Once Again into the Breach - Mike (J) vs. tc464 (A)

[Xargun]

ORIGINAL: PaxMondo
Currently I skip the Helen I as I do not like to lose that one hex of range compared to the Sally. I upgrade from Sally to Helen II.

I do the same. I do not build any Lily - but I use them up as I upgrade them into Sallies. I build Sallies until my production of Helens can support my upgrades and losses. Sallies should make decent Kamaikazes.

Xargun

[Mike Solli]

Lots to think about IJA 2e bombers. I think I'm going to let the Lily produce (but no increase to the factory) for a bit, probably the rest of the month. That's just to replace some of the 1E bombers in 3 Air Division. My final production will most likely be some Sally-Helen combination. I'm thinking 40-80. I'll ponder it a bit more and look at stats some more.

Anyway, I am pretty sure I'll have my windows issues worked out today. Here's our house rules:

No industry bombing by either side in China. (I'm thinking of possibly increasing HI here.)
Pay PPs for restricted units crossing borders. (This is mainly India-Burma, China-Burma and Manchuoko-China.)
Akyab is considered a part of India.

Scenario 1
Beta
PDU on

[USSAmerica]

Mike, are you guys going to try to keep up to date with the "latest" versions of the beta as they are released?  

[Mike Solli]

Yup, that's the plan, Mike.

[obvert]

Lots to think about IJA 2e bombers. I think I'm going to let the Lily produce (but no increase to the factory) for a bit, probably the rest of the month. That's just to replace some of the 1E bombers in 3 Air Division. My final production will most likely be some Sally-Helen combination. I'm thinking 40-80. I'll ponder it a bit more and look at stats some more.

Mike, are you guys going to try to keep up to date with the "latest" versions of the beta as they are released?

_____________________________

Mike

Yup, that's the plan, Mike.

One other thing, now that I'm a week into my new game using a recent beta update, is that paying 75 PP for each upgrade from 1E to 2 E is a bitch. I'm having to decide between air in China and Burma and engineers for the Pacific using my PPs. It's thin right now, and I've only just changed a few terrible commanders out, but I'll have to get a lot more switched soon before major operations get rolling.

[Mike Solli]

75 PP for 1E to 2E. Hmm, maybe I'll keep the 1E for awhile. I usually do. I really don't mind the Ki-30 and Ki-32, as long as there aren't any enemy fighters around.

[PaxMondo]

Mike: Agreed, plus they (1E bombers) will operate out of really small fields which is what you have in China to start with.

Thinking about that 75PP, I think that is another nail in the Lily coffin for me. PP's are so hard to come by until mid-42 for me, it means the conversion to 2E will be even slower which means I really won't need those Lily's much at all and can wait until I have the Sally's to convert ... just my thoughts here ...

[Mike Solli]

Pax, very good advice, as always. The Lily is looking less and less likely to be built. I agree that PPs are rare for the first 6 months or so. Those 1E bombers may have to last longer than I thought.

I'm making headway with the windows in the mac thing, but still not there completely. Back at it....

[Cpt Sherwood]

You need to look, there are some 1E bombers that will upgrade to Lily for no PPs. They can then be switched to the Sally for no PPs also. It is how there upgrade path is defined in the editor.

[1EyedJacks]

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli

Thanks Paul. I'm looking forward to getting back into AE as well. It's been since January since I played.

Pax, you too?! Seems like all you guys are interested in hauling overland from Singapore to Fusan! What do you think? Is it gamey or not? Convince me to try it!

I don't think it's gamey. Rails and roads are there for a reason. Having said that - I'm not sure an overland route would achieve your desired goals...

Pg249
Supplies are stockpiled at bases. Supplies are created via the production system and can also come into the game at bases that are assigned a daily allotment. From there they can be distributed to satellite bases in a variety of ways already described; via air transport, by ships in TFs, submarines with transport Missions, and overland. A base may transfer supplies, oil, and resources to an adjacent base regardless of the terrain the separates the two hexes (allows
inland sea movement of resources and oil).

The whole push/pull supply process is there to keep bases and troops properly supplied. All bases along your overland route will be supplied. This is no different than the silk route or any other trade route in history. If there is a need to go overland due to enemy forces attacking your shipping then you do it. If it is significantly cheaper and safer to go overland then you do it.

Pg 209
Bases also can contain stockpiles of supplies, fuel, resources and oil (resources and oil only when production is on). Fuel stockpiles are used to refuel ships, while supply stockpiles are used to maintain aircraft, resupply ground units, and replenish naval ammunition. Each day, supplies from a base’s stockpile are distributed to ground units in the same hex as needed. Supply, fuel, resources, and oil stockpiles will also be moved automatically from bases overland to restock other bases or ground units that are running low on these items if the two bases (or ground unit) are linked by a valid supply path. When these items are automatically moved to another hex, some of the items are expended during the transfer (never more than 20% will be expended). [X(]

As I read this though, while your overland supply route from Hong Kong to Shanghai or Fusan might work, it appears that on a long journey you'd see very little at the end of the line... This also makes me wonder if it's better to run oil/fuel directly to some bases in Japan rather then dumping consumables off at bases on the western end of Japan and letting the overland system "move" consumables to where they are needed. Section 9.3.3.3 that starts on page 212 looks to give "free" transfer of oil/Resources/fuel/supplies between adjacent friendly ports (meaning nothing expended/lost during the transfer process).

I think you should try the overland trade route out and we can all learn from your experience... [:D]

Seriously - this was a good read for me as it has me rethinking how I want to move my resources and oil... Things that make me go hmmmmm.

TTFN,

Mike

[n01487477]

ORIGINAL: Cpt Sherwood

You need to look, there are some 1E bombers that will upgrade to Lily for no PPs. They can then be switched to the Sally for no PPs also. It is how there upgrade path is defined in the editor.

Upgrade defined...



Otherwise the PP discussion is interesting with the new beta dynamic.

[PaxMondo]

ORIGINAL: Cpt Sherwood

You need to look, there are some 1E bombers that will upgrade to Lily for no PPs. They can then be switched to the Sally for no PPs also. It is how there upgrade path is defined in the editor.

Yep. Damian's post gives details. Still, a number of them do not. And still, there is the fact that I do not have a use for them after March 42 ....

[jrcar]

Can I suggest:
No night bombing. (although the latest beta looks a bit better)

Restrict aircraft height for CAP and sweeps.

Cheers

Rob

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli

Lots to think about IJA 2e bombers. I think I'm going to let the Lily produce (but no increase to the factory) for a bit, probably the rest of the month. That's just to replace some of the 1E bombers in 3 Air Division. My final production will most likely be some Sally-Helen combination. I'm thinking 40-80. I'll ponder it a bit more and look at stats some more.

Anyway, I am pretty sure I'll have my windows issues worked out today. Here's our house rules:

No industry bombing by either side in China. (I'm thinking of possibly increasing HI here.)
Pay PPs for restricted units crossing borders. (This is mainly India-Burma, China-Burma and Manchuoko-China.)
Akyab is considered a part of India.

Scenario 1
Beta
PDU on

[PaxMondo]

ORIGINAL: 1EyedJacks

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli

Thanks Paul. I'm looking forward to getting back into AE as well. It's been since January since I played.

Pax, you too?! Seems like all you guys are interested in hauling overland from Singapore to Fusan! What do you think? Is it gamey or not? Convince me to try it!

I don't think it's gamey. Rails and roads are there for a reason. Having said that - I'm not sure an overland route would achieve your desired goals...

Pg249
Supplies are stockpiled at bases. Supplies are created via the production system and can also come into the game at bases that are assigned a daily allotment. From there they can be distributed to satellite bases in a variety of ways already described; via air transport, by ships in TFs, submarines with transport Missions, and overland. A base may transfer supplies, oil, and resources to an adjacent base regardless of the terrain the separates the two hexes (allows
inland sea movement of resources and oil).

The whole push/pull supply process is there to keep bases and troops properly supplied. All bases along your overland route will be supplied. This is no different than the silk route or any other trade route in history. If there is a need to go overland due to enemy forces attacking your shipping then you do it. If it is significantly cheaper and safer to go overland then you do it.

Pg 209
Bases also can contain stockpiles of supplies, fuel, resources and oil (resources and oil only when production is on). Fuel stockpiles are used to refuel ships, while supply stockpiles are used to maintain aircraft, resupply ground units, and replenish naval ammunition. Each day, supplies from a base’s stockpile are distributed to ground units in the same hex as needed. Supply, fuel, resources, and oil stockpiles will also be moved automatically from bases overland to restock other bases or ground units that are running low on these items if the two bases (or ground unit) are linked by a valid supply path. When these items are automatically moved to another hex, some of the items are expended during the transfer (never more than 20% will be expended). [X(]

As I read this though, while your overland supply route from Hong Kong to Shanghai or Fusan might work, it appears that on a long journey you'd see very little at the end of the line... This also makes me wonder if it's better to run oil/fuel directly to some bases in Japan rather then dumping consumables off at bases on the western end of Japan and letting the overland system "move" consumables to where they are needed. Section 9.3.3.3 that starts on page 212 looks to give "free" transfer of oil/Resources/fuel/supplies between adjacent friendly ports (meaning nothing expended/lost during the transfer process).

I think you should try the overland trade route out and we can all learn from your experience... [:D]

Seriously - this was a good read for me as it has me rethinking how I want to move my resources and oil... Things that make me go hmmmmm.

TTFN,

Mike

In another thread some time back I discussed this.

I've had a Mark 1 eyeball on over 90% of this route back "in the day" ... yep all the way from Singers to Fusan. Just a few places I haven't actually seen (as in traveled upon). At the time, it was still almost exactly like it was from the war. The map actually has a number of breaks in the RR for game balance (China particularly, separating occupied and unoccupied China), IRL they are and were joined.

Sure, in some places the road is pretty ratty, but a 6 ton truck would make it easy. A few hundred thousand hand carts would have as well. Remember, this is the place that invented the term "brute force". None of the road looks nearly as bad as the Burma Road that the allies had to use.

So, no, I don't think it is gamey. You lose some to waste across some of the hexes, but not nearly as much as you will to subs. And you free up hundreds of ships and save a LOT of fuel. Towards the end of the war, IJ got pretty close in RL, so that vets it even more.

I generally earmark a lot of force to clear China to get this in play once Singers falls. It is far more important to the economy than playing around in the Solomon's or OZ or any of those other sand boxes that the IJ gets caught up in.

DEI + Singers to Fusan line = BIG Bonus for IJ [:D]

[Mike Solli]

ORIGINAL: Cpt Sherwood

You need to look, there are some 1E bombers that will upgrade to Lily for no PPs. They can then be switched to the Sally for no PPs also. It is how there upgrade path is defined in the editor.

That never dawned on me. Guess I should look at the upgrade paths. But, does this apply with PDU on? I'm asking because I have never played AE with PDU on.

[PaxMondo]

Still applies I beleive.  So if the AG normally upgrades to a 2E, no PP penalty.  Otherwise you pay.  Only a few do not have the penalty (see Damian's post).  Most, particularly in MAN/CHI were 1E for the entire war.  [:@]
 
 

[Mike Solli]

Thanks Pax. In Manchuoko, I plan on keeping the air units as 1E. In China, I'll just have to take the 75 PP bite when I can afford it (mid to late 42 most likely).

I think I discovered the problem with my monitor. I don't believe there are drivers for Windows 7. So, it appears I'll be in the market for a new monitor this week. Not sure that's the problem though. Have I said lately that i hate Windows?

[n01487477]

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli

I think I discovered the problem with my monitor. I don't believe there are drivers for Windows 7. So, it appears I'll be in the market for a new monitor this week. Not sure that's the problem though. Have I said lately that i hate Windows?

Actually in Win 7 you can change the resolution to what you want as long as you don't go beyond the monitors manufacturing specs. As I've downgraded to XP on a mates notebook (my notebook is now only good as a coaster). I can't give you a screen shot

It will be under adaptor - List all modes iirc. You can change it to one of those resolutions; I'll see if I can find a link for you...

Couldn't find a how to: (and this might not work on your rig anyway) - Look into your adaptor and make sure below is not ticked.

[Mike Solli]

Thanks Damian. Giving it a shot now. [:)]

[PaxMondo]

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli

In China, I'll just have to take the 75 PP bite when I can afford it (mid to late 42 most likely).

Same for me. Might even have to roll into '43 for the last couple ... PP's are a real premium until then for me. [;)]