Fleet Refueling Why So Slow?

[ceyan]

ORIGINAL: licker

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins
If it's just a matter of a large fleet taking time before all of them rotate through the available docking ports to refuel, that's part of the design.

As Christopher Hitchens is wont to say... "Some design, ehh?"

Ok, to the point, yes, it is realistic. But, is it fun?

My answer is no, it's annoying.

That is a bit ridiculous. Do you also have problems with the other limitations on the game? How can you even keep playing if you don't like the fact that you need a free construction yard (forgot the actual component name) in order to build a ship?

And either way, you're making it out to be more complicated than it is (or at least it seems like it). All you need is to base your fleets where you've got large space stations or many individual refueling areas. Now, granted, once you take automation out of the picture, that changes a bit, but that isn't what this is about. Complaining about this particular aspect is like complaining about having to have resources to build ships.

[forsaken1111]

I have no problem with ships taking time to refuel, I have issue with the way the AI handles said fueling.

Erik, how is resource distribution handled? Are gas levels evened out over the entire empire? If so, this would mean that building more spaceports is a bad idea unless you have the fuel sources to keep them up. I'd appreciate a way to designate certain bases as refueling depots or similar, so they know to order more gas and keep a higher level of fuel available.

[licker]

ORIGINAL: ceyan

ORIGINAL: licker

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins
If it's just a matter of a large fleet taking time before all of them rotate through the available docking ports to refuel, that's part of the design.

As Christopher Hitchens is wont to say... "Some design, ehh?"

Ok, to the point, yes, it is realistic. But, is it fun?

My answer is no, it's annoying.

That is a bit ridiculous. Do you also have problems with the other limitations on the game? How can you even keep playing if you don't like the fact that you need a free construction yard (forgot the actual component name) in order to build a ship?

And either way, you're making it out to be more complicated than it is (or at least it seems like it). All you need is to base your fleets where you've got large space stations or many individual refueling areas. Now, granted, once you take automation out of the picture, that changes a bit, but that isn't what this is about. Complaining about this particular aspect is like complaining about having to have resources to build ships.

Wow.

I say something is annoying to me and you jump to 'how can you even play the game'.

Defensive much?

This game has some issues, no one is denying that, but no one is saying anything is a game breaker either. Chill out and consider that certain elements which don't add anything to the overall game experience are probably not the best kinds of elements to bother defending. Ship building is another area of unnecessary frustration and complication.

It appears that suggestions to improve the UI on that screen are being considered, but apparently those people requesting it should 'stop playing' because it's possible to build ships anyway.

[Tanaka]

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins

Regarding ships taking a long time to refuel, if they are simply not refueling your local fuel stocks may have run out, you can check this by double-clicking on the base or resupply ship and looking at its cargo. If it's just a matter of a large fleet taking time before all of them rotate through the available docking ports to refuel, that's part of the design.

Some good suggestions here though and in general we do want to make managing refueling and fleets easier for all players.

Thanks Erik yep thats what they are doing rotating in and out. Now that I know its part of the design that helps. Are there any tips that I can do to make this faster in the game?

[licker]

ORIGINAL: Tanaka

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins

Regarding ships taking a long time to refuel, if they are simply not refueling your local fuel stocks may have run out, you can check this by double-clicking on the base or resupply ship and looking at its cargo. If it's just a matter of a large fleet taking time before all of them rotate through the available docking ports to refuel, that's part of the design.

Some good suggestions here though and in general we do want to make managing refueling and fleets easier for all players.

Thanks Erik yep thats what they are doing rotating in and out. Now that I know its part of the design that helps. Are there any tips that I can do to make this faster in the game?

Press the '=' key until you see the speed running at 4x...

Assuming you don't upgrade your docking bays or just build more of them.

[forsaken1111]

Yep, more docking bays will allow more ships at once to dock and fuel. Higher tech docking bays will allow fuel to flow faster.

[Mark Weston]

ORIGINAL: licker

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins
If it's just a matter of a large fleet taking time before all of them rotate through the available docking ports to refuel, that's part of the design.

As Christopher Hitchens is wont to say... "Some design, ehh?"

Ok, to the point, yes, it is realistic. But, is it fun?

My answer is no, it's annoying.

I disagree. I think logistical limitations make for a more challenging and interesting game. I want something more than "right-click on target, wait for pretty explosions."

[Wade1000]

-A very large fuel tanker/tender ship that has certain components allowing it to fuel/repair far deployed ships would be good. It could act like a freighter by carrying fuel from based resupply ships and bases to far deployed ships and repair them via components such as those in resupply ships and construction ships.
 
-Also, a later high technology component like a reactor/generator that elimates the need to refuel. It could be very large and only fit on lareg ships, including tankers/tenders and bases but it gets smaller with further research.

[forsaken1111]

I would also be quite happy letting civilians tender my fleet, provided they could keep up. It would be nice if civilians could grow to fill any niche that comes up, such as fueling concerns when large wars become common or big fleet actions start happening. They would buy fuel at the starbase/spaceport, fly out to your ships, you would buy their fuel at a slightly higher price. They would make some money, and you'd tax both transactions of course.

[marc420]

When you can prove to me that the President of the united states personally goes down to the warf and makes sure that every individual ship is fueled. Then I will believe you story. what your saying is true. The problem is that You IE the president of your Star Empire does not personally oversee this part of the battle. He says go to this place... The admirals and fleet logistics people handle the supplies and the fueling not the president. IE YOU!

Welcome to the faulty logic at the core of any RTS game.

Its the same faulty logic that says your scout ship is going to sit stopped at a planet because you, the grand admiral and the only person who can control things is currently watching the space battle against the pirates in another system.

RTS works nice for tactical situations. It breaks down the higher up above tactical that you go. And it breaks down for this reason that a organization of millions of people with a command and control organization and staff can actually mange to have the scout ship heading to the next correct planet to scout and keep track of the battle against the pirates in the other system all at the same time while a player in front of a computer screen can not.

[marc420]

I would also be quite happy letting civilians tender my fleet, provided they could keep up. It would be nice if civilians could grow to fill any niche that comes up, such as fueling concerns when large wars become common or big fleet actions start happening. They would buy fuel at the starbase/spaceport, fly out to your ships, you would buy their fuel at a slightly higher price. They would make some money, and you'd tax both transactions of course.

...'at a slightly higher price'

Ah, a novice entering the world of military procurement! Expect about a 500% markup at least. Especially if you actually want the fuel there when you really need it. If you as a measly grand admiral try to object, they'll point to the el Presidente's brother who is now an officer in their company and let you know there's nothing you can do but pay what they call the 'slightly higher prices.'

[Fishman]

Part of why refuelling is such a pain is because unless you are refuelling only a small number of ships or have a very large port where all the docking bays are free of commercial traffic clogging it up, SOME of your ships will refuel, and then when they are done, they will detach from the port, and begin burning their fuel sitting in space while the rest of the fleet refuels. By the time everyone has refuelled, half the ships will be nearly out of fuel again.

The solution to this is to give ships larger fuel tanks, and energy collectors so they don't burn fuel while parked. The stock designs have horribly anemic fuel tanks.

[Igard]

I mentioned this on the wishlist. When a ship is patrolling a planet, it's basically in orbit. This means that the ship should not use nearly as much fuel as the planets gravity should provide the ship with forward motion.

I'm no astrophysicist but I think 'parking' the ship somewhere in the star system should burn more fuel since the ship is having to hold stationary. It's working against the gravity of the star and the planets.

OK it's a bit of a nit pick, but I find it easier to set my fleets to patrol a star/planet (which they do anyway while automated) rather than sit at an exact position where they are no use.