Thread for DB3000 database problems, updates or issues

[mikmykWS]

ORIGINAL: Pancor

Hello it looks like

the weapon #1152 -- MIM-104B Patriot "PAC-1" has "anti stand-off jammer" (ASOJ) designed to seek out and destroy ECM emitters.
so it would the properties would have Home on Jam (HOJ) thanks.

Reference
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MIM-104_P ... 28PAC-1.29

Need more detailed sources than Wikipedia. Will research when I have time but if you could find them it will speed up implementation if the capability proves to exist. Thanks!

Mike

[Hongjian]

Request to add more weapon options to the aircraft stores of the #1731 H-6K Badger [God of War]: 500KG GP-Bombs, FAB-500 and YJ-12 AShM, also increase its payload to 15 tons.

The recent Changchun Airshow in China, the PLAAF has revealed the H-6K bomber and part of its arsenal:


^We can see that it still can carry GP bombs (500kg low drag GP bombs, as well as 500kg "Russian Styled" FAB-500 copies), so it means that its bomb-bay isnt eliminated, as previously thought.
Here, in another photo showing the H-6K preparing for an excercise in the West Pacific, we see that the internal bay still exists:



Additionally, the Changchun Airshow's H-6K display shows this interesting placard:


^Placard says that the H-6K is used for anti-surface/ground strike/对地, anti-ship strike/海 and even Close Air Support/"近距离空中火力支援" literally; "close-distance aerial fire support" (!). Previously, it was assumed that the H-6K was only a strategic ALCM carrier, and not a tactical bomber capable of fulfilling anti-ship and close ground support missions. Now, we have seen those GP bombs, and it is possible that the H-6K could also carry those new LS-series of GPS/BDS guided bombs for CAS - but what weapons would it use for anti-shipping? In any case, no AShMs were displayed here, despite the placard confirming that the bomber is to be used for anti-shipping missions.

Coincidentially, the latest PLAAF air-excercise in the West Pacific actually involved the H-6K. While the H-6K was unarmed on that excercise, a Chinese state-media report 'inofficially' confirmed that the H-6K is to be carrying YJ-12s to literally "attack carrier groups".


So, while we still have yet to see any photographic evidence that the H-6K carries the YJ-12, state-media reports and the PLAAF released information is heavily pointing to that direction. Additionally, Jane's also believed that the H-6K can carry YJ-12 AShMs:
http://www.janes.com/article/60277/chin ... -china-sea

This would give some credence to this old chart published in an years-old issue from the semi-official chinese naval and air weapon knowledge magazine, showing the diverse loadout options for this bomber.



^weight wise, it would be credible that the H-6K could potentially carry six YJ-12 AShM: Even though the DB3000 entry shows that it is a 3000kg missile, most chinese sources quote a weight 2000 to 2500kg - considering that the missile is 6.5m long compared to the 3000kg and 8,9 BrahMos and 4000kg 9,39m P-270 Moskit, the much smaller YJ-12's real weight should be around the 2000+kg ballpark.

Considering that the H-6K is modernized with lighter composites and subsystems, as well as a more powerful efficient WS-18/D-30KP-2 engine, the payload has also be raised from 13tons to 15 tons, as official PLA sources say:

http://english.chinamil.com.cn/news-cha ... 087946.htm

The H-6K bombers boast low fuel consumption and lightweight engines, with a targeted redesign performed on the inlet. The significantly increased air intake of their engines boosts the thrust by 30 percent, while cutting down on fuel consumption by 20 percent.

The H-6K has hardpoints under its wings, which can carry six cruise missiles and a maximum payload of up to 15 tons, effectively improving the attack capability of the aircraft.

[mikmykWS]

Hi

Sorry need to see photos of these payloads. Drawings don't do and neither do ordinance spreads.

We've been fooled too much in the past and undoing errors causes issues with players scenarios.

Mike

[Hongjian]

Ok, I see.

Guess that we have to wait some years for confirmation then. Typcial of the Chinese military...

[butch4343]

ORIGINAL: mikmyk

ORIGINAL: Pancor

Hello it looks like

the weapon #1152 -- MIM-104B Patriot "PAC-1" has "anti stand-off jammer" (ASOJ) designed to seek out and destroy ECM emitters.
so it would the properties would have Home on Jam (HOJ) thanks.

Reference
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MIM-104_P ... 28PAC-1.29

Need more detailed sources than Wikipedia. Will research when I have time but if you could find them it will speed up implementation if the capability proves to exist. Thanks!

Mike

Mike

I wonder if these two sources might help confirm the MIM-104B SOJ capabilty?

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/ ... 11/ch5.htm

"5-23. To counter the long-range ECM threat the MIM-104B, or standoff jammer countermeasures (SOJC) missile, was fielded in the late 1980's. The guidance and navigation hardware was modified to allow the SOJC missile to fly a lofted trajectory to the jamming source and seek out the strongest emitter during the terminal phase of missile flight. The SOJC missile can fly three times longer than the standard missile without the uplink/downlink between the RS and missile. The SOJC missile retains the same performance against ABT and TBM as the standard missile.

http://www.designation-systems.net/dusrm/m-104.html

"The MIM-104B, fielded in the late 1980s, is also known as the SOJC (Standoff Jammer Countermeasures) missile and uses a modified guidance and navigation hardware. The MIM-104B adds a surface-to-surface capability against ground-based radar jamming sources to the Patriot system. The missile can fly an optimized (lofted) trajectory towards the jammer, and use its seeker to select the strongest emitter for terminal homing. The anti-aircraft/anti-missile capability is the same as for the MIM-104A."

Hope this helps [:)]

[conforoa]

Hi MikMyk, sorry i look at the DB is attach with scenario when i choose at start [&o] but i'll like view entire DB independant from any scenario, possible ? In scenario creating i'd can.

#1711 mk.48 mod.1 torpedo : not 915m deph but 762m, not 55kt but 48kt and not two way guidance but one (source world naval weapon systems and net)

#834 mk.48 mod.3 TELECOM torpedo : the mk.48 mod.1 same data but with two way guidance (same sources)

#1618 mk.48 mod.4 torpedo : speed ok but with range 13,25 nm not 17,5 nm (same sources)

#1705 mk.48 mod.5 torpedo : not speed at 65kt but 60kt, range at 20,5 nm not 20 nm and start service in 1989 (same sources)

The warhead for all mk.48 is the same [X(] ??

[mikmykWS]

ORIGINAL: conforoa

Hi MikMyk, sorry i look at the DB is attach with scenario when i choose at start [&o] but i'll like view entire DB independant from any scenario, possible ? In scenario creating i'd can.

#1711 mk.48 mod.1 torpedo : not 915m deph but 762m, not 55kt but 48kt and not two way guidance but one (source world naval weapon systems and net)

#834 mk.48 mod.3 TELECOM torpedo : the mk.48 mod.1 same data but with two way guidance (same sources)

#1618 mk.48 mod.4 torpedo : speed ok but with range 13,25 nm not 17,5 nm (same sources)

#1705 mk.48 mod.5 torpedo : not speed at 65kt but 60kt, range at 20,5 nm not 20 nm and start service in 1989 (same sources)

The warhead for all mk.48 is the same [X(] ??

There are websites that have our Db data.

http://cmano-db.com/

On torpedo ranges read here:

http://www.warfaresims.com/?page_id=2920#616

warhead size

If you've got data please site but they should be relatively close.

Thanks!

Mike

[Rocksoldier]

I think there may be an issue with ship #3041 : the ship has 32 cells VLS but only 1 channel for missile datalink.

Fixed

[orca]

New radars for US CVNs and LH amphibs.

http://www.naval-technology.com/news/ne ... ab-5012416
http://www.janes.com/article/64051/saab ... -atc-radar

[Luidzi]

910 Erradii (ship ID 3020) and P191 Abu Dhabi (ship ID 2724) are equipped with torpedo decoy launcher that doesn't work because it uses submarine decoys.

[mikmykWS]

ORIGINAL: Luidzi

910 Erradii (ship ID 3020) and P191 Abu Dhabi (ship ID 2724) are equipped with torpedo decoy launcher that doesn't work because it uses submarine decoys.

Fixed. Added MASS decoys to Abu Dhabi as well. Thanks!

[Hongjian]

Would like to again request PL-10 SRAAM missile loadout for the J-10B (#3300)/J-10C (#2057)

Signs of integration tests of the PL-10 replacing the PL-8 onbaord the J-10B/C have been spotted multiple times in the last couple of years. Now, it seems like that newly produced batches of the J-10B and J-10C carry P-10 dummies instead of the PL-8 dummies once they leave factory for their unit. The J-10 usually flies with dummy missiles, even during non-combat missions and transit, as the plane's aerodynamics were calibrated with 'wingtip'-pylons loaded at all times, so it is safe to assume that the PL-10 has fully replaced the old PL-8 as the standard short-range missile onboard the J-10B and C variants.

New J-10C with delivery-transit loadout:


Added to the J-10C. Will add to a future version of the J-10B.

[VIF2NE]

The database is not passive noise for oil platforms. In fact, the platform produces a lot of noise and are finding at a distance of 100+ km.

Added Thanks!

[Broncepulido]

Thoughts in future H-20 Chinese stealth bomber:
deleted, send in Naval and Defense News.

[temkc5]

Wrong Tread [&:]

[temkc5]

Missing LLTV & TV CAMERA from database: #4106 and #4576

Ps. I am not worthy of complaining
CMANO is Amazing [&o][&o][&o]

[ArmChairGen]

Hi everyone,

Would like to point out a number of issues regarding the B2 stealth bomber in CMANO. I conducted a number of tests in the scenario editor using the B2 and a number of different radar systems, and found out that a number of advanced Russian low frequency radars such as the RLM M Nebo M can detect the B2 at some 53nm. While everything regarding the B2's radar cross section (RCS) is highly classified, it is unlikely that VHF and UHF band radars would be capable of detecting the B2 at more than 20nm or so. Unlike narrow-band stealth aircraft such as the F35, F22, T50, etc, which are designed to defeat higher frequency fire control radars, the B2 is a broadband stealth aircraft, designed to be extremely low observable even in lower frequencies typically utilized by early warning and target acquisition radars. A number of sources estimate the B2's RCS at 0.0001 (although the angle and frequency and which such an RCS is achieved isn't specified, the aircraft is still likely extremely stealth from all angles). Even Air Power Australia, which is extremely biased in favor of Russian and Chinese air defense systems, estimates that a broadband stealth aircraft with an RCS of 0.0001 would not be detected by VHF radars at more than 20 to 25nm. Their estimation for the detection range of S band and X band radars utilized by the S300 series and S400 SAM systems is likewise lower than in CMANO and stands at about 15nm.

I've also noticed that the B2 isn't capable of picking up emissions by low frequency radars such as the Russian Nebo series. This is likely inaccurate as the aircraft is supposed to have a highly sophisticated ESM suit known as the Defensive Management System, which is currently also undergoing an extensive upgrade.

Lastly, I was wondering whether it will be possible to add the AGM 158B JASSM ER and GBU 53B SDB II to the B2's inventory? Work is underway to integrate both weapon systems on the aircraft.

I tried posting links to all the sources; however, as this is my first post, the forum won't allow me to attach links.

P.S. I'd like to express my gratitude to the CMANO staff for producing such a fantastic simulator and for constantly improving the database to provide users with a more comprehensive, realistic, and enjoyable experience. Keep up the good work guys!

NOTE: The reason I do not use any dashes or slashes in the names of the systems above is because this is my first post and the forum seems to mistake them for an attached link.

[Dimitris]

ORIGINAL: Hongjian
New J-10C with delivery-transit loadout:

Speaking of - is there any good source as to the CMANO-relevant differences between the J-10B and C ? Thanks.

[Filitch]

ORIGINAL: ArmChairGen

RCS is very dependent on bearing to radar, aircraft's altitude, flight directions: move closer or move away against radar (for pulse-Doppler radars). Are you sure that your test's conditions are equal Australian's test conditions?

[Hongjian]

ORIGINAL: Sunburn

ORIGINAL: Hongjian
New J-10C with delivery-transit loadout:

Speaking of - is there any good source as to the CMANO-relevant differences between the J-10B and C ? Thanks.

Deino/Andreas Rupprecht, kinda the western 'reference' on the PLAAF, made this:



As one can see, the visible differences are VERY minor.

But inside, the J-10C has major improvements - most notable an improved AESA radar, repacing the first generation one on the J-10B.
Additionally, the additional datalink antennae on the fusalage are said to be added for compatibility for the PL-15 long range BVRAAM.

ECM systems have been improved as well.

Engine wise, the AL-31FN it is powered with is the Series 3, with uprated thrust.


Generally, the J-10C has overtaken the B production and replaced it fully. The B/C difference should rather be compared with "block" instead of an actual variant.