Who would save us if we fell?

Dedas · Post by **Dedas** » Sat Mar 10, 2001 3:31 am

Is turn-based wargaming a dying genre?
To click the button "End Turn", to go on with the action?
This is a tragic subject to discuss, with games realtime games taking over, games as "Close Combat" etc, realtime, realtime, realtime!

What is realtime then?
All the action coming at once.. the faster you give out orders the better it goes!

Is that the right gaming way?

Is the time factor needed?

Is this genre dying to give place to faster games?

So many questions so little time...he he!
You must understand that whatever happens I will always stand on the side of turn-based realistic games as SPWAW and if we all do the genre is going to live forever!

Turn-based forever!!

Do not give in to the fast paced games, no! do not!

Pack Rat · Post by **Pack Rat** » Sat Mar 10, 2001 4:27 am

My reflexes suck. As the gaming community gets older I'll be less alone. I think game makers will come to the conclusion, as they get older, the market for turned based is growing, not dieing. I find the thread on ages a real eye opener.

Pack Rat

Hunpecked · Post by **Hunpecked** » Sat Mar 10, 2001 4:36 am

How about "real time" with the option to pause yet continue issuing orders--against the computer, anyway?

BruceAZ_MatrixForum · Post by **BruceAZ_MatrixForum** » Sat Mar 10, 2001 4:37 am

I agree with Pack Rat. I love turn-based gaming as it allows time to "think" between moves. Strategy! Maybe it's because I grew up playing chess that I enjoy war gaming. Anyway, I agree with you both. Hopefully it will be around for awhile.

Bruce
Semper Fi

Rhodan · Post by **Rhodan** » Sat Mar 10, 2001 4:57 am

I think eventually there will be a mix of turn-based and realtime..those of you who played Baldur's Gate/BG II/Icewind Dale/Torment will know what I mean...what happens is that the game is pretty much 'pauzed' at any time you desire, during the pauze you give your orders, then you turn the real time on and see how your orders unfold...if you wish you can still add some orders 'on the fly' during the r/t phase.

Personally I get sappy day dreams imagining of a wargame based on that principal..a mix of SPWaW enormous database of material ( one of it's strongest points imo), the interface of the BG series and the 3d overview of a game like Panzer General 3.

Rho

Flashfyre · Post by **Flashfyre** » Sat Mar 10, 2001 11:20 am

As long as there are people like those posting here, and manning the consoles at workshops like Matrix, turn-based games will never die.
On the surface, it does look like the RTS and "arcade"-style games are taking the lead. But, as in all things, change comes. Fads are born, live fast lives, and disappear quicker than your paycheck.

Last year, I read in Computer Gaming that the genre of Role-Playing Games was dying, if not already dead. Yet, there are more RPG games out now than before.

Those of us who are die-hard, committed strategy gamers will continue to make our voices heard to the Great Game Designers, and they will respond.

As my daddy always said, "A clean battlefield is a SAFE battlefield."

------------------
The Motor Pool
http://www.geocities.com/aurion_eq/index.html?976419304550
kmcferren@cvn.net

ruxius · Post by **ruxius** » Sat Mar 10, 2001 6:06 pm

Originally posted by Flashfyre:
Everything he has written !

EXACTLY !

I didn't try Combat Mission due to my hardware videocard imcompatibilty but it should be the right point in the middle..
However till the end of my life ,a turnbased wargame will always live in my PC ! Be sure about this..and I know here I am not alone !

molset · Post by **molset** » Sat Mar 10, 2001 6:24 pm

Gentlemen.
I read with interrest your thorughts about turn based wargames and where wargames are heading. Some time ago I read a editorial article by Bruce Geryk at the strategy section on the Gamesdomain site. It was a reading of interrest and comfort for those who fear for their hobby. The editorial is at: http://www.gamesdomain.com/gdreview/zones/strategy/covarc/mar00/ca4.html

As long as we have outstanding people as the ones at matrix our hobby is no danger of extinction. But we have to support them. I will.

Regards

Molset

"Jakki er ekki frakki nema sidur se"

Panzer Capta · Post by **Panzer Capta** » Sat Mar 10, 2001 7:32 pm

Just my opinion......as long as there are true wargamers out there, the turn-based systems will never die. The "click-fest" games have their own merit, but they never will displace what most of us prefer.

As an analogy, if there are any serious chess players out there, you know the difference between a hard fought "thinking" game as compared to speed chess.

I have said this before, no matter who tells you that in combat there is no time to "think" they are dead wrong. This may be true on the small scale of an individual squad or platoon. However, in consideration of the big picture of a military operation, there must be strategic thought before implementation.

David Heath · Post by **David Heath** » Sun Mar 11, 2001 1:55 am

I agree that turn base games will not die... but they can easy become a few and far between item. Everyone is worried that we are going to dump SPWaW after version 5.0. This is true up to a point. The fact is we all love SPWaW. We have figured out that if we can sell 5,000+ copies of each of these Mega Campaigns we can fund the on going development of SPWaW. Mike Wood and I have figured we could afford to rip out the old graphics engine, interface and AI and make much more modern version. Still top-down view but much better and richer colors. I as always welcome anyone comments on this idea and possible plan.

David Heath

JediMessiah · Post by **JediMessiah** » Sun Mar 11, 2001 2:19 am

i love turn based games, whether they be tactical wargames or individual infantry combat. turnbased will never die, too many ppl hate to mash buttons

-jedimessiah

------------------
"Karate means never having to say you're sorry"
-E. Andrew Kovich

DoubleDeuce · Post by **DoubleDeuce** » Sun Mar 11, 2001 4:36 am

The way I look at it. Isn't Chess basically a turn based game. I believe it has been around a fairly long time. I doubt that turn/hex based wargames are going anywhere. There will just be a flux in the number of people who play them. Sometimes more, sometimes less. As new products emerge, fans of those games will carry it on.

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"Double Deuce on the Loose"
http://www.aspmall.com/ddmain/

ruxius · Post by **ruxius** » Sun Mar 11, 2001 5:12 am

Originally posted by David Heath:
I agree that turn base games will not die... but they can easy become a few and far between item. Everyone is worried that we are going to dump SPWaW after version 5.0. This is true up to a point. The fact is we all love SPWaW. We have figured out that if we can sell 5,000+ copies of each of these Mega Campaigns we can fund the on going development of SPWaW. Mike Wood and I have figured we could afford to rip out the old graphics engine, interface and AI and make much more modern version. Still top-down view but much better and richer colors. I as always welcome anyone comments on this idea and possible plan.

David Heath

eeeeeeeeh ?
EEEEEEEEEEEEH ?

-- -- -- -- -- -- --
|- |- |- |- |- |- _|
-- -- -- -- -- -- |
.

DAVID ! THIS IS A GREAT NEW ONE !!!
First your love declaration to SPWAW pull me to tibetan potions to lenghten my life to enjoy SPWAW more and more!!!...and more pragmatically I will speed my university degree to have a wage and to be able to buy multiple monthly copies of SPWAW so you will have the funds you need for going on SPWAW !
Which more hopes you are not kidding better than your true love to SPWAW ?
I am writing something to Paul so be sure new ideas will never leave you rest in glory...What a marvallous new thing tonight !!!!!!!
YEEEEEEEEEEEEEE !
YUPPPPPIIEEEEEEEEEE !!!!!!!!!!
BRAVI BRAVI !
SPWAW for shuttle astronauts' hobby while flying !!!
SPWAW for studying at schools ! SPWAW at the cinema...PanzerIV as my new personal car!
Cubital SPWAW written in to Rock Mountains
with faces of David ,Bill ,Paul and all matrix staff as mankind's benefactors !
(ok some things make me crazy ..I know !)

lnp4668 · Post by **lnp4668** » Mon Mar 12, 2001 11:21 pm

What I am hoping for is a game with the flexibility of spwaw
1. picks your force
2. watch them get better
3. upgrade them to your heart's content
4. bring them through a long war
5. good AI

combine with the more realistic WEGO system in Combat Mission.

Larry Holt · Post by **Larry Holt** » Mon Mar 12, 2001 11:48 pm

I think some version of sequential plot, simoultaneous resolution is the thing for tactical games. At the operational and strategic levels, things move so slowly (the process for air targeting at the theater level is based on once a day order updates) that IGoUGo isn't unrealistic.

Alby · Post by **Alby** » Tue Mar 13, 2001 12:34 am

Originally posted by David Heath:
I agree that turn base games will not die... but they can easy become a few and far between item. Everyone is worried that we are going to dump SPWaW after version 5.0. This is true up to a point. The fact is we all love SPWaW. We have figured out that if we can sell 5,000+ copies of each of these Mega Campaigns we can fund the on going development of SPWaW. Mike Wood and I have figured we could afford to rip out the old graphics engine, interface and AI and make much more modern version. Still top-down view but much better and richer colors. I as always welcome anyone comments on this idea and possible plan.

David Heath

rip out the old graphics engine, interface and AI and make anew!!!!
where do I send donations!!!!