that after the combat results
have been applied, with units retreated and/or advanced, half (rounding up) of the surviving
organized attackers remain organized, owner's choice. The other half become disorganized.

The extra loss in bad terrain and/or bad weather means the attacker takes more losses and
makes bad terrain even better for defense. However, the table is also slightly bloodier for the
defender too, so the net effect is heavier casualties all around.

Die Roll Modifications for the 2D10 CRT
∙ +1, when using the Blitzkrieg column, for each armor or mechanized unit (i.e., either corps/army or division, including HQ-A), but only if the weather is fine, the attack is into a non-city, clear or desert hex, and the unit is not attacking across a fortification.
∙ -2 for each defending armor or mechanized corps/army (including HQ-A) in a non-city, clear or desert terrain, but only during fine weather.
∙ -1 for each defending armor or mechanized division in a non-city, clear or desert terrain, but only during fine weather.
∙ -1 for each defending Anti-Tank and Anti-Air unit that has its combat factors in a pink or red circle (some of the latter do not), but only if attacked by at least one armor or mechanized unit (including HQ-A).
∙ +2 for each disorganized defending corps/army unit.
∙ +1 for each disorganized defending notional or division sized unit.
∙ Plus or minus half the reorganization value of supporting HQs (plus for the attacking HQ and minus for the defending HQ). No die roll is required for HQ support. When using the 2D10 CRT, HQ's always provide support if the player commits them to do so.
∙ -1 for each co-operating major power attacking (after the first).
∙ -4 for attacking in jungle. But +1 for each white print Japanese, Australian, or US marine attacking a jungle hex.
∙ +1 for each paradropping unit that actually lands in the hex.
∙ +2 for non-territorials attacking territorials.
∙ -2 for territorials attacking non-territorials.
∙ -2 for rain.
∙ -4 for storm.
∙ -4 for snow. But +1 for each attacking and -2 for each defending winterized unit. Winterized units are Ski, Mountain, Swedish, Finnish, Norwegian, and Russian white print units.
∙ -6 for blizzard. But +1 for each attacking and -2 for each defending winterized unit.
∙ -1 for city and -1 for each preexisting factory in a city. But +1 for an HQ attacking a city,
∙ +1 for each engineer combat factor attacking a city, and -1 for each engineer combat factor defending in a city. Furthermore, the city modifiers can never be greater than 0.
∙ Attacking bonuses are halved (except for HQ support) when the combat factors of the attacking units are halved (e.g., when attacking across a river).
Steve

Perfection is an elusive goal.
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Mziln
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RE: optional rules

Post by Mziln »

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets

ORIGINAL: Froonp

Some comments :

For the Advanced set, you activated CoiF and not Food in Flames.
Food in Flames was designed to give the CW the BP necessary to build the ASW unit they need now that (playing with CoiF) they have no more built-in ASW in their CP units.
So, you should activate Food in Flames if activating CoiF.

For the Advanced set, you chose not to activate Japanese Command Conflict.
This is a realism option that tries to put in the game the rivality that opposed the IJN and the IJA, and that led to large wastes of energy, and lots of battles. Have you seen "Letters fro Iwo Jima" that C Eastwood did ? It shows that pretty well. A WWII game without this option is not a WWII game, so I think that it should be activated in the hightest level of option choices.

For the Novice choice, you activate Blitz Bonus, and not for the 2 other sets of options ? Why ? Blitz options were designed for the play with the 2d10 CRT, so it is bizarre to include them in an 1d10 game, and not in the full chrome 2d10 one. I think that this choice should be reversed. BLitz Bonus should be activated for 2d10 play, and unactivated with 1d10 play.

For the Advanced set, you activate the In The Presence Of The Enemy that is in my opinion one of the worst options in the game, resulting in Japan spreading lone cruisers in the Pacific, just top make the TF-58 Armada slow down and unable to wreak havoc in the Japan home waters. If the option required that the blocking TF was at least half the size of the moving TF, but here as is, it is pretty much ridiculous (personal opinion).

On the other hand, you choose in the Advanced set not to activate the En route Interception option that gives a new layer of realism in the game, allowing to intercept long ranged air missions on their way, rather than only at their target. I would reverse this choice.
I'll reconsider Food in Flames to go with Convoy in Flames then.

Someone in a post above gave a real good reason for not using Japanese Command Conflict.

Blitz Bonus is not used with 2D10. They are mutually exclusive.

As for Enroute Interception and In the Presence of the Enemy, you are at the mercy of my preferences.[;)]

What makes it exclusive? The 2 DIE 10 LAND COMBAT RESULTS TABLE already has the Blitz bonus incorperated into it (although slightly diferent).
Option 39: (Blitz bonus) Add 1 to the die roll for each two attacking ARM, MECH and HQ-A units conducting a blitz attack against a clear or desert (non city) hex in fine weather.

Subtract one from the roll per defending ARM, MECH and HQ-A in a (non city) clear or desert hex in fine weather.

Add 1 to the roll for each paradroping unit (after air to air combat and anti aircraft fire, if any).
OPTION 67: 2 DIE 10 LAND COMBAT RESULTS TABLE

+1 ~ for each paradropping unit after air to air combat and antiaircraft fire (if any).

-2 per defending ARM, MECH in a (non-city) clear, or desert hex (only -1 if the defending unit is a division) clear weather only.

Blitz Table modification (clear weather only) +1 ~ per attacking ARM and MECH in a (non city) clear or desert hex provided the unit is not attacking across a fort hexside.
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RE: optional rules

Post by Shannon V. OKeets »

ORIGINAL: Froonp
Blitz Bonus is not used with 2D10. They are mutually exclusive.
Steve, I beleive that here is a confusion here.

In WiF FE, the Blitz bonus is not mutually exclusive with the 2d10 CRT

It is even more different, it is that the Blitz bonus are indeed included in the 2d10 CRT, just look at the 2d10 CRT table, you'll see them all on the right side, adapted for 2d10 play. They are all there, the bonus for attacking ARM / MECH, the penalty for defending ARM / MECH, the bonus for PARA dropping, the penalty for factories). You'll even see that these modifiers are all preceeded by the "==>" sign, indicating that they are optionals.

Moreover, historicaly those bonuses were first designed for 2d10 CRT, and were then converted for 1d10 CRT play in RAW7aug04, and made an optional rule by themselves.

So you can play 1d10 CRT with or without Blitz bonuses, and you can play 2d10 CRT with or without blitz bonuses, but the more common combination are 1d10 CRT without the Blitz bonuses (the early WiF FE design indeed) and 2d10 CRT with the blitz bonuses (the normal WiF FE 2d10 design).
Yes. I was under the impression that the Blitz Bonus rules were mandatory with the 2D10. That is how I have set up the optional rule 2D10. To disable them for 2D10 seems completely wrong to me.
Steve

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lomyrin
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RE: optional rules

Post by lomyrin »

So are you saying that the benefits of using a Blitz attack are inherent in the 2D10 table and therefore not a separate Blits option ?

And for that matter all the other modifiers arealso inherent and subject to any other specific option.


That I agree with.

Lars
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RE: optional rules

Post by Froonp »

Please compare the following.
====================

23.7 Blitz Bonus
(...)
There are 4 changes to the combat calculations when the Blitz Bonus is in effect:
∙ 1 is subtracted for attacking a 2 or 3 factory stack.
∙ 1 is added to the die roll for each two attacking armor, mechanized, and HQ-A units conducting a blitzkrieg attack against a non-city clear or desert hex in fine weather.
∙ 1 is subtracted from the die roll per defending armor, mechanized, and HQ-A in a non- city clear or desert hex in fine weather.
∙ 1 is added to the die roll for each unit that paradrops (after air to air combat and anti aircraft fire, if any).

23.5 2D10 and Combat Results Table
(...)

Die Roll Modifications for the 2D10 CRT
∙ +1, when using the Blitzkrieg column, for each armor or mechanized unit (i.e., either corps/army or division, including HQ-A), but only if the weather is fine, the attack is into a non-city, clear or desert hex, and the unit is not attacking across a fortification.
∙ -2 for each defending armor or mechanized corps/army (including HQ-A) in a non-city, clear or desert terrain, but only during fine weather.
∙ -1 for each defending armor or mechanized division in a non-city, clear or desert terrain, but only during fine weather.
∙ -1 for each defending Anti-Tank and Anti-Air unit that has its combat factors in a pink or red circle (some of the latter do not), but only if attacked by at least one armor or mechanized unit (including HQ-A).
∙ +2 for each disorganized defending corps/army unit.
∙ +1 for each disorganized defending notional or division sized unit.
∙ Plus or minus half the reorganization value of supporting HQs (plus for the attacking HQ and minus for the defending HQ). No die roll is required for HQ support. When using the 2D10 CRT, HQ's always provide support if the player commits them to do so.
∙ -1 for each co-operating major power attacking (after the first).
∙ -4 for attacking in jungle. But +1 for each white print Japanese, Australian, or US marine attacking a jungle hex.
∙ +1 for each paradropping unit that actually lands in the hex.
∙ +2 for non-territorials attacking territorials.
∙ -2 for territorials attacking non-territorials.
∙ -2 for rain.
∙ -4 for storm.
∙ -4 for snow. But +1 for each attacking and -2 for each defending winterized unit. Winterized units are Ski, Mountain, Swedish, Finnish, Norwegian, and Russian white print units.
∙ -6 for blizzard. But +1 for each attacking and -2 for each defending winterized unit.
∙ -1 for city and -1 for each preexisting factory in a city. But +1 for an HQ attacking a city,
∙ +1 for each engineer combat factor attacking a city, and -1 for each engineer combat factor defending in a city. Furthermore, the city modifiers can never be greater than 0.
∙ Attacking bonuses are halved (except for HQ support) when the combat factors of the attacking units are halved (e.g., when attacking across a river).
This that you post show that some of the bonuses / penalties of the 2d10 CRT are indeed the Blitz bonuses converted to 2d10 (in fact, it is the reverse, it is that the Blitz bonuses are some of the 2d10 CRT bonuses / penalties, converted to 1d10 use).

I put them in bold & color above.
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RE: optional rules

Post by Froonp »

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets
ORIGINAL: Froonp
Blitz Bonus is not used with 2D10. They are mutually exclusive.
Steve, I beleive that here is a confusion here.

In WiF FE, the Blitz bonus is not mutually exclusive with the 2d10 CRT

It is even more different, it is that the Blitz bonus are indeed included in the 2d10 CRT, just look at the 2d10 CRT table, you'll see them all on the right side, adapted for 2d10 play. They are all there, the bonus for attacking ARM / MECH, the penalty for defending ARM / MECH, the bonus for PARA dropping, the penalty for factories). You'll even see that these modifiers are all preceeded by the "==>" sign, indicating that they are optionals.

Moreover, historicaly those bonuses were first designed for 2d10 CRT, and were then converted for 1d10 CRT play in RAW7aug04, and made an optional rule by themselves.

So you can play 1d10 CRT with or without Blitz bonuses, and you can play 2d10 CRT with or without blitz bonuses, but the more common combination are 1d10 CRT without the Blitz bonuses (the early WiF FE design indeed) and 2d10 CRT with the blitz bonuses (the normal WiF FE 2d10 design).
Yes. I was under the impression that the Blitz Bonus rules were mandatory with the 2D10. That is how I have set up the optional rule 2D10. To disable them for 2D10 seems completely wrong to me.
Yes, to me too, playing the 2d10 without the blitz bonuses would seem completely wrong to me too, but I understand it (because of the "==>" smbol indicating an optional bonus / penalty) that they are indeed optional.

Not a big deal as long as they are included, but saying a WiF player that Blitz bonuses are mutualy exclusive with the 2d10 CRT has chances of him getting angry after you [:D]. Should made be clear then that the 2d10 CRT includes the Blitz modifiers.

Sure, what should not be allowed, would be to add the blitz modifiers of the blitz modifiers option to the blitz modifiers of the 2d10 CRT, this would be adding them twice.
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RE: optional rules

Post by lomyrin »

On the printed 2D10 combat table there is a little detail symbol  =>   for almost all the blitz and other modifiers. It says 'optional' to use these modifiers. Because of that I think that the Blitz option as shown choosable in the select options screen, should have to be checked in order to have these modifiers in effect even when checking the 2D10 table.
 
Lars.
 
 
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RE: optional rules

Post by Shannon V. OKeets »

ORIGINAL: lomyrin

On the printed 2D10 combat table there is a little detail symbol  =>   for almost all the blitz and other modifiers. It says 'optional' to use these modifiers. Because of that I think that the Blitz option as shown choosable in the select options screen, should have to be checked in order to have these modifiers in effect even when checking the 2D10 table.

Lars.
I believe it was in the discussion of one of the AI Strategic plans where this was all thrashed out in detail.

I have the Blitz Bonus as an optional rule that only applies when the 1D10 table is used. The equivalent 'rules' are mandatory when the 2D10 table is used.

This was decided months ago and I have little interest in reviewing old decisions.

Unless, something critical comes to light, the Optional Rules Definitions are set as is.
Steve

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RE: optional rules

Post by lomyrin »

No problem, I just want to avoid confusion among the players.

Lars
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