Formation Editor

[mattpenfold]

It is really quite simple to setup a ASW patrol zone.

1. Define the patrol zone using reference points.
2. Set those reference points either fixed or relative to the naval group they will be screening.
3. Create a ASW patrol mission, using those reference points. It is best not to mix aircraft and ships because of the 1/3 rule. Do seperate mission for each, using the 1/3 rule for aircraft but not for ships.
4. Decide what the ROE/EMCON rules will be.
5. Assign the ships/aircraft.

Keep in mind if you are using ships for an ASW screen, then you will have problems if the group being screened is coming on fast. It is almost impossible to perform an effective ASW screen if the group being screened is moving nearly as fast as the ships doing the screening.

[eaube]

ORIGINAL: mattpenfold

It is really quite simple to setup a ASW patrol zone.

1. Define the patrol zone using reference points.
2. Set those reference points either fixed or relative to the naval group they will be screening.
3. Create a ASW patrol mission, using those reference points. It is best not to mix aircraft and ships because of the 1/3 rule. Do seperate mission for each, using the 1/3 rule for aircraft but not for ships.
4. Decide what the ROE/EMCON rules will be.
5. Assign the ships/aircraft.

Keep in mind if you are using ships for an ASW screen, then you will have problems if the group being screened is coming on fast. It is almost impossible to perform an effective ASW screen if the group being screened is moving nearly as fast as the ships doing the screening.

15 knots shouldn't be TOO unreasonable for ships that can make 30+ knots I wouldn't think. Unfortunately ship groups assigned to ASW patrols simply refuse to go faster than 12 knots. I'd imagine that this would work fine if you limit your force that is being screened to 10 knots, but that seems a BIT unreasonable to me.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jfIOqapRmUM

This is my interpretation of your directions and the result. It was done just for show, so I didn't set up airborne patrols and the like, since those work WONDERFULLY and is a huge improvement over how that works in H3. Neither task group, which both have their slowest ship capable of 20kts full/28kts flank, will generally not try to go any faster than 12 knots.

That behavior of course is fine in a fixed patrol zone. There's no need to go zooming about at 30kts there. Unfortunately the ASW patrol behavior doesn't recognize the difference between 'fixed zone' ASW patrol and 'station keeping zone' ASW patrol. If the later was added as a separate patrol type with it's own speed behavior, it might be a simple solution.

[mikmykWS]

Okay use the formation editor for the ships and mission editor for the aircraft.

You can drop 4 points quickly by: ctrl + left click on the map, pick define area and then draw the area you'd like. This will drop four points selected. You can then launch the mission editor and set up a ASW Patrol Mission. I usually assign MPA's to the boxes or high endurance ASW helo's using the 1/3rd rule and keep them in the area. I then assign the lighter asw helo's to a sub strike mission. They'll launch and attack as the towed arrays or patrols detect subs which is close to the RL model.

If somebody doesn't beat me to it I'll do a video this weekend with some tips.

[eaube]

I'm sorry if I'm misunderstanding, but I don't think we're talking about the same thing. I can set airborne ASW patrols that track in front of a formation without any problems. I can set ship formations just fine for pure station keeping, great for AAW and ASuW work. However, I can't set ships to sprint and drift around a formation centerpiece, regardless of using the formation editor or missions. If we ARE talking about the same thing, I guess I'll wait for the video to see what I'm doing incorrectly. Regardless, thanks for taking the time to try to explain, and doing a video if it comes to it.

[mikmykWS]

Ah gotcha. No sprint and drift yet within formations. Adding a note to existing entry in our feature requests.

[eaube]

Perfect, all I needed to know, thanks! I look forwards to this being in-game.

[orca]

+1

To allow creation of ship asw (and possibly sea control) patrols though formation editor with the following features.

The patrols would be within a zone (not a point). The zone area is user defined and can be at a fixed or relative bearing to lead ship in formation.

The ship would exhibit sprint-drift behavior.


Might consider allowing reference points related to a group that are created in formation editor to be visualized only in formation editor.

[SSN754planker]

The formation editor for me is pretty to use. The use of RP's makes everything a LOT easier than it used to be in Harp. Now with the latest builds you can hide RP's so they do not clutter the map, so you don't see a mass of X's where your task force icon should be.

[smudge56]

Where's that option Im blind.

[SSN754planker]

Its not in 469, but they did include it in 470. Probably going to have to wait until 1.02 to see it. Check the build roll.

[Figeac]

I would like to see sprint-drift too, but I'm not sure if it is necessary. I mean, does the speed of a ship (or a nearby one) affects his sonar range in Command?

And I also would like to know what is the red diamond that appears on the formation editor and the main map sometimes!

[Dimitris]

ORIGINAL: Figeac
I would like to see sprint-drift too, but I'm not sure if it is necessary. I mean, does the speed of a ship (or a nearby one) affects his sonar range in Command?

Absolutely.

And I also would like to know what is the red diamond that appears on the formation editor and the main map sometimes!

Pointer used by the navigator AI.

[smudge56]

Ah good I'm not going mad.

ORIGINAL: SSN754planker

Its not in 469, but they did include it in 470. Probably going to have to wait until 1.02 to see it. Check the build roll.

[Sigma8510]

Quoting my own post, but I am not sure this issue was ever addressed. Outlined below, but in brief, surface units assigned to ASW patrols with reference points stay at constant speed no matter their relative position to the formation. Causes them to get, and remain, way off station. Will run a test on the latest build (482) and post a save tomorrow.
Anyone with information on the status of this issue, please respond.
Thanks!!

ORIGINAL: jbaxter1964

ORIGINAL: Lack of Comprehension

I have been playing around a fair bit in the Advanced ASW Exercise scenario to get a feel for the 'formationless' formations, and I'll admit it has left me a bit confused. Any ship I assign to an ASW patrol mission spends the entirety of the scenario moving at 12 knots. If the reference points are tracking a ship going 15 knots, they simply lag far behind the formation and never 'keep up', which makes for a fairly poor screen as you can imagine. Shouldn't a ship on an ASW patrol mission alternate between moving at full to get to it's self plotted destination in a reasonable timeframe, then drift for a bit to listen, go back to full to 'keep up' again, and so on, rather than just moving at a constant 12 speed?

...

I may post this in the beta forum as well, but I am just getting a chance to raise this as an issue as well.

I too have seen the same behavior from ships assigned to ASW patrol missions tied to tracking reference points. In this case I am in one of the Falklands scenarios and assign a DD (after detaching) at the rear of the formation to a ASW patrol station in front of the group. After 6+ game hours, he has stayed at a constant 12knots trying to over take a 16 knot task force. Needless to say, he is further behind the group and doesn't stand a chance to get in front until they get on station. The expected behavior would have been for the DD to make best speed to station, AND THEN commence patrol (sprint/drift, etc.).

I hope this is enough information to get someone started. If there is something I am missing in my setup, please let me know.

Great game! (Can't say it enough!)

Joe

[Rudd]

Quoting my own post, but I am not sure this issue was ever addressed. Outlined below, but in brief, surface units assigned to ASW patrols with reference points stay at constant speed no matter their relative position to the formation. Causes them to get, and remain, way off station. Will run a test on the latest build (482) and post a save tomorrow.
Anyone with information on the status of this issue, please respond.
Thanks!!

Make sure the "Manual speed" box is unchecked on all ships in formation, seems like I had this issue before, and that fixed it.

[DROregon]

Is there a tutorial video of the formation editor, with air missions (ASW & AAW) too?

[Sigma8510]

ORIGINAL: Rudd

Quoting my own post, but I am not sure this issue was ever addressed. Outlined below, but in brief, surface units assigned to ASW patrols with reference points stay at constant speed no matter their relative position to the formation. Causes them to get, and remain, way off station. Will run a test on the latest build (482) and post a save tomorrow.
Anyone with information on the status of this issue, please respond.
Thanks!!

Make sure the "Manual speed" box is unchecked on all ships in formation, seems like I had this issue before, and that fixed it.

Just got time to test this in 486. Max speed of ship assigned to ASW patrol was 12 knots. I checked all speed boxes for all surface units to verify they were in "auto". I am pretty sure this is a known issue, and I seem to recall it was scheduled to be fixed down the road. For now I will just have to micro manage the formations.