When?

[gridley]

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets

ORIGINAL: Joseignacio

Steve, sorry to come up with the dreaded question but, after so many months from a predicted date, I cannot see the end close.

I'll go out on a limb here and say before July 1 of this year. As to what will be included in the first release - I will not comment on that at this time.

I know this isn't written in stone, anything can happen, etc...But Holy Smokes!!!

And to just throw it out there so non-chalantly...very cool[8D]

[Centuur]

ORIGINAL: gridley

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets

ORIGINAL: Joseignacio

Steve, sorry to come up with the dreaded question but, after so many months from a predicted date, I cannot see the end close.

I'll go out on a limb here and say before July 1 of this year. As to what will be included in the first release - I will not comment on that at this time.

I know this isn't written in stone, anything can happen, etc...But Holy Smokes!!!

And to just throw it out there so non-chalantly...very cool[8D]

Hmmm. Let's wait and see. After seeing the AAR and looking at the monthly reports, I came to the conclusion that December was probably a good estimation... July: it looks very, very soon. But if Steve sees that things are finally coming to an end, things might speed up, with the horse smelling the stables...[:D]

[HansHafen]

Wow, by July 2012? I think we are looking at a nod to reality here from Mr. Rowland. Looks like they will release a non AI version after all. Interesting.

[ioticus]

So does that mean the AI is finished or there won't be an AI?  Because every time I read the report it says "nothing new" for AI.

[warspite1]

ORIGINAL: ioticus

So does that mean the AI is finished or there won't be an AI?  Because every time I read the report it says "nothing new" for AI.

As to what will be included in the first release - I will not comment on that at this time.

No it means Steve cannot say at the moment.


Edit: apologies if that sounded snotty - it wasn't meant to.

[Joseignacio]

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets

ORIGINAL: Joseignacio

Steve, sorry to come up with the dreaded question but, after so many months from a predicted date, I cannot see the end close.

I know you wont give a date. Could you speak about a certain year as a prospective date?

I am pretty shy to ask this, and I totally understand if you are still not prone to do so. Just I was wondering, in order to check the advances of the game as frequently or less frequently (if it's going to last for several yers still).

Glad to hear your health improves, I hope Red Prince is also 100% recovered.

I'll go out on a limb here and say before July 1 of this year. As to what will be included in the first release - I will not comment on that at this time.

[&o][X(]

[Joseignacio]

ORIGINAL: ioticus

So does that mean the AI is finished or there won't be an AI?  Because every time I read the report it says "nothing new" for AI.

Obviously everyone can extract his own conclusions. Steve spoke much more than I thought, if he doesn't want to speak more, we should respect this.

I imagine that, considering that in the last report there is no advance on AI, and he says he will not speak of what it consists of (it shows that sth. should be left from original plans) , we can assume in a relevant percentage of probability that there may be no AI in this first release.

Bo, nice to read you againl. By now I am playing Total War, HoI3, Rise of Prussia, Birth of America, ... and TripleA . As well as reading (and working and learning languages, ...).

[bo]

ORIGINAL: Joseignacio

ORIGINAL: ioticus

So does that mean the AI is finished or there won't be an AI?  Because every time I read the report it says "nothing new" for AI.

Obviously everyone can extract his own conclusions. Steve spoke much more than I thought, if he doesn't want to speak more, we should respect this.

I imagine that, considering that in the last report there is no advance on AI, and he says he will not speak of what it consists of (it shows that sth. should be left from original plans) , we can assume in a relevant percentage of probability that there may be no AI in this first release.

Bo, nice to read you againl. By now I am playing Total War, HoI3, Rise of Prussia, Birth of America, ... and TripleA . As well as reading (and working and learning languages, ...).

What not playing El Cid[;)] I do hope there is some kind of an AI, good not so good soso, don't care, I need it for a training tool if not so be it.

Bo

[Joseignacio]

Is there a video game namedl El Cid? I guess you'r referring to a campaign of Age of COnquerors.

El Cid was a real person, a hero who was a nobleman and the Champion of the King of Castile. He humiliated his brother when he was going to be crowned, by making him swear in a church on the Bible the new king he had nothing to do in the murder of his brother, whom El Cid revered.

The new king never forgave him having put him in the disjunctive of condemn his soul (like he did) or die, and banned him and any followers from his kingdom. El Cid (pronounced El Sid in old spanish, after his arab nickname) was named like that by the arab enemies and sometimes allies of him (Al Sidi or The Lord).

He became kind of a mercenary force, unbalancing the previous delicate balance between the christian kingdoms and the muslims and their allies and vassals, of the same or different religion.

He allied the Emir of Zaragoza against the Sultan (Caliplh?) of Cordoba and conquered Valencia for himself, he couldn't defend it though, against a kind of Yihad surged in Northern Africa Cordoba Caliphate land,s and offered to the king of Castile, but the king preferred not to get the city- state and provinces and have El Cid back as a vassal, that was his hatred, even decades afterwards (also he might want to avoid the harder of the Yihad).

About this extraordinary hero and General (our own Vlad Tepes, the real hero, not the TV Dracula), the people used to say "O God what a good vassal, if only he had a good Lord..."

Ooops, sorry about the digression.

[Joseignacio]

Delete, please, duplicated.

[Centuur]

MWIF is under development a very, very long time, due to the difficulties regarding the coding of the rules (which is understandable if you only look at the forums discussing the rules. WiF itself isn't an easy game, rulewise...) If we look at the AAR it looks like those rules are pretty well put into code. If bugs on the playtesting are really going down fast, this then means the point is near where things like PBeM and Netplay are being made. Since Steve is doing the Netplay now, it sure is looking that development is in this phase now. After that, the AI remains to be coded followed by the last optional rules...
No AI in the first release is of course going to be a disappointment for a lot of potential customers. However: a lot of people are waiting for MWIF to go on the market because of lack of playing space and lack of players availability for the board game itself too. A lot of people simply don't have a room to spare for a game which takes years to play if you can only play it one day of the week.
So going to put it unto the market without the AI, but with the promise that the AI will be build and patched to the buyers might be a wise decision. However that also puts pressure on Steve, since he has to build the AI soon.
Well: we wait for the official comments and messages which will appear at the right time.
For now: I wish Steve good luck, since it looks like he has committed himself now...

[bo]

ORIGINAL: Joseignacio

Is there a video game namedl El Cid? I guess you'r referring to a campaign of Age of COnquerors.

El Cid was a real person, a hero who was a nobleman and the Champion of the King of Castile. He humiliated his brother when he was going to be crowned, by making him swear in a church on the Bible the new king he had nothing to do in the murder of his brother, whom El Cid revered.

The new king never forgave him having put him in the disjunctive of condemn his soul (like he did) or die, and banned him and any followers from his kingdom. El Cid (pronounced El Sid in old spanish, after his arab nickname) was named like that by the arab enemies and sometimes allies of him (Al Sidi or The Lord).

He became kind of a mercenary force, unbalancing the previous delicate balance between the christian kingdoms and the muslims and their allies and vassals, of the same or different religion.

He allied the Emir of Zaragoza against the Sultan (Caliplh?) of Cordoba and conquered Valencia for himself, he couldn't defend it though, against a kind of Yihad surged in Northern Africa Cordoba Caliphate land,s and offered to the king of Castile, but the king preferred not to get the city- state and provinces and have El Cid back as a vassal, that was his hatred, even decades afterwards (also he might want to avoid the harder of the Yihad).

About this extraordinary hero and General (our own Vlad Tepes, the real hero, not the TV Dracula), the people used to say "O God what a good vassal, if only he had a good Lord..."

Ooops, sorry about the digression.

I apoligize Jose, a little bit of stupid south philadelphia humor, I thought El Cid's real name was Charlton Heston[:D] I know of no game with El Cid in it. Are we going to have an AI or not?

Bo

[Joseignacio]

No need to apologize. 'Bout AI, we`ll see, Steven will say when he is ready to say it.

[parusski]

I'll go out on a limb here and say before July 1 of this year. As to what will be included in the first release - I will not comment on that at this time.

I was expecting to wait another 5 years. It looks to be a great summer.

[petracelli]

Steve

This is great news a d hope all your hard work is moving close to fruition!

Cheers

Phil

[norvandave]

ORIGINAL: Centuur

So going to put it unto the market without the AI, but with the promise that the AI will be build and patched to the buyers might be a wise decision. However that also puts pressure on Steve, since he has to build the AI soon.

This is a big game and Steve has done an amazing job. I like many others, am just waiting to buy this soon to be masterpiece. I must say however that I need a decent AI. I just don't have very much time and this game looks like a sizeable time committment and a bit of a learning curve.

Reading between the lines it looks like Steve is intending to release the WiF without an AI, at least to start. There has been very little news of AI testing or performance. Following the release, Steve will likely find many more reported bugs that he will need to work on for patches. Makes me wonder about when the AI could be completed.

Here's hoping for a great AI. I will be more than happy to purchase even though it may be $$$.

Thank you Steve. Hopefully 2012 is the year.

[micheljq]

Do not get to much excited, we are never sure until a game is really released.  There can be many delays still.

[Klydon]

I thought they might be getting closer with the start of the AAR's. (Usually a good sign as the game is far enough along to be somewhat "useable"). I didn't imagine it would be this soon, but I have to also assume no AI on the initial release. While disappointed, I totally understand as the game has been in development for so long, there has to be a desire to get some revenue coming in somehow for all this work. I know at one point, Steve mentioned an estimate of 5000 hours for the AI. My guess is it might take longer than that although how much is done already, we don't really know. We do know a lot of the scripts and decision trees from a strategy standpoint have been in progress, so that does help. My best guess is they will release this summer if they can and then it would probably be at least another year for an "AI expansion" that may also include some additional stuff that is also being left out of the initial release.

Either way, certainly a positive step forward at this point.

[bo]

ORIGINAL: Klydon

I thought they might be getting closer with the start of the AAR's. (Usually a good sign as the game is far enough along to be somewhat "useable"). I didn't imagine it would be this soon, but I have to also assume no AI on the initial release. While disappointed, I totally understand as the game has been in development for so long, there has to be a desire to get some revenue coming in somehow for all this work. I know at one point, Steve mentioned an estimate of 5000 hours for the AI. My guess is it might take longer than that although how much is done already, we don't really know. We do know a lot of the scripts and decision trees from a strategy standpoint have been in progress, so that does help. My best guess is they will release this summer if they can and then it would probably be at least another year for an "AI expansion" that may also include some additional stuff that is also being left out of the initial release.

Either way, certainly a positive step forward at this point.

Forgive me for this as I do not want to get into any argument again about this AI thing.
I will buy the game AI or no AI, I want to be very clear about that. To all the board game players no AI will not matter to you I assume, not sure of that. I believe with my heart and soul that the majority of wargamers in the open market will not buy this game without a decent AI. I for one do not like pbem. And net play I am not sure about that either. There is nothing better than to play against a human opponet. I play cod2 all the time on line. The cod2 AI is not bad for a computer game but I prefer going up against very good players even if I dont do well. Steve has not said one way or the other about an AI. I did not read that 5000 hours thing, must have missed it. To my knowledge every top selling war game in the last 10 years had an AI. Even if the AI is poor I dont care at least I will learn something from it. There is a big following of board gamers but really not enough to make money for Matrix. There is a vast world of wargamers out there and if no AI I guarantee you they will not buy. I want to play when I want to play not when its convenient or not convenient for someone else. As I said before I have ADG'S WIF, its just ok and without an AI which it does not have I wish I had not bought it. My only experience with pbem was not good as it was all screwed up, why should I expect anything better now, please Steve not any kind of dig on you, I just don't have any confidence left with anybody. I tried to stay away from posting but this no AI thing has upset me, I thought it was a nobrainer situation. Guess not huh! These are my feelings right or wrong, just can't help being this way.

Bo

[NeverMan]

The question isn't "When?" it's "If?"