Casualties

[morvael]

Attacking force was so small the defenders couldn't find anyone to shoot at... Perhaps all elements were disrupted by river crossing and there was no combat. Interesting there were no "attackers withdraw" casualties, though. Perhaps they are not taken from those disrupted at the crossing.

edit: what does the details window shows? Perhaps all defender's losses were caused by attacker's air support?

Do you have a way to provide a save for replication?

[chaos45]

Most likely losses to defender were from air support.

Still very odd attacker took no losses lol.

[Bozo_the_Clown]

Details. Should't someone at least slip and crack his head open.

[morvael]

So only half of the regiment managed to cross the river, of these the Soviets only managed to damage 4 elements and disrupt 7. I guess with such low numbers and integer math there were no candidates for destruction and loss during retreat.

I can't guarantee such results will not appear again in 1.08.05 as this comes from the core of the combat engine and how does it work. I was focused on repairing the other end of the scale (big battles).

[Bozo_the_Clown]

Ha, ha, I'm trying to picture this scene. 800 men are crossing the river while being bombarded by 200 artillery pieces. Then they decide it was not worth it and cross the river AGAIN without taking a single loss. [:D]

This is a server game by the way. I have a flair for the absurd so I don't mind this stuff. I'm sure this can be used to game the system. Maybe increase fatique or reduce fortifications before a major attack?

[Bozo_the_Clown]

I can't guarantee such results will not appear again in 1.08.05 as this comes from the core of the combat engine and how does it work. I was focused on repairing the other end of the scale (big battles).

I do appreciate your efforts in trying to fix this game. [&o]

[morvael]

ORIGINAL: Bozo_the_Clown
Ha, ha, I'm trying to picture this scene. 800 men are crossing the river while being bombarded by 200 artillery pieces. Then they decide it was not worth it and cross the river AGAIN without taking a single loss. [:D]

Looks like the enemy artillery was only shooting at those on their own side of the river. And since the airmen reported huge concentration of enemy troops, and the regiment commander saw he will be able to ferry only a battalion sized group to the other side before nightfall, he was wise enough to call off the attack before someone got hurt. Well, maybe his career was hurt, as news of insubortination reached Adolf...

[xbmoore]

Well, I sent the Security detachment over with special crates of "Vodka"..... it seemed to have worked!!!!

Actually was just seeing how bad the results would be for the Regiment if I sent them a couple of times(well 3 times) over the river into the swamp since we are just messing around with this game until .5 comes out. I was surprised with some of the results. It will cause fatigue at the expense of wins/morale/exp and will allow the air force to intercept more planes if so desired and set up correctly. By all means I'm no expert and consider myself a noob in the game but I love experimenting with different things.

[Bozo_the_Clown]

No harm done in this case as you did the deliberate attack first followed by those three hasty attacks. I can see this being a problem the other way around since fatique increases. I think this strategy has been used by the so called "good" players for years.

It's important to try out these things. All this should have been discovered and fixed during beta testing of the original game many years ago. I don't think it has a major effect on game play (maybe on fortifications?) but it's just embarrassing for a war game that wants/claims to be a simulation.

The Russians did appreciate the Vodka shipment. Morale instantly increased by 2. Experience, however, only increased by 1, which is very realistic since you don't learn as much when you are intoxicated. [:D]

[chaos45]

Bozo- "soaking" attacks arent always the best. As even though u use up some of the defenders ammunition and cause fatigue they also most likely gain morale.

Especially against 1941 Soviets...wins as Soviets in 1941 as precious as those units with wins quickly convert to Guards which then forms your counterattack forces in winter and your good defense/counterattack forces of 1942.

Not to mention your lowering your units morale being used in the soaking attacks.....yes it can help you get a position or so but not sure its a long term viable strategy. TDV vs Brian AAR has probably seen the most wide spread use/abuse of this and as you can see in that AAR both sides are extremely beat up and its counter-encirclement/encirclement operations all 1942 long.

[morvael]

Two related fixes:

72. Fixed a bug where scouting attacks were showing pre-battle CV and odds as final, but effects were resolved using final odds that were not shown.
73. Fixed a bug where scouting attacks removed 1 fort level if they ended up with odds above 1.50 to 1 (for the attacker).

...so those scouting attacks could be nasty

[heliodorus04]

ORIGINAL: Bozo_the_Clown

Ha, ha, I'm trying to picture this scene. 800 men are crossing the river while being bombarded by 200 artillery pieces. Then they decide it was not worth it and cross the river AGAIN without taking a single loss. [:D]

Kriegsmarine tryouts for the U-Boat fleet.

[mooreshawnm]

Just out of curiosity how big of a role did attrition play in RL? I looked at an earlier link provided in this thread and there sure didn't seem to be a huge variation whether an offensive was ongoing or not. Those parts of the front that were quiet for long stretches (I realize there were lots of 'little attack' we don't generally hear about)of time, were those divisions slowly bled to death or were they in good shape when the inevitable offensive came? What strength were the divisions of AGN (that weren't directly facing the guys trying to break into Leningrad) in 43?

[chaos45]

Historically the German Army never recovered from the losses it suffered over the winter of 1941 into 1942. The German army came very close to being completely routed and destroyed in front of Moscow....not propaganda but honest truth. Luckily for them Hitler ordered the not one step back order and some very talented German Generals stepped up to the plate and effectively managed the disaster and restored the frontlines actually turning it around by spring into several stinging Soviet defeats.

When the German army prepared for Operation Blue- the attack towards Stalingrad/Caucuses They basically sent almost all the new replacements, new equipment, and new formations to AG South to build it up for the offensive. Even then historically this only brought the army group up to around 80% ToE if I remember correctly in most assets like tanks, trucks, and combat infantrymen. They also did this by stripping some formations in the north and center of select units and equipment and transferring them to the south.

So if the main effort was only 80% manned and equipped how do you think the rest of the front looked? I dont have numbers off the top of my head but I would guess AG North and AG Center were all around 50-70% manned/equipped at this point. Thats probably the biggest failing of WiTE is you end up with both armies staying at 90%+ ToE almost all the time in 1941/1942 and so far even into 1943 is what we are seeing.

[heliodorus04]

When Bagration started, Army Group Center had two hundred tanks in total.
(I am supposing they do not count things like StgIIIs and Marders as 'tanks' but I wouldn't know for certain.)