Initial impressions

[dogancan]

I will definitely buy this game, and just waiting to read some on Bulge so I can get the athmosphere of these battles. What I want to know is, for those who do not know much about WW2 history, is any information about actual war etc. provided as a doc? And more importantly, while choosing the squad, does any information about AFVs provided ( since I do not understand anything at all when one say Tiger XXA or something like this!)? [:D]

[Tejszd]

The manual has couple pages on the battle for background.

For picking squads/vehicles you can look at;
- the weapons carried
- the experience/morale

But probably the best bet is to look at the point value of the unit, the higher the number usually the better unit....

[Prince of Eckmühl]

My initial impression is that WaR is a lot like CC4:



I quit playing CC4 when I saw a vehicle shoot through a large church. AFAIK, these are the only two games in the CC series where vehicles can shoot through houses. I'd love to state, unequivocally, that WaR is improved in this regard, but I only played one scenario before noticing that the bug had gone unrectified.

PoE (aka ivanmoe)

[midgard30]

Thanks for all your comments. They're really helpful. Both games seem to be really interesting and have features that I like: diversity for CoI and more Strategic options and supplies for WaR. I'm really tempted by WaR for these reasons, but I'm afraid that all missions would feel all alike (winter and forest). On the other hand, since CoI is more linear, it looks more suitable for a first time player.

What about the AI? Same for both games?

[Andrew Williams]

I checked the coding

The AC is sitting an a 5m High piece of ground.

The 3 Story building sits at 17m.

You are shooting over the top of the building adjacent to you,where the roof meets the wall, to hit the roof of the 3 story building.

Move the firing line a little either way and you will lose LOS... you are just sitting in exactly the right spot to get a perfect angle to that single spot on the 3 story roof.

This can be seen in any of the CC games.

[dogancan]

thx, as I understand I do not need specific details about AFVs, like their fuel consumption, relative armour-speed balance, and scouting capacity. That is actually good news for me. [:)]

[invernomuto]

What about the AI? Same for both games?

I made only one mission (first mission of the grand campaing) as german vs Allies AI. I made some mistake and the AI wiped me out. In COI, first missions were far more easier. But I'm not a CC veteran.

Bye

[Reboot]

ORIGINAL: squadleader_id
- The new maps are awesome...SouthernLand outdid himself again...as always!

JimRM2 did a few gems too

[Prince of Eckmühl]

ORIGINAL: Andrew Williams

I checked the coding

The AC is sitting an a 5m High piece of ground.

The 3 Story building sits at 17m.

You are shooting over the top of the building adjacent to you,where the roof meets the wall, to hit the roof of the 3 story building.

Move the firing line a little either way and you will lose LOS... you are just sitting in exactly the right spot to get a perfect angle to that single spot on the 3 story roof.

This can be seen in any of the CC games.

Hello Andrew,

Thanks for responding. I honestly don't think that the target's roof elevation has anything to do with this. I can kill the green/open LOS simply by moving the shooting vehicle rearward and away from the intervening (two-story) structure, when geometry would suggest that exactly the opposite should be the case. Anyway, check out this one:



In this second JPG, the firing vehicle has a green/open LOS to level ground on the other side of the house. If I fiddle with the placement of the vehicle, I can manipulate the LOS in all sorts of interesting ways, UNTIL the vehicle is well-clear of the structure, whereupon, geometry once again appears to reign the day. Thoughts?

PoE (aka ivanmoe)

[Andrew Williams]

no problem glad to be of help.

Your vehicle is parked alongside a window... no LOS impediment there see coding pic.




The walls or any object in Close Combat can be coded with certain characteristics.

Warning: Getting a bit Technical.

Columns Ab and Ac of the workbook refer to Line of Sight through objects including walls.

Walls are coded in Ab to block LOS

AC is a switch to turn off/on LOS through wall if you are adjacent (in CCMT this was turned off )

In WaR this is turned on so you can fire through a wall if adjacent ie right up next to the wall... two walls will Block LOS

this allows soldiers, in particular, to fire from buildings without having to find a window (which sometimes cause only 1,2 or 3 of a team to get LOS while the others mill about)

In the scenario you present the game engine must consider that your vehicle is close enough to be adjacent to the wall and gain LOS.

A slight change in the angle of fire brings into play the window or not and the distance the game engine considers is close enough to be adjacent.

You can see this by gaining LOS to certain points but not to others.

[Prince of Eckmühl]

ORIGINAL: Andrew Williams

no problem glad to be of help.

Your vehicle is parked alongside a window... no LOS impediment there see coding pic.

The walls or any object in Close Combat can be coded with certain characteristics.

Warning: Getting a bit Technical.

Columns Ab and Ac of the workbook refer to Line of Sight through objects including walls.

Walls are coded in Ab to block LOS

AC is a switch to turn off/on LOS through wall if you are adjacent (in CCMT this was turned off )

In WaR this is turned on so you can fire through a wall if adjacent ie right up next to the wall... two walls will Block LOS

this allows soldiers, in particular, to fire from buildings without having to find a window (which sometimes cause only 1,2 or 3 of a team to get LOS while the others mill about)

In the scenario you present the game engine must consider that your vehicle is close enough to be adjacent to the wall and gain LOS.

A slight change in the angle of fire brings into play the window or not and the distance the game engine considers is close enough to be adjacent.

You can see this by gaining LOS to certain points but not to others.

Well, there you go. I always suspected that it had something to do with the way that the buildings are coded. To the great unwashed, it can be difficult to discern a bug from a feature! [;)]

Thanks again,

PoE (aka ivanmoe)

[squadleader_id]

ORIGINAL: Neil N

Actually, Zon and AA_Gen_Jack did the vehicle graphics and I think that if you compare them side by side, VetBoB's tanks are a little larger

Oops...my mistake
As for VetBoB tanks...there's a smaller tanks submod where the tanks are smaller (about the same size as WAR I believe).

ORIGINAL: Reboot

JimRM2 did a few gems too

How could I forget JimRM2! From Afrika desert maps to Ardennes forests and villages...awesome!

[KG_Cooper]

ORIGINAL: Lützow

The AI seems to have improved as well. Since I don't own the original game anymore I can only judge by comparing to CC4 demo which I played some days ago. While the demo mission was a walkover, I got my ass handed at first campaign scenario already.

I am an old player from way way back (CC3 on the game zone) and decided to give this a go. I want to know what level you have the game set at? I played the first game and I walked over the AI.

The only issue so far is after moving from my town and capping the bridge the game ended and the next segment had me start on the US side of the map and the Americans were give my town?

Cheers

[Stwa]

ORIGINAL: squadleader_id

Nicely done S3T and Matrix!

- The new vehicle graphics rules (by Neil N. AKA Linebacker right?)...the new camo schemes and details look great. CC4: VetBoB (smaller tanks vetmod) looks great...but WAR's vehicle graphics looks just as good...if not better.

- The Opponent AI for single player games is surprisingly not bad...way better than the original CC4 (and CC5). Not as overkill as VetBoB (lethal weapons!)...which is good news to me. The AI still can't carry out a decent attack...it's aggressive but still dumb as the attacker (sending squads at VLs piece meal, no AFV-Infantry combined arms tactics). The AI controlled AFVs do seem to be more active moving...but sometimes just randomly...and sometimes driving straight into VLs (and easily destroyed using infantry AT weapons at point blank range).
The AI on defense is pretty tough...attacking will give experienced players a good challenge. I like how the AI aggressively counter-attacks after losing VLs. AI Infantry hiding inside buildings are also especially tough to supress and destroy. The AI still doesn't setup properly, and sometimes break cover to manouver without good reason.

- Yup, the Soldier AI is more prone to ducking under fire and aborting movement...but in WAR it's not as annoying as the "girlie soldiers" in CoI and CCMT...phew! A few more clicks are needed to reissue lost orders...but I find it managable

- The new maps are awesome...SouthernLand outdid himself again...as always!

- The weapon sounds are crisp, realistic and well done, the command and death sounds are a bit generic...a lot of CC5 mods feature more 'brutal' command and death sounds . Still some minor bugs in the sounds (English spoken line when US request truce while playing as Germans - speaking Germans).

- Weapons artwork on the interface looks great...too bad the interface is still locked (with black borders) and not fully stretchable so you can't really see the weapons graphics up close. The guns/cannon graphics is done in 'traditional CC style'...personally I prefer gun graphics from mods like VetBoB, Utah, GJS-TRSM...close up and showing the Nozzle Break graphics.

- Great work on fixing the rank graphics bug in the Tactical Map interface...now they show Heer, SS and FJ ranks correctly (this feature was broken in CC4-CC5, only displaying one type of ranks).

- The Waffen-SS tank crews coded and displayed using Heer ranks need to be fixed in the next patch.
Also Panzerwaffe fans might nitpick about the Panzer crew uniforms...Assault Guns crews should be wearing Gray, not Black.
Waffen-SS Panzer crews also wore camo, besides panzer crew black. Maybe panzer fans can add to this?

- Vehicle pathing is much better...but sometimes tanks still turn in circles or do random about turns instead of reversing smoothly. The AI controlled tanks are a lot more active, compared to the campers in CC4-CC5.

- The interface screen expanded from locked 800x600 is welcome...why not make it strechable to full screen

- The new text files for modding is a great idea...but modders need tutorials to edit these. The WAR workbook looks great too...good work, Guys!

- Nice features, well polished and very playable out of the box...looks like I'll be busy with this one for quite a while

Probably because WaR is really just CC5 (including some of the graphics)? But the developers have finally starting moving game modifyable values to the outside of the program. [:)]

Also regarding stretching the menus, I am not sure about that. Perhaps they can produce a situation that eveyone would like.

See attachment for what the game (CC4 on CC5) might look like stretched to 1360 x 768. Do you like that? I kinda do, but I have learned to live with it.

[Tejszd]

had me start on the US side of the map and the Americans were give my town?

Sounds like you took too many casualties and your morale broke awarding the other side the town VL.

As for the game settings the AI should be set as Recruit and you Elite. These settings will change the quality and number of squads/vehicles available. Short term in the GC it might not make a bug difference but later as you start to run out of your best units it will get tougher to hold the maps you have….

[KG_Cooper]

Interesting - I did not take note of my casualities. I guess what had me ???? was the fact we basically switchhed sides. On well.

I am planning on doing the GC and really get a feel for things... and try to get a few og my old KG friends playing this game again as we used to be a known clan 10 years ago... I guess we should join OMO if they are still around lol.

[squadleader_id]

ORIGINAL: Stwa


Probably because WaR is really just CC5 (including some of the graphics)? But the developers have finally starting moving game modifyable values to the outside of the program. [:)]

Also regarding stretching the menus, I am not sure about that. Perhaps they can produce a situation that eveyone would like.

See attachment for what the game (CC4 on CC5) might look like stretched to 1360 x 768. Do you like that? I kinda do, but I have learned to live with it.

Yeah...AFAIK WAR is based on a revamped CC5 engine.
As for the interface/menu stretching...maybe include an option to either have it stretched or locked with black box...that way the player can choose based on his preference. At 1280x1024 the menu still looks great. As for widescreen displays...graphic card drivers have setting to display screens stretched or locked aspect (with black borders on the left and right).
I'm glad that it's not locked at 800x600 like CoI and CCMT though...

[Noakesy]

Wonder if anyone can help me - this looks an interesting game, but feedback I've had (on the series, not this game) is that the AI isn't up to much, and playing H2H is a drag as you need to find an opponent basically with time to play the game at the same time as me (I mostly play PBEM and that's much easier).

I've a couple of questions:
1. We have two PCs at home, networked, can I play against my son on the other pc (for example) or does each PC have to have the disc in it to play?
2. If our pcs are networked is this a problem? I've been told it can be difficult (something to do with IP addresses and wifi set up), any advice would be warmly welcomed (and might actually prompt me to buy this).

Cheers[:)]

[Prince of Eckmühl]

ORIGINAL: Noakesy

2. If our pcs are networked is this a problem? I've been told it can be difficult (something to do with IP addresses and wifi set up), any advice would be warmly welcomed (and might actually prompt me to buy this).

Should be no problem, whatsoever. You'll be using the internal IP addys for your network, which ought to read 192.168.x.x when you run IPCONFIG from a command prompt. Open the game, put in the host IP on your network, and you're good to go.

PoE (aka ivanmoe)

[killroyishere]

but still seeing numerous instances of defending AI units deciding it's a better life choice to break cover and head for the enemy.

This is a big problem in the Battlefront Combat Mission series as well. I do not understand why developers cannot program the AI to know when it is ahead or winning and not do such silliness.