Battles Need A Lot Of Work A lot

[malkuth74]

Sorry I really do enjoy this game other then wars. when it comes to wars the game is just broken. When your empire gets so big you have no choice but to have you AI control this aspect for you your fleets your ships. I mean 400 ships is a lot to micromanage.

The problem is that you Attack AI does not take fuel into consideration. So when it launches an attack and ask you is it ok and you say yes. The distances are so far apart that by the time they get too the target they are out of gas and helpless.

To remedy this either you need to rework the Fuel situation, by not having it run out so quick. Its a nice idea and all to have fuel. But I think the whole process is killing every AI in the game not just yours.

And if you set up fuel depos with the Supply ship, it just stays for awhile and then leaves... You guessed it fuel issues. Why does a Fuel ship that is making fuel need to leave to refuel? It has all the fuel it wants!

The game is huge in scope and we need lots of the Auto stuff just to run it. But the fuel system in general breaks the game totally. With large distances involved its a huge issue. And you can play a game and you will see that nothing happens in wars because of the fuel issues. You can have empires at war with each other for 40 years and they never gain much ground against each other. Then when you finally go to war its so confusing and messed up that its impossible to fight one.

And without the ability to have wars, the game becomes very dull. Its fun and all to build up your empire. But in the end you get stuck being the largest baddass in the galaxy. But because you can't fight a war correctly you can't do anything.

Try another game and see what happens. But this is my 4th game and they always end the same. Don't want to go to war because I can't fight them because we always run out of fuel. All the time.

Another problem is if you do manage you fleets and fuel them up and have them sit still. They still use fuel. The problem is by the time you need them they are totally out of fuel again. They should not use fuel when they are sitting idle, none. And it does not matter if its you controlling the fleet or the AI. The AI controlled fleets run out too.

Sword of the stars did the fuel situation right. You need fuel for ships, but the fuelers travel with your fleet. And everytime they go to a colony they refuel automatically. And when they sit around the colony they don't use fuel.

If you want a fuel system I suggest maybe thinking of using that system instead or similar. It works and it does not bog the player down with fuel issues like it is now in this game.

[ASHBERY76]

The game needs an auto refuel option for fleet and ships you control.l also think when you set ships to patrol your planets and stations it should auto refuel on the fly.

[Tormodino]

Yeah. This is an essential issue.
Never knowing if your fleets are fueled or not ruins plans and breaks some of the immersion that comes with the AI control.

[lordxorn]

I totally agree. The Auto-Fuel idea and when you have a fleet selected, in the selection screen on the bottom left a refuel fleet option should be there, and refit.

Although Malkuth Ihave not had a problem with a resupply ship refueling itself once deployed on a "Gas Giant".
The problem I had was that it would un-deploy itself for no reason.

[bssybeep]

Is there an option to turn off fuel usage? This seems like a major pita to gameplay. You would think in the far future starships would use renewable power sources instead of having to pull into the nearest interstellar Shell station every few million miles.[:D]

[Jim D Burns]

ORIGINAL: lordxorn
I totally agree. The Auto-Fuel idea and when you have a fleet selected, in the selection screen on the bottom left a refuel fleet option should be there, and refit.

Agreed, but add a check box so you can order your ships to not refuel in another empire's territory. Nothing worse than sending a fleet off to refuel closest only to find it ruining diplomatic ties you've painstakingly inched up over the years all because you forgot to check the system it went to when you made the order.

Jim

[PDiFolco]

I agree refuelling is problematic.. Adding a resupply ship helps as long asit is full, but then the issue comes back...
What I'd suggest is that Resupply ship could be given mission to resupply fleet/ship X, thus allowing "in flight refuelling". The AI could manage this and send the RS ships to the needing fleet, then go back to deploy to refuel itself. The whole idea of going back to bases to refuel is screwy.
Oh, an idea just struck me : is it possible to just add fuel-mining modules to ships so they can refuel themselves ? [:'(]

[ASHBERY76]

Are you actually deploying resupply ships at a gas worlds? They are not ment to be in fleets or flying around.

[HsojVvad]

Yes the refueling can break the game, but let me get this right. You can't fight a war because you run out of gas? So why don't you make fuel depots or gas stations when you fight the war? By this, you don't see Americans coming back to the USA to refuel, they have gas stations close by. So if you want to make a war, why aren't you basing your fleet? There are plenty of stars around so make gassing stations or gas bases what ever they are called so your fleet can refuel there.

I can see if the AI dosn't use this, but you as a humans should be doing this. So I don't really see what you are talking about. You have to plan ahead, make fueling stations on the way. I thought that was part of the strategy in gaming.

Also, I find it funny people complaining about too many ships and planets to mangage. First there isn't enough planets or stars, now we can have up to 1000 of stars and way more planets and now there is too much automation? You can't have both. You either have a few planets that a normal perosn can handle without going crazy or you have 1000s with automation.

[malkuth74]

I do deploy the resupply ships davor. The problem is that when you use Auto AI for invasion they don't use them at all. They will attack a enemy planet half way across the universe and by the time they get there they are out of gas and helpless.

Also when you do lay down a resupply ship it should stay and do its job (auto off) but it does not stay it undeploys and runs out of gas. Which makes them useless.

Ships should not use fuel when they are IDLE. That problem by itself breaks the game in its own right. Add in the AI sending ships to places they should not go really break the war aspect.

When you get a large empire with 500 ships or so it becomes impossible to deal with the fuel issue.

[HsojVvad]

Ah, so your plobem is not fuel in general but the AI not refueling the ships. I get it. So I hope that CF will work on the AI for this, since alot of people are complaining about automated ships not refueling when needed.

[ASHBERY76]

Decreasing fuel consumption for ships x8 is most likely needed,so the game flow is not ruined by so much micromanaging.

[OberonDark]

The problem isn't so much the mechanics as it is the way the AI does things, such as actually setting up/using refueling stations properly. But I agree, fuel consumption needs to go down a bit.

[Erik Rutins]

Hm, I've seen wars working very well, with multiple systems changing hands and decisive outcomes galore. I've also seem both AI controlled and manually controlled fleets launching strikes with plenty of fuel and resupply ships setup in strategic places. I accept that there is an issue in some of the interactions here, but I have not seen it as being as serious as the original poster described. What experience are the rest of you having so far?

[Andy Mac]

I find it doable but a pain so not as bad as the original poster.
 
You cannot rely on the AI for fleet level actions but then I dont think you should.
 
So for me its ok but the lack of fuel is a pain

[Willburn]

I find it a big problem. First if I create a fleet usually its disbanded after a while, and if I manage to send it somewhere most of the fleet is usually out of fuel before it reaches the intended pirates it will counter.

[Erik Rutins]

If you have manual control over the fleet, it should not be disbanded, that should only happen if the fleet formation is automated as well.

Are you using resupply ships with your fleets? I'm able to launch some pretty deep strikes without a problem when using resupply. One thing about DW though is that it is supposed to be hard to send your fleet across the galaxy and support it. It's easy to defend your own area, harder to plan and support an attack elsewhere.

[malkuth74]

I have 4 games in so far and other then a few close worlds changing hands (IE they are right next to each other so fuel is not so much of an issue) I have not seen 1 empire lose yet. Usually they battle over the same worlds over and over it seems.

Like I said going to try another game but I don't see the fuel issue being any different. And this was only a 400 star game. With 5 empires.

Maybe thats the problem, I don't have enough empires going so we all get way to big a bloated. I will try a map with a lot more empires and see what happens.

So are you saying we should have resupply ships in the actual fleet? I was under the impression that they only work when deployed in a Gas cloud with the + mark. What good is having them in the fleet if they can't deploy? Do they have some sort of refuel option inside them that maybe im missing?

Also if this is the case, then the AI does not build them into your fleets or theirs.

[Gertjan]

I like the concept. But I guess I still need to learn how to use the resupply ships properly. I will give it another try before complaining here.

[PDiFolco]

ORIGINAL: malkuth74

I have 4 games in so far and other then a few close worlds changing hands (IE they are right next to each other so fuel is not so much of an issue) I have not seen 1 empire lose yet. Usually they battle over the same worlds over and over it seems.

Like I said going to try another game but I don't see the fuel issue being any different. And this was only a 400 star game. With 5 empires.

Maybe thats the problem, I don't have enough empires going so we all get way to big a bloated. I will try a map with a lot more empires and see what happens.

So are you saying we should have resupply ships in the actual fleet? I was under the impression that they only work when deployed in a Gas cloud with the + mark. What good is having them in the fleet if they can't deploy? Do they have some sort of refuel option inside them that maybe im missing?

Also if this is the case, then the AI does not build them into your fleets or theirs.

I started deploying a RS ship at a gas giant, but then I couldn't get any ship to resupply at this ship... Thus I put the RS ship into the fleet and *it seemed to me* that it shared its fuel with the other ships, extending their range. Maybe I misunderstood how it's supposed to work..