August 2012 Beta Patch impressions

[Redmarkus5]

Here is the new UI with the greatly reduced toolbars. It looks super cool guys.

[Redmarkus5]

Toolbar size can be toggled in Settings, as advised by Andrey on the Graviteam site.

[Missouri_Rebel]

I like the size of things with the exception of the mini map. I wish it could be regular size and that we could somehow make all those buttons 'closer' to each other. But that is not realistic and andrey has a thousand customers with a thousand different 'opinions'.

What I want him to consider are those things you mentioned about the infantry model and the the suggestions thereof.

You stated,

'I think they need to enhance the infantry model first. So far, APOS is excellent on the armour side of things, but a lot of changes are needed to improve the infantry aspect, such as:

1. Less suicidal behaviour for experienced units so that they follow this sequence;
- Go to ground when coming under effective fire.
- Return fire and suppress the enemy.
- Pepper pot forwards while maintaining suppression fires.
- Use covered approaches, where possible.
- Engage with grenades 25m from the enemy position.
- Hand-to-hand in the enemy position only as a final stage and only when high caliber troops are involved.
- Stop advancing once n% casualties have been suffered (percentage depends on commander's influence, troop quality, number of enemy units spotted and distance from enemy).

2. Add 'Prone' and 'Crawl' commands.
- Prone infantry do not kneel or stand and their range of view is reduced to a few metres.
- Prone infantry cannot be spotted from a range above 50m unless they are in open ground or their position is overlooked by higher ground.
- Infantry ordered to 'Crawl' will move for 30 seconds and then rest for 30 seconds. After crawling for 5 minutes, infantry will rest for 5 minutes, unless under fire. Crawling infantry should suffer increased fatigue effects.

3. Add 'Dig-in' command
- Infantry can dig a shell scrape in 5 minutes if standing and not under fire.
- Infantry can go prone and dig a shell scrape in 10 minutes in the prone position when under fire.

4. Add a richer set of infantry 'states', so that the range looks like this:
- Eager (willing to advance)
- Cautious (% chance they will refuse to advance)
- Scared (will take cover and return fire, but will only advance if a senior commander [Company or above] is within command range)
- Suppressed (will stay prone and under cover. Will only fire on enemy units within 25m)
- Panic - (unit will surrender if enemy is within 25m or Rout using covered avenues of retreat if the enemy is further away and if safe movement is possible. Will not rout into areas under fire unless unit is inexperienced).

5. Add improved animations.

6. Remove the kneeling and standing routine which is annoying and which probably reduces concealment as well.

7. Add an ambush command with;
- a specified arc
- a specified target type
- specified fire commands
- a 'pause and got-to' option for whenever an enemy enters a specified arc

On the Armor side, the main change I would like to see is that APCs halt and pull back to covered positions as soon as they spot enemy AFVs. Right now, German APCs are advancing into positions occupied by T34s, even after multiple APCs have been knocked out.'

http://graviteam.com/forum/index.php?topic=10352.0

Reply #13

[wodin]

You can already set an ambush I do it all the time. You have settings for Inf only or armour only. I set out my forces facing the way i wnat them to, Turn off all firing. When I see the enemy get in close I turn on firing and wham ambush and loads of dead enemy. If It's a PAK I make sure it's on armour only and give it a fire arc. Infact setting up ambush in APOS is a delight and works superbly well.

So all those things are already in fame.

I'm not to concerned there isn't loads of micromanaging your forces. I like the hands off feel and let them decided when to go prone etc. I've been waiting for years to see Inf react Ok on their own and APOS gets it closer than any, blimey on contact a squad will do fire and movement.

[Missouri_Rebel]

The problem is that units are too easily spotted.

[Redmarkus5]

ORIGINAL: wodin

You can already set an ambush I do it all the time. You have settings for Inf only or armour only. I set out my forces facing the way i wnat them to, Turn off all firing. When I see the enemy get in close I turn on firing and wham ambush and loads of dead enemy. If It's a PAK I make sure it's on armour only and give it a fire arc. Infact setting up ambush in APOS is a delight and works superbly well.

So all those things are already in fame.

I'm not to concerned there isn't loads of micromanaging your forces. I like the hands off feel and let them decided when to go prone etc. I've been waiting for years to see Inf react Ok on their own and APOS gets it closer than any, blimey on contact a squad will do fire and movement.

I suggested:

7. Add an ambush command with;
- a specified arc
- a specified target type
- specified fire commands
- a 'pause and go-to' option for whenever an enemy enters a specified arc

I didn't say there was no ambush capability at the moment.

[Redmarkus5]

I agree about the mini-map. I'll raise the point as well.

[JMass]

ORIGINAL: redmarkus4
I agree about the mini-map.

I too, it should be a a resizable window...

[0311USMC]

Ability to specify smoke from on map mortars and guns.

[Redmarkus5]

ORIGINAL: 0311USMC

Ability to specify smoke from on map mortars and guns.

Good point.

[wodin]

Not sure how often smoke was dropped by mortars on the east front. Can't remember reading anything about it. I'd imagine the smoke would dissipate way to quick from a mortar round.

[GBS]

Sorry but is this beta patch out now?

[0311USMC]

Never read anything either. But I been in the grunts back in the day
when we walked everywhere. If you carried it you used it! Even if you used
just to get rid of so you don't have to carry it anymore.

If you look some where on internet that it was part of their ammo load,
they used... if no carry no use..easy answer [;)]

Dissipate in open i agree but could use it in towns.
Couple of hand held smokes worked in Hue.

[Redmarkus5]

we carried and used 81mm mortar smoke in the 1970s. I doesn't dissipate as quickly as a smoke grenade, but we certainly saw benefit in using those.

[Dane49]

Considering the supply problems most of these units were experiencing during this campaign,I wouldn't think smoke rounds would be a high priority item.Plus the fact that most the terrain is open during windy winter conditions,I would think it would cause the smoke to dissipaite rather fast to be of much use for concealment or hindering enemy LOS.

[bairdlander2]

ORIGINAL: redmarkus4

we carried and used 81mm mortar smoke in the 1970s. I doesn't dissipate as quickly as a smoke grenade, but we certainly saw benefit in using those.

speaking of mortars how do you get them in game to fire?I pick "attack" that doesnt work and they dont fire even when being over run by Russian infantry.In fact they never fire,but when I am playing as Russians,German mortars work.[&:]

[Missouri_Rebel]

baird, do you ever use the function of clicking on the target button in the toolbar on the right and then dragging a box over what you want your units to fire at?

mo reb

[bairdlander2]

No,never thanks

[Redmarkus5]

ORIGINAL: bairdlander

ORIGINAL: redmarkus4

we carried and used 81mm mortar smoke in the 1970s. I doesn't dissipate as quickly as a smoke grenade, but we certainly saw benefit in using those.

speaking of mortars how do you get them in game to fire?I pick "attack" that doesnt work and they dont fire even when being over run by Russian infantry.In fact they never fire,but when I am playing as Russians,German mortars work.[&:]

Or select the mortar platoon commander and press 'G' and then right-click for a point target, or right mouse-drag for a linear one.

Accuracy is greatly improved if the platoon commander can see the target, so position him somewhat forward or on high ground.