Map Making Question

[Hoyt Burrass]

I'm mostly done with a Brevity scenario for COTA (Brevity first, Battleaxe when I get Brevity straightened out)but am having some difficulties making the escarpment impassable. I read in the manual that if the slope is greater than 30% then it is impassable to motorized traffic, so I created 30 degree slopes and motorized troops went right across. I added a layer of broken terrain, thinking that the movement penalty would convince the AI to stay away, and motorized troops went right across. Then I added a narrow band of impassable escarpment to the middle of the slope, and motorized troops went right across. any thoughts? I'll embed a jpeg of the map for your viewing pleasure, the impassable escarpment does not show beneath the broken terrain.

[Arjuna]

HK,
 
Sorry to ask the bleeding obvious but did you recalc the map terrain?

[Hoyt Burrass]

Yep did that...but I have to admit it took me a few days with the map maker before I consistently remembered to do so. It also doesn't mean I haven't done something equally as mindless that I am as yet unaware of.

[Arjuna]

To achieve a slope greater than 30 degrees is not that easy, depending on your altitude/contour interval. What interval are you using?

[Hoyt Burrass]

Contour interval is 20 Meters...regardless, shouldn't the impassable terrain take care of it? or could I be running into an issue of grain (coarse/fine) recognized by the software?

and thanks for your time

[Arjuna]

HK,
 
I would need to review the map to answer that correctly. If you create an impassable layer ( ie move rates for motorised set to zero ) then it will be treated like all other layers. It competes with other layers for determining the total effect. The function that determines the move rate at a given location determines the dominant terrain layers and then averages them. Given that we do not have a permanent impassable layer that we could handle with special case code, I'd say that unless it dominates the entire 100m movement grid some other layer will ensure that there is at least some potential movement.
 
Also with contours and slope. In determining slope, we average the slope over surrounding areas. This ensures that we don't end up with a cliff at the edge of each layer. So to best achieve a cliff, you need to have multiple contours within the same 100m move grid. This then should give you the effect you are after. 

[Hoyt Burrass]

I expect that the 100 m resolution is what is giving me problems...I'll adjust and see what I can come up with. thanks for the help

[Arjuna]

You're welcome. [:)]

[simovitch]

The escarpment pattern has to be sketched "wide" enough to block out movement. sometimes wider if you are turning a corner and snaking around. You will have to just trial and error it.

This is unlike major river/ocean patterns that will block movement at almost any width.

[Arjuna]

That's because we handle major rivers with special code. We do not have a permanent impassable terrain layer. If we did, then we could handle it in a similar fashion.

[Deathtreader]

ORIGINAL: Arjuna

That's because we handle major rivers with special code. We do not have a permanent impassable terrain layer. If we did, then we could handle it in a similar fashion.

Well........ you knew somebody was gonna say it.........so I'll volunteer. [:D]
Can we please have a new permanent impassable terrain layer??
Cheers!

Rob. [:)]

[Arjuna]

Rob,
 
Short term answer - NO. The reason is that we have so few because of our map data structure ( designed back in 95/96 when we needed it to work on a 256K RAM machine ( you remember them? [;)] ) ).
 
Longer term answer - YES once we overhaul the map data structures. But this is a VERY BIG job and it's not going to happen real soon.
 
However, I just though of a compromise. What if we added another attribute to the layer that indicated whether this feature was impassable or not. Then I could test for this when we calc the terrain. I'll need to investigate if this will suffice. It may not.
 
TT3563 - MM - AI - Add Impassable flag to map overlay data and treat like major rivers when calc terrain

[Deathtreader]

ORIGINAL: Arjuna

Rob,

Short term answer - NO. The reason is that we have so few because of our map data structure ( designed back in 95/96 when we needed it to work on a 256K RAM machine ( you remember them? [;)] ) ).

Longer term answer - YES once we overhaul the map data structures. But this is a VERY BIG job and it's not going to happen real soon.

However, I just though of a compromise. What if we added another attribute to the layer that indicated whether this feature was impassable or not. Then I could test for this when we calc the terrain. I'll need to investigate if this will suffice. It may not.

TT3563 - MM - AI - Add Impassable flag to map overlay data and treat like major rivers when calc terrain

Probably waaaaay too early to be asking this, but what the hay........ any more thoughts on the impassable flag??

Rob. [:)]

[Arjuna]

Yes it is waaaaay too early! [:)]

[Prince of Eckmühl]

Believe it or not, I had NO idea that someone had worked on this map before I started it.

Apparently, HK was even using the same underlay as I did, down to a kilometer, or so.

I came across his post just now when I expanded the thread drop-down from 90 days to ALL in searching for a post of Simovitch regarding minefields.

This is really embarrassing. [:o]

HK, if you're out there, just remember, imitation is the sincerest form of flattery!

PoE (aka ivanmoe)