Use of Axis navy - need advice from PBEMers

[jjdenver]

Hi,

Can some of the guys who've played PBEM chip in w/ some advice/thoughts on how to use the Italian and German navies? Please consider 2 scenarios:

scenario 1: Germany passive at sea, not willing to invest much. Italy passive at sea, not willing to invest much. Both want to use their navies to disrupt allies at critical times such as after an invasion. Italy may push in Egypt but wants to do it economically.

scenario 2: Germany aggressive at sea - seeks naval dominance to invade UK and disrupt US operations. Italy aggressive at sea - seeks complete dominance of the med. Both countries willing to invest production to buy new naval units.

So - considering those scenarios can you give some thoughts? For example under scenario 1 should Germany leave raiders in the Atlantic? Should Germany send out subs in a fleet or subs as raiders in single sub fleets? Should Italy try to transport convoys through east med to Tobruk?

For scenario 2 should Italian subs be deployed in large fleets or single raiders? Should Italy try to send supply convoy thru east med and position a fleet in east med? Should Germany navy be deployed entirely as large fleets or also as raiders?

Thanks - I'm inexperienced w/ the game in general but naval warfare in particular seems a mystery.

Also any thoughts about how to operate w/ the Italians in Egypt would be welcome. I'm not sure whether to pay the price to try to protect convoys through Tobruk or not.

Another random question. It seems like purchase of ATP and STP goes up as you buy more but does it go down again after a few turns? or is it permanently raised?

[gwgardner]

I can't answer most of those questions, because I'm still stumbling around with exactly the same questions as you. However, I have learned a couple of things:

Check some past threads on the transport of and supply of Italian and German troops in N. Africa. In my experience supply of such troops is not that difficult even with enemy raiders active. You occasionally get a supply loss due to Malta being in enemy hands.

Take a look at the naval documentation. The carrier and sub advantage in first strike is important, I think. So you have to carefully consider purchases of new ships. Spotting capability is also important, and I'd guess plays a factor in which ships from a fleet actually get to take part in a naval battle.

If you can take Gibraltar, you may be lucky and isolate part of the British fleet in the Med. You can then also place German, Spanish, and Italian navies in the same sea zone, thus gaining at least temporary dominance.

[Chocolino]

Can some of the guys who've played PBEM chip in w/ some advice/thoughts on how to use the Italian and German navies?

I also have very little experience with the German fleet. But here are my thoughts: Given the German tech disadvantage in Warships, trying to keep up with the RN is very costly. Your PP buy a ship that is inferior to a British ship of the same cost. And you start with fewer ships. It is different with subs. So maybe this is the way to go. I have still to try it.

Also any thoughts about how to operate w/ the Italians in Egypt would be welcome. I'm not sure whether to pay the price to try to protect convoys through Tobruk or not.

With the majority of the RN in the Med, supply problems can be severe and put the Italians in North Africa in further peril as they are anyways because of their lower tech. It may be required to have German troops in the desert from the start to hold. Try to take Malta as soon as you can as well.

Another random question. It seems like purchase of ATP and STP goes up as you buy more but does it go down again after a few turns? or is it permanently raised?

If I understand correctly, the prices reset at the start of a new month. So the cost increase is there only if you buy a lot at once. Mark Dubost posted a very useful naval guide in the "War Room".

Good luck in your game. I will follow it in the AAR.

[Mike Dubost]

ORIGINAL: jjdenver

Hi,

Can some of the guys who've played PBEM chip in w/ some advice/thoughts on how to use the Italian and German navies? Please consider 2 scenarios:

scenario 1: Germany passive at sea, not willing to invest much. Italy passive at sea, not willing to invest much. Both want to use their navies to disrupt allies at critical times such as after an invasion. Italy may push in Egypt but wants to do it economically.

scenario 2: Germany aggressive at sea - seeks naval dominance to invade UK and disrupt US operations. Italy aggressive at sea - seeks complete dominance of the med. Both countries willing to invest production to buy new naval units.

So - considering those scenarios can you give some thoughts? For example under scenario 1 should Germany leave raiders in the Atlantic? Should Germany send out subs in a fleet or subs as raiders in single sub fleets? Should Italy try to transport convoys through east med to Tobruk?

For scenario 2 should Italian subs be deployed in large fleets or single raiders? Should Italy try to send supply convoy thru east med and position a fleet in east med? Should Germany navy be deployed entirely as large fleets or also as raiders?

Thanks - I'm inexperienced w/ the game in general but naval warfare in particular seems a mystery.

Also any thoughts about how to operate w/ the Italians in Egypt would be welcome. I'm not sure whether to pay the price to try to protect convoys through Tobruk or not.

Another random question. It seems like purchase of ATP and STP goes up as you buy more but does it go down again after a few turns? or is it permanently raised?

My experience has been against the AI, but for what it is worth, it has convinced me that withdrawing the raiders is better. I prefer to maintain a fleet in being while I pump some R&D into it and then come out later for specific missions, especially trying to cut the Lend-Lease convoy lines. Of course, different people will weigh the risks or benefits differently.

As for your question about buying points, please do check the War Room for my ensign's guide. The short version is that the price only goes down when you use up the points (or lose them due to combat losses). The last chapter of the guide mentions some ways to maximize your return on investment by choosing the times to buy more points.

[jjdenver]

Hey I read the guide. Very helpful. The STP section was crystal clear. The ATP section not as clear but still overall very helpful.

Thanks!

[Mike Dubost]

Do you have any suggestions for how to improve the section on AIPs? If you tell me what you are least clear about, I will try to clarify here and edit the guide appropriately. I want to maximize its usefullness.

[jjdenver]

ORIGINAL: Mike Dubost

Do you have any suggestions for how to improve the section on AIPs? If you tell me what you are least clear about, I will try to clarify here and edit the guide appropriately. I want to maximize its usefullness.

The AIP portion was hard to understand. Perhaps an example using AIP would be good. So let's say that I buy 4 AIP points. Now I load 2 units reducing my AIP to 0, but leaving the value Y you refer to at 4....etc.etc...I'm not sure I really understand it enough to continue the example.

[Mike Dubost]

ORIGINAL: jjdenver

ORIGINAL: Mike Dubost

Do you have any suggestions for how to improve the section on AIPs? If you tell me what you are least clear about, I will try to clarify here and edit the guide appropriately. I want to maximize its usefullness.

The AIP portion was hard to understand. Perhaps an example using AIP would be good. So let's say that I buy 4 AIP points. Now I load 2 units reducing my AIP to 0, but leaving the value Y you refer to at 4....etc.etc...I'm not sure I really understand it enough to continue the example.

OK. I see the confusion.

The AIPs show unused and "total". I put the "total" in quotes because of what follows.

If you start with 0 and buy 4, then the display shows 4(4) after the buy is complete, and will continue to show this value until you start embarking units or you buy more points. For the purposes of the example, I assume that you do not buy more points.

You then embark enough units (I think 2 infantry corps would be right) to use up all 4 points. The display now shows 0(4).

It will continue to show this value for as long as the units remain aboard the amphibious transports.

You then use the units to invade. The display now continues to show 0(4) until the end of the month. At that time, it changes to 0(0). The key point is that it does not immediately reflect the change, unlike STPs.

Is this example good enough to clear up the guide's rough spot? If so, I will add it to my revisions list along with the information requested in other threads.

[jjdenver]

Hi,

I think it's pretty clear. But I just want to be sure I understand. AIP don't ever come back - just go to 0. STP come back after you use them along w/ strategic transfer land points which also come back?

Thx

[Mike Dubost]

ORIGINAL: jjdenver

Hi,

I think it's pretty clear. But I just want to be sure I understand. AIP don't ever come back - just go to 0. STP come back after you use them along w/ strategic transfer land points which also come back?

Thx

Yep, you are indeed correct. The STPs and SMPs come back but AIPs are one-shot.